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Who do you think is the first clean rider in the top 50?

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Re: Re:

Netserk said:
sniper said:
Escarabajo said:
There are probably some clean riders. Of course. I don't expect everybody to be dirty. Don't know how many and not even sure if there is one on that list.
Why not?
There are thousands of clean cyclists. But you expect the cheaters to surface in competition. Cheaters are a minority. The propeloton is a minority within that minority.
Pure logic and statistics don't leave many arguments for assuming there's a single clean rider in the proranks. Unless you don't believe in the power of doping of course.
Yes there might be one, but it's not to be *expected*, imo. Rather, it would be unexpected.
Given that there were clean pros back when they went faster, surely it's quite likely that there's also someone clean now?
Guys like Bassons were very much the exception, at the time he may have even been the only Div 1 pro who could make a stand like he did and not have past dirt come to the surface.

Bassons also had a very sparse palmares apart from a stage win from the break at the Dauphine. Speeds in races haven't dropped so much that he would suddenly be able to top 10 a GT.
 
Re: Re:

42x16ss said:
Netserk said:
sniper said:
Escarabajo said:
There are probably some clean riders. Of course. I don't expect everybody to be dirty. Don't know how many and not even sure if there is one on that list.
Why not?
There are thousands of clean cyclists. But you expect the cheaters to surface in competition. Cheaters are a minority. The propeloton is a minority within that minority.
Pure logic and statistics don't leave many arguments for assuming there's a single clean rider in the proranks. Unless you don't believe in the power of doping of course.
Yes there might be one, but it's not to be *expected*, imo. Rather, it would be unexpected.
Given that there were clean pros back when they went faster, surely it's quite likely that there's also someone clean now?
Guys like Bassons were very much the exception, at the time he may have even been the only Div 1 pro who could make a stand like he did and not have past dirt come to the surface.

Bassons also had a very sparse palmares apart from a stage win from the break at the Dauphine. Speeds in races haven't dropped so much that he would suddenly be able to top 10 a GT.
I don't think I have written that nor anything that could lead to that conclusion neither ;)
 
May 26, 2010
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I personally don't think WT teams would hire someone who wont dope.

If you have riders doping why then hire a rider who wont be a 'team' player?

I don't think there are any riders in WT that are clean. Why do teams have more than 1 doctor if riders are not doping? I mean saddle sores and similar things can be treated by a competent soigneur. Anything else your local GP can sort. Doctors on teams means doping.
 
Re:

Eyeballs Out said:
Prudhomme says cycling cleans now

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/prudhomme-believes-cycling-has-cleaned-up-its-act/

"You don't see champions who come from nowhere anymore. The likes of Nairo Quintana and Esteban Chaves have a pedigree, they shone on the Tour de l'Avenir. It's reassuring."

Which "champions who come from nowhere" in history could he be referring to ? Does he mean cycling is clean since Sept 2016 ?

This sport is one hell of a lot of fun. Where else do you get such comedy turns in the quiet times ? Prudhomme going down the "you can fool all of the people some of the time" - route. I am not sure that Quintana or Chaves have won the Tour Christian but let's have a look at who has and his pedigree. Oh wow look there is a guy called Chris Froome. Won it three times now and was the best in 2012, only his team management & team-mates put the kibosh on it. In mid-late 2011 he had achieved exactly what, before the Vuelta ? Even the best cycling manager there has ever been in the whole history of cycling, in fact possibly the best manager there has ever been in the whole history of sport, in any sport, was trying to palm this guy off onto a rival- "doing the poor guy a favour" no less !

Well what do you know ? Who'd have thunk it ! A guy with no pedigree is winning !

Christian even if we just go from 2006, we have a list of winners that is Perieiro, Contador, Schleck, Cadel, Wiggins Froome and Nibali and Nibali rides for a team that is possibly going to get its licence withdrawn. My money is not on a single one of that little list; even once the ones who have failed the low grade IQ test are stripped out.

Prudhomme comming to the rescue of Brad, with more BS and spin, now it looks like Brad is perhaps past the worst. Showing himself to be up there with the best of sports administration; "stuff the fans, who bring in the sponsors, who pay our wages - let's make some money quick, while we can".

Very funny indeed, you just can't make this stuff up.
 
May 26, 2010
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Re:

Nick C. said:
The Prudhomme quote was alarming, unless it is a passive aggressive call out of Froome and, based on road results, Wiggins.

You do have to wonder was it a shot across Sky's bows as a warning that they are taking the piss!!

Wiggins/Froome 2 riders who came from the grupetto to GT podiums late in life.
 
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Re: Re:

Freddythefrog said:
Eyeballs Out said:
Prudhomme says cycling cleans now

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/prudhomme-believes-cycling-has-cleaned-up-its-act/

"You don't see champions who come from nowhere anymore. The likes of Nairo Quintana and Esteban Chaves have a pedigree, they shone on the Tour de l'Avenir. It's reassuring."

Which "champions who come from nowhere" in history could he be referring to ? Does he mean cycling is clean since Sept 2016 ?

This sport is one hell of a lot of fun. Where else do you get such comedy turns in the quiet times ? Prudhomme going down the "you can fool all of the people some of the time" - route. I am not sure that Quintana or Chaves have won the Tour Christian but let's have a look at who has and his pedigree. Oh wow look there is a guy called Chris Froome. Won it three times now and was the best in 2012, only his team management & team-mates put the kibosh on it. In mid-late 2011 he had achieved exactly what, before the Vuelta ? Even the best cycling manager there has ever been in the whole history of cycling, in fact possibly the best manager there has ever been in the whole history of sport, in any sport, was trying to palm this guy off onto a rival- "doing the poor guy a favour" no less !

Well what do you know ? Who'd have thunk it ! A guy with no pedigree is winning !

Christian even if we just go from 2006, we have a list of winners that is Perieiro, Contador, Schleck, Cadel, Wiggins Froome and Nibali and Nibali rides for a team that is possibly going to get its licence withdrawn. My money is not on a single one of that little list; even once the ones who have failed the low grade IQ test are stripped out.

Prudhomme comming to the rescue of Brad, with more BS and spin, now it looks like Brad is perhaps past the worst. Showing himself to be up there with the best of sports administration; "stuff the fans, who bring in the sponsors, who pay our wages - let's make some money quick, while we can".

Very funny indeed, you just can't make this stuff up.

Is Prudhomme implying that he thinks Froome is doped? This doesn't make much sense to me unless he's either painfully oblivious or trying to take a jab at Froome/sky.
 
Re:

sniper said:
There are literally thousands of clean French riders, but also dozens of French dopers, who are always likely to get the better of those thousands of clean guys. The chances that Pinot is clean are very small.
Let's keep it real.
I realize that equals saying this thread is a hopeless exercise. And, indeed, it kind of is.
It's like asking: out of these fifty guys with a long white beard and a pointy hat, which one do you think is the real santa claus.

This is exactly it. We have absolutely no way of knowing who is clean. At best it's a semi-educated guess. I would lean toward anyone publishing power data, but even then, "clean" probably just means staying on the right side of the line, not training on bread and water. At this point I'd probably settle for "not being caught, not blowing your passport and not associated with known doping team or "trainer."
 

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