Will Astana Financial Collapse Lead To Armstrong Owning The Team?

[The GCW]

With Astana's financial woes getting worse and Armstrong stating He wants to become a team owner, is it just coincidence that these 2 things are happening at the same time?

Will Astana Financial Collapse Lead To Armstrong Owning The Team?

 

[Argon Man]

definately yes to both IMO.

 

[Trev_S]

Yep, I reckon so

 

[tashimi76]

Especially if is he's already been wining and dining prospective sponsors.

 

[tifosa]

The situation is this: any team associated in any way with Armstrong is owned by Armstrong. And I don't mean financially controlled.

 

[PuncturedTyre]

it was a done deal in January.

 

[hfer07]

With Astana's financial woes getting worse and Armstrong stating He wants to become a team owner, is it just coincidence that these 2 things are happening at the same time?

Will Astana Financial Collapse Lead To Armstrong Owning The Team?

this situation was already planned by LA & JB to have their own team-which will be something like Astana-Livestrong-SRAM-Trek at the beginning, just to retain the Pro-Continental licensing active, then it will be dropped afterward.
the real question is the AC factor--he'll depart before he becomes LA's puppet

 

[ukpaul]

Can a new team get a UCI licence that quickly and enter Pro Tour Events?
Looking at the way things are going Astana might not have a licence in a few weeks which would mean Armstong might not be able to ride the Tour or even finish the Giro.

 

[Mellow Velo]

It seems only one of their sponsors are fully paid up, but others have no intention of footing their part of the bill.
Result? $2 million debt owed to the UCI for the team "bond".

The UCI have given them one week, before they pull their racing licence, just about as the Giro hits it's first mountain finish.

Astana, as we know them, are gone.

What next?

First thing any new sponsor has to do, is pay off that debt, for nil return, as that money is owed to the riders etc, on their prospective roster.
Then, the UCI will have to go a "Uri Geller" on the rules, once again, if there is to be a "seamless" transition.

Question is: Will any new team be a $12 million dollar squad, or a $5 million dollar squad?
Not hard to figure what will follow, if it's the latter.....

 

[PuncturedTyre]

worth refreshing memories with this article on "team astana"

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/dec07/dec13news2

 

[ukpaul]

Do you think Armstong will foot the UCI bill?

 

[Mellow Velo]

Do you think Armstong will foot the UCI bill?

$2 million?
Well, he could simply hand over his giro appearance fee and clear the debt.
However, that's a lot of personal cash and therefore depends upon what LA aspire to, team wise.

Far cheaper to let them die and start a smaller, Continental outfit.
No bio passport costs, smaller roster etc.
Much more managible.

Comes down to what reliable sponsorship commitments he has lined up.

When you talk Astana, you are talking just about the most expensive team out there.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Can a new team get a UCI licence that quickly and enter Pro Tour Events?

Look no further than Astana themselves. After Liberty Seguros folded, Astana quickly stepped in with the money to keep the team afloat.

In 2003 Crest went from being in a bad financial situation, to bankrupting the owners and nearly bankrupting the entire parent sponsor, Bianchi stepped in and took over.

But Astana today is much bigger than either of those teams.

$2 million?
Well, he could simply hand over his giro appearance fee and clear the debt.
However, that's a lot of personal cash and therefore depends upon what LA aspire to, team wise.

He may be forced to look at this and ask himself "Is it worth $2 million to have a shot at the Tour this year?"

Far cheaper to let them die and start a smaller, Continental outfit.
No bio passport costs, smaller roster etc.
Much more managible.

Yes, but no Tour #8 that way. And Lance has shown in the past he won't try to win in Europe on a small team. It's on the biggest, most expensive team, or he's not going to try.

Comes down to what reliable sponsorship commitments he has lined up.

Entirely true, and this is where I think people are a little mistaken perhaps in all the talk that Nike, Trek, SRAM or Amgen will jump in. Nike just went through a large round of layoffs and cuts. Trek's sales are off. SRAM just about pulled out of Gila due to a lack of funds, and Amgen already supports a race that is successful.

We're in a severe global recession, and Lance will be asking for advertising dollars for a sport that's viewed as being tainted and tarnished with doping. And he'll be asking for what is probably the most amount of money ever spent on a cycling team in history.

The real question is going to be just what can Lance do under the table to insure that Astana will be able to ride the Giro and the Tour. We know the UCI is corrupt and Lance has a win at all cost attitude, rules be damned. So I expect them to be there one way or the other, and pretty likely they'll be wearing Astana jerseys in the Giro and Livestrong jerseys in the Tour with Lance putting a positive spin on all of it.

 

[craig1985]

So if Astana go under, where will the guys like Alberto Contador go to? There is one obvious team, especially if Alejandro Valverde is on a nice two year holiday, but assuming he isn't (I think he will be banned myself), what team could afford Contador's wages?

I know he (Contador) can technically ride for Euskatel-Euskadi (he rode for Iberdrola before he turned pro and they were/are based in the Basque Country, so he counts), but they can barely afford to keep Samuel Sanchez on the books as it is, let alone Sanchez and Contador.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

To tell the honest truth, though I'd rather see Lance get dropped on every climb at the Giro and the Tour, I wouldn't be that sad to see Astana go under and leave him and the rest of his team on the roadside, even if it kicked aside a few riders I like.

I'm sick of Lance, sick of his comeback, sick of Johan, and think the sport was moving forward just fine without Lance showing up and taking us back a few years to a time in the sport's history I'd like to forget.

 

[Anonymous]

ok.. firstly.. the pro tour licence is not an issue, its held by JB not astana

secondly, the 2 million isnt a debt, its an amount they have to keep untouched in the bank at all times to guarantee money available for the team so the team is not running with zero bankroll... so whoever coughs up two million is not paying a debt.. they are purely putting some money in a bank account... (and probably taking court action to reclaim it from the various people who have spent it)..

in my mind, no doubts at all that someone will step in.. wonder if micheal ball has a spare 2 mill.. lol... (lances and JB's twitters are remarkably quiet as well)

 

[PuncturedTyre]

Olympus sarl - which is the company that "owns" the Astana team,
is a Luxembourg registered co, and as such, i do not think they are obliged to file public records, or if they do, they will be sufficiently crafted to ensure they divulge very little.

Bruyneel is no fool with finances - he has run teams with rigid rules, and is far from in poverty. He takes advantage of his ability to dictate, and the riders/staff reliance on him, to ensure they retain places in a team.

Astana was born from the ashes of a disastrous association, Biver/Rominger/Vino/ see ref to old cyclingnews articles re the "financial rescue package and the reaction when sponsors ran short the first time.

Then they encountered Bruyneel.

He knows more than most, how to influence riders, when dollars are tight.
At this stage of the season, a financial recession, he can ensure they stay on a reduced salary, or leave them hanging on long enough in that they then have little option to take what is offered, if at all (ref salvodelli negotiations with bruyneel) so even if contador has the balls to jump ship (on the pretext of non performance of a financial contract * asuming he has not been paid) then, he will go to escape, not for funds elsewhere.

In the "big" picture, for him as a rider, that would be the best option.

Bruyneel knows what he is doing, as does LA.

 

[2wheels]

Call me a cynic-- but I'm guessing there's still plenty of time between now and July for a rich Texan to acquire a controlling financial interest in Astana, maybe even rename the team, and give poor old Contador a couple of new options: ride support in the Tour, or else vie for GC honors in the Tour of East Podunk.

 

[pmcg76]

I remember reading an interview with Lance, not long after he announced his comeback in which he stated that he would love to have his own 14-15$ million team so no surprises if he takes over but he still needs a sponsor. I think he would consider covering the team for the Tour with Livestrong as title sponsor to tie in the cancer link, but not long term.

You can bet one thing, the Kazaks and lowly Euros will be the first to get the chop. I just hope that Alberto is already negotiating with another team for the Tour, he is odd man out at Astana and it would make the Tour more interesting if he was on another team.

 

[franciep10]

I'll say this again Lance and JB take over the team thaey Get rid of the Kazakh riders they don't want also probably also Kloden and then they infuse the Trek Livestrong u 23 team into whatever they want to call the new team. Frankly I don't want to see the tam disband I mean I don't like Lance but I like to see the team race and anyway they make the race exciting as they are the yankees of cycling and every team wants to go as hard as they can against them so they can prove themselves look at Zajicek he's won stages before but that win was probably the highlight of his career, so he can have his grandkids later on and say I beat LA. While i'm not a supporter of their team they make things exciting because people want to see them lose, only thing is they disappoint people alot.

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

In 2003 Crest went from being in a bad financial situation, to bankrupting the owners and nearly bankrupting the entire parent sponsor, Bianchi stepped in and took over.

I think you mean Coast, not Crest.

 

[Mellow Velo]

ok.. firstly.. the pro tour licence is not an issue, its held by JB not astana

secondly, the 2 million isnt a debt, its an amount they have to keep untouched in the bank at all times to guarantee money available for the team so the team is not running with zero bankroll... so whoever coughs up two million is not paying a debt..

Can you post a link that states that JB holds the licence?
I'm pretty sure that is not the case.


New team
The new Astana management initially tried to buy the ProTour licence of the former Liberty Seguros-Würth team, held by Manolo Saiz. However, Saiz was reluctant to sell, so Astana applied for a licence in their own right. Initially, the new team was based in Switzerland under the holding company of Zeus Sarl and managed by former Tour de Suisse organiser Marc Biver. Vinokourov was the team's debut leader.

The UCI ProTour license commission first informed Astana that they would not be granted a ProTour License for the 2007 season. Following UCI's decision not to grant a ProTour license, the organizers of the three Grand Tours informed Astana Team that they would be included, regardless of ProTour license status. On December 20, 2006 the UCI License Commission relented and awarded Astana Team a 4-year ProTour license.

JB's PT licence went when Disco folded and replacement sponsor wasn't forthcoming.

As for the $2 mill, If someone has to supply a new bond, they still have to stump up this cash before they can get underway, no?
Sounds very much like a debt to me.
Of course, they can all hang around, waiting for a legal resolution.....


Vino has now spoken.
I can't help but feel there have be clandestine meetings for months, regarding his early return. The UCI don't want to budge, so the Kazakh's pull the plug.

 

[franciep10]

Can you post a link that states that JB holds the licence?
I'm pretty sure that is not the case.


New team
The new Astana management initially tried to buy the ProTour licence of the former Liberty Seguros-Würth team, held by Manolo Saiz. However, Saiz was reluctant to sell, so Astana applied for a licence in their own right. Initially, the new team was based in Switzerland under the holding company of Zeus Sarl and managed by former Tour de Suisse organiser Marc Biver. Vinokourov was the team's debut leader.

The UCI ProTour license commission first informed Astana that they would not be granted a ProTour License for the 2007 season. Following UCI's decision not to grant a ProTour license, the organizers of the three Grand Tours informed Astana Team that they would be included, regardless of ProTour license status. On December 20, 2006 the UCI License Commission relented and awarded Astana Team a 4-year ProTour license.

JB's PT licence went when Disco folded and replacement sponsor wasn't forthcoming.

As for the $2 mill, If someone has to supply a new bond, they still have to stump up this cash before they can get underway, no?
Sounds very much like a debt to me.
Of course, they can all hang around, waiting for a legal resolution.....


Vino has now spoken.
I can't help but feel there have be clandestine meetings for months, regarding his early return. The UCI don't want to budge, so the Kazakh's pull the plug.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2009/may09/may06news


5th paragraph

 

[clydesdale]

worth refreshing memories with this article on "team astana"

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/dec07/dec13news2

I, for one, am excited about Vino's memoirs. Even if he just makes crap up, it should be a fun read.

 

[COLIN LAING]

New team

In my humble opinion, if L.A and J.B take over the team, Contador will be forced to leave and in his very next race will join the ranks of Landis, Herras, Hamilton et al and be found positive for some obscure doping that he didn't even realise was happening ,,,as the saying goes C'est la Vie.