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Will Lance or the Hog take Contador down with him?

May 14, 2009
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We've already seen some posturing by Lance to say that he was just a rider on U.S. Postal. This seems to be setting up the Hog to take the fall (or at least the biggest fall) in Novitzky's investigation.

If the doping program was as much Bruyneel's as Armstrongs, we can expect that he carried it over with Contador at Discovery and then Astana. Clearly, then, he's got the goods on Contador, to the extent that such goods exist.

Although Novitzky's investigation does not focus on the Discovery Channel years, I have to believe he'll ask about Contador at some point in some tangential way.

I'm not sure about the Hog, but Lance sure has motivation to take Contador down. Not only does Alberto threaten his record of seven tours, he doesn't like the guy.

This will be interesting for sure.
 
Apr 19, 2009
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Why would the US FDA even care about Contador? The short story is did any of the owners of US Postal know that the money was being used for funding doping; not employees, owners?

I think if you look at it the Hog, Armstrong, and others will prove that they were just employees. Even Armstrong's testimony in the one case saying he thinks he was part owner will be proven to show that he wasn't at the time. They are all going down that path and there fore the case will dry up.

As for the doping allegations; this will do nothing to get his 7 wins over turned as there was no positive. Unless there is a confession or a proven test that shows Armstrong as positive then they won't be taken away.


Besides the Spanish have already proven time and time again after Puerto that they don't care about doping.
 
I don't think they'll go out of their way to bring Contador down. We're talking of Mr and Mrs Omerta here. However, there's a chance the investigation will bring him down even if LA and JB don't do anything. Personally I think that would be a good thing, if Contador is guilty.
 
I have to agree on all counts. US authorities don't care about Contador because they cannot touch him (e.g. bring him under investigation).

As for ASO stripping Lance of his Tour victories? I also agree that will not happen. A precidence has already been set in the case of Bjarne Riis, who admitted to doping during his 1996 Tour GC victory. The ASO did not strip Bjarne of that victory. If the ASO is consistent, they will not strip Armstrong of his victories either.
 
It's not necessarily about the authorities though, it depends on Armstrong. What kind of convict will he be? Will he remain silent on all details other than those the Feds ask about? Or will he squeal like a pig and bring the whole lot down through books and Oprah interviews? Given that he's clearly a spiteful brat, and is already trying to push "friends" and associates under various buses, I'm leaning towards the latter. Not to mention that if he paints it as though "everyone was doing it", he may think it will soften his fall a little.
 
Nov 24, 2009
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on3m@n@rmy said:
I have to agree on all counts. US authorities don't care about Contador because they cannot touch him (e.g. bring him under investigation).

As for ASO stripping Lance of his Tour victories? I also agree that will not happen. A precidence has already been set in the case of Bjarne Riis, who admitted to doping during his 1996 Tour GC victory. The ASO did not strip Bjarne of that victory. If the ASO is consistent, they will not strip Armstrong of his victories either.

They could not strip Bjarne Riis victory because of the 8 year statue of limitations on sporting decisions. At the moment Armstrong's 2003, 2004 and 2005 victories are under threat. And if it goes RICO, well, then there is not statue.

But it looks like there will be some *'s handed out, just like Bjarne got, even if his title wasn't stripped
 
Nov 17, 2009
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Big GMaC said:
They could not strip Bjarne Riis victory because of the 8 year statue of limitations on sporting decisions. At the moment Armstrong's 2003, 2004 and 2005 victories are under threat. And if it goes RICO, well, then there is not statue.

But it looks like there will be some *'s handed out, just like Bjarne got, even if his title wasn't stripped

RICO is a matter of US law. Why would it have anything to do with ASO's decisions on sports results?
 
Jul 17, 2010
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So much supposition. Landis wants to prove he was a victim of a corrupt team and get some kind of closure for himself.

What it all boils down to is that almost everyone was on something and it was out of control until 2-3 years ago. They will mostly deny it unless forced to tell the truth by overwhelming evidence or a sudden guilty conscience.

Recent races and results point to a cleaner peloton where riders no longer look super human and can no longer make their closest rivals look like they are cycling through peanut butter. The Shack's performance this year would suggest that whatever program they may have been on before has been stopped.

To relish the thought of it involving Contador just takes you back into the tit-for-tat game of hoping the current champ gets knocked off his pedestal so the good guy behind him wins. Except the good guy behind him was part of the CSC team that were under strong suspicion for widespread blood doping around the same time (2-3 years ago)- remember Frank paying Doctor Fuentes, remember Cancellara dropping world class climbers on alp d´huez or Andy climbing so easily and looking around him as he if was just a spectator in the race. And so it goes on and down the same old spiral ad infinitum.

The sport is cleaning up, move on and embrace the future.
 
Train in Spain said:
So much supposition. Landis wants to prove he was a victim of a corrupt team and get some kind of closure for himself.

What it all boils down to is that almost everyone was on something and it was out of control until 2-3 years ago. They will mostly deny it unless forced to tell the truth by overwhelming evidence or a sudden guilty conscience.

Recent races and results point to a cleaner peloton where riders no longer look super human and can no longer make their closest rivals look like they are cycling through peanut butter. The Shack's performance this year would suggest that whatever program they may have been on before has been stopped.

To relish the thought of it involving Contador just takes you back into the tit-for-tat game of hoping the current champ gets knocked off his pedestal so the good guy behind him wins. Except the good guy behind him was part of the CSC team that were under strong suspicion for widespread blood doping around the same time (2-3 years ago)- remember Frank paying Doctor Fuentes, remember Cancellara dropping world class climbers on alp d´huez or Andy climbing so easily and looking around him as he if was just a spectator in the race. And so it goes on and down the same old spiral ad infinitum.

The sport is cleaning up, move on and embrace the future.
I don't want the current champ to be guilty, but if he is I do want him to go down, like everyone else. We either want a clean sport, or we don't.
 

Comeback 2011

BANNED
Jul 23, 2010
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Maybe this is why Contador goes out of his way not to get involved in any argument with Armstrong and is now praising him for being a great champ in his day.

But somehow I doubt Armstrong will bring anybody down with him. I don't think he operates like that.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Omerta asside if the Hog rats out Contador he will most likely have to move out of Madrid as well, I doubt he will live in peace after it.
 
May 14, 2009
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Like I said in my original post, I certainly don't expect Novitzky to target Contador. But it's not outside the realm of possibility that he asks Lance or the Hog about this. And it's not uncommon for grand jury testimony to be leaked. (Something to look forward to!)

I get that these guys are all about omerta -- but will they be when it stops working? At that point I can see one or both of them turning on the sport, and you've got to believe Alberto would be near the top of their list. Especially Lance's.
 
Dec 29, 2009
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Comeback 2011 said:
Maybe this is why Contador goes out of his way not to get involved in any argument with Armstrong and is now praising him for being a great champ in his day.

But somehow I doubt Armstrong will bring anybody down with him. I don't think he operates like that.

he would do so through a surrogate in a heartbeat.

erader
 
Jul 22, 2009
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euphrades said:
Why would the US FDA even care about Contador? The short story is did any of the owners of US Postal know that the money was being used for funding doping; not employees, owners?

I think if you look at it the Hog, Armstrong, and others will prove that they were just employees. Even Armstrong's testimony in the one case saying he thinks he was part owner will be proven to show that he wasn't at the time. They are all going down that path and there fore the case will dry up.

As for the doping allegations; this will do nothing to get his 7 wins over turned as there was no positive. Unless there is a confession or a proven test that shows Armstrong as positive then they won't be taken away.


Besides the Spanish have already proven time and time again after Puerto that they don't care about doping.

But..... I thought Floyd and Lemond wanted to clean cycling up. Shouldn't there be an outrage from them if interpol doesn't cast a larger net??
 
May 26, 2010
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Train in Spain said:
....

The sport is cleaning up, move on and embrace the future.

how is that possible when the Director Sportifs that oversaw the EPO years are still in charge of pro teams. What evidence do you have that it is cleaning up. We have a corrupt UCI that declared there would be no positives at this years TdF, they dont know when it received a 'donation' from Armstrong or how much it was and have yet to produce documantary evidence of how much and what they did with it?

The ASO let radioshack race this year with all these allegations yet prevented Astana from riding for similar?

Clean as a sewer if you ask me, they have merely covered the sewer with a cloak of velvet, but it still smells to me.
 
May 26, 2010
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Bruyneel will not rat anyone out. he lives by the omerta. if LA tries to blame Hog for everything, Hog will simply deny it and distance himself from LA, with the help of the ASO, UCI and pro cycling in europe. if he does not receive 'behind door' backing from them, well maybe as a last resort he may 'spit in the soup' knowing that he is not allowed to sit at the table ever again. but i cannot see that happening to Hog.

It will take a lot to get LA to admit to everything that is being directed at him. his ego will not allow him tell the truth and he probably has millions stashed in Swiss accounts so wont need to do a Landis as he will not hit rockbottom. His sponors are likely gonna stand by him depending on the outcome and LAs attitude as they know how to rebuild myths like the Woods affairs, but if LA gets nuked that he did dope, well it is hard to see how nikie, giro, nissian, twek et al can still support a proven cheater, so it all depends.

Of course i hope he gets nuked, because he deserves no less. i find it interesting that cycling still likes the guy. I reckon if he stopped the TdF wins at number 5 and went to ride other GTs and Palmares he would have been the living god in cycling because he would have shown huge respect to Merckx, Hinault, Anqeutil etc and for lots in cycling that is important.

Lucine Van Impe thought that Virenque winning more than 6 KOM jerseys was disrespectful to the 'Eagle of Toledo' Federico Martin Bahamontes, so this shows you how legends are felt about in cycling.
 
Aug 6, 2009
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scribe said:
But..... I thought Floyd and Lemond wanted to clean cycling up. Shouldn't there be an outrage from them if interpol doesn't cast a larger net??

No there shouldn't because Intepol doesn't cast nets. Interpol don't even own nets. Interpol is a liason organisations for different countries police forces not a real police force on it's own right. The FDA will cast however wide a net they want and that they think their jurisdiction will support which I doubt it going to include Contador. It's possible that some of the evidence from the US investigation could be used in other countries investigation or in a UCI or WADA investigation, but at no point, past present or future will there be any Interpol investigation.
 
Jun 19, 2009
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Selling out Contador wouldn't help Armstrong in the court he values most: the court of public opinion and would further discredit his own legacy. He still contends he helped Alberto win the last Tour in spite of himself. k

Bruyneel will not involve anyone in the USADA investigation that doesn't help him escape charges in that venue as several have pointed out. USADA and Novitsky are concerned primarily with fraud and distribution of regulated substances and this is the basis for other crimes of value to Novitsky. He is working towards something bigger, perhaps.

That something bigger may be USOC, IOC or the like and if it implicates the UCI and gets another investigation going; that is where Contador and other riders become vulnerable. Then it would be a matter of what Bruyneel could be prosecuted on criminally or damaged civilly that would compel him to involve others. It would be about money (legal fees and damages).
 
Jul 1, 2010
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Don't know if I am being naive or not but Lemonds article this article this morning in CN, clearly states that the data from both AC and AS w ere not doping. That both of their wattage on the climbs was normal for non doping values....