Worst crash ever

Jun 20, 2010
259
0
0
EDIT: Please note: the purpose of this thread is to discuss the massive high speed pile up in stage 6 in the 2012 TdF. This purpose is not to discuss which horribe accident was the worst. Maybe the editors could change the title to 2012 Tour de France stage 6 crash.EDIT finish


The Tour de France stage 6 crash (middle of the peloton, tailwind, downhill, 80 kmph) is probably the worst ever :(

Below from http://www.ekstrabladet.dk a list of the damages of the riders that were forced to leave the race. Some of the most hurt riders are said to have made it to the finish line before leaving the race.

Maarten Wynants, Rabobank: Punctured lung and two broken ribs

Wout Poels, Vacansoleil-DCM: Ruptured spleen and kidney, three broken ribs

Thomas Danielson, Garmin-Sharp: Dislocated shoulder (twice in two consecutive stages)

Astarloza, Euskaltel - Euskadi: right elbow dislocated

Amets Txurruka, Euskaltel - Euskadi: Broken collarbone

Oscar Freire, Katusha: Broken rib, punctured lung

Davide Viganò, Lampre-ISD: Broken shoulder

Hubert Dupont, AG2R-La Mondiale: Broken wrist, broken vertebra, strained ankle

Imanol Erviti, Movistar: Deep wound in right leg (muscle damage, needs surgery)

Jose Ivan Gutierrez, Movistar: Damaged knee

Theese are truly high velocity damages that without urgent diagnosis and care could have cost lives.

On the positive side: ****Helmets work!!!**** No brain injuries in this crash.
 
There are always long lists of injuries after mass pileups. The Vuelta trainwreck in Liège in 2009, for example.

However, this is a long way from being the worst crash ever. Some of the worst crashes ever involved just one rider on their own.
 
Sep 8, 2009
15,305
0
0
Libertine Seguros said:
There are always long lists of injuries after mass pileups. The Vuelta trainwreck in Liège in 2009, for example.

However, this is a long way from being the worst crash ever. Some of the worst crashes ever involved just one rider on their own.
absolutely

still does anyone remember a single crash with the aftermath,11 abandons?and many more injured of course
it will be remembered as a massacre this one.
 
Apr 23, 2011
22
0
0
Seems like you can add Hesjedal and Hunter to that list now - though Hunter has been tumbling all around the place prior to that.

As for the helmets working: thank goodness for that, though reportedly, Danielson also suffered an injury to the skull.

Also, great respect for Vansummeren, determined to cross the line looking bloodied and raffled as though he'd just driven across a minefield and managing to hit every one of them.
 
jens_attacks said:
still does anyone remember a single crash with the aftermath,11 abandons?and many more injured of course
it will be remembered as a massacre this one.
11 abandons?? :eek: And I thought last year's stage 9 pileup with four abandons was bad!

But we seem to have reached the point where for some teams it's easier to state who isn't injured...
 
Jun 1, 2011
2,500
0
0
jens_attacks said:
absolutely

still does anyone remember a single crash with the aftermath,11 abandons?and many more injured of course
it will be remembered as a massacre this one.
It's a mystery crash as I've seen know footage from the helos, but I guess that it would be wheel touching wheel. On the downhill, very fast. At first, you had no idea of the carnage. Among the worst for sure.
 
Jan 16, 2012
7
0
0
BillytheKid said:
It's a mystery crash as I've seen know footage from the helos, but I guess that it would be wheel touching wheel. On the downhill, very fast. At first, you had no idea of the carnage. Among the worst for sure.
From CN's 'Fractures, Bruises and Bumps: A strage six injury report':
Lampre's Danilo Hondo accounted for what brought Vigano and Scarponi down. "Viganò was putting [Alessandro] Petacchi's shoe covers in his jersey, when some riders ahead slowed down. Davide had only one hand on the handlebar, so he could not brake properly and he fell in the ditch on the side of the road, then all the rest of the group crashed, Scarponi too."

Looks like that's what caused the whole thing.
 
Apr 11, 2009
2,250
0
0
This whole sport is becoming pretty ridiculous. There's no justification for injuries like this. In future, I refuse to watch the the first week of the Tour.

Riders are too ambitious, there's too much stress on winning by everybody, and this business about everybody having to be at the front is causing it. Just like someone yelling fire in a cinema when there is no fire, and knowing that there's one exit. It's self-induced carnage where the the incentives as a whole in the peloton are "peverse" (producing the problems).

Danielson is in "pretty good" shape compared to some of the really seriously injured and yet he looks like this, a soldier off a World War I battlefield, complete with a battlefield helmet and muddied face. These guys are in far worse shape than the nut jobs competing in Ultimate Fighting. This situation with the Tour is ridiculous. The people and teams and institutions in this sport increasingly look lilke nut jobs. Sorry to say this.

As Voigt says in his blog, folks are crashing in the neutral zone, the feed zone, and straight roads. Something's wrong here.

http://bicycling.com/blogs/hardlyserious/2012/07/06/stop-the-insanity/



We then get this pretentious statement by Slipstream:

Jonathan Vaughters, CEO, Director Sportif

"Clearly, this will mean a change in strategy for the team."

[Yeah, right, onwards and upwards to bigger and better things in the pursuit of glory on two wheels. These folks are like a bunch of friggin rotating doorknobs.]

"We’ll be looking for stage wins, possibly the KOM jersey and ways to animate the race. It was a tough day but all things considered, spirits are good. These guys are good friends and a good support system for each other, they know how to be a team and that makes me immensely proud. Zabriskie had a great ride today, and I’m proud of how all the guys rode. Just crossing the line after a day like this speaks volumes. Tomorrow is going to be painful for many of them, so starting alone will be a big step but this is the Tour de France, and we go onward and set new goals. There's a lot of racing still to be done."

Sorry to say this, but the folks in this "industry" are not quite connected with reality.
 
Dec 27, 2010
6,674
0
0
Am I the only one who thinks a Worst crash ever thread is incredibly insensitive? Kivilev, Casartelli, Galvez, Weylandt - are we supposed to be deciding which was worse??
 
Parrot23 said:
This whole sport is becoming pretty ridiculous. There's no justification for injuries like this. In future, I refuse to watch the the first week of the Tour.

Riders are too ambitious, there's too much stress on winning by everybody, and this business about everybody having to be at the front is causing it. Just like someone yelling fire in a cinema when there is no fire, and knowing that there's one exit. It's self-induced carnage where the the incentives as a whole in the peloton are "peverse" (producing the problems).
Part of it's to do with the rankings and the UCI points though. Now, 10th place is something worth protecting. Riders who have no chance of making it to the podium are putting protection up there to make sure they still have a chance to finish 8th if others crash out. The 'fringe' contenders still have a lot to protect, and a lot of pressure from their teams to hold on to it as well.
 
Quote from today's live update:

Gorka Verdugo of Euskaltel has joined Farrar back amongst the team cars. We are actually surprised to see Verdugo in the race today. He was involved in yesterday's crash and said to have a gash in his leg so deep that the bone was visible
:eek:

---

But yeah. I agree about the thread title... maybe something like Worst Crash Without Fatalties would be better.
 
It's definitely one of the stupidest. There wasn't even a competitive breakaway to make the group go fast or take risks. I may not be the most impartial, but I blame DSes using race radio to order their riders to the front of the peloton. For me team usage of race radio makes the racing less rather than more safe. I doubt the teams would be so jittery without their bosses fuelling this self fulfilling madness of getting to the front to "keep safe". Get rid!

Gutted that so many riders who could compete for a top five have seen their ambitions go up in smoke and that the green jersey contest, like the yellow, is now pretty much a two horse race. What a waste.
 
Jun 20, 2010
259
0
0
The purpose of this thread is not to determine which crash is the worst. Please note that the title does not feature a questionmark. I chose the title, because the crash yesterday was the worst high speed pile up i ever have seen. I apology, if the title has caused confusion.

The purpose of this thread is to discuss the crash yesterday, its conseqences for the race, teams and individual cyclists, and possible ways of making the race safer.

Downhill mountain bikers travel at lower speeds than these tdf cyclists, yet wear lots of protective equipment. A few years ago, pro cyclist would protest against wearing helmets. Today, I think they will protest, if someone asks them to stop wearing the helmets.

One could imagine, that some sort of protection gear, of standsrdized weight, could become compulsory in the future.

Why dont racers use stuff like that when eg. Training downhills (the Schlecks could benefit during training.
 
Jun 20, 2010
259
0
0
Fergoose said:
It's definitely one of the stupidest. There wasn't even a competitive breakaway to make the group go fast or take risks. I may not be the most impartial, but I blame DSes using race radio to order their riders to the front of the peloton. For me team usage of race radio makes the racing less rather than more safe. I doubt the teams would be so jittery without their bosses fuelling this self fulfilling madness of getting to the front to "keep safe". Get rid!

Gutted that so many riders who could compete for a top five have seen their ambitions go up in smoke and that the green jersey contest, like the yellow, is now pretty much a two horse race. What a waste.
Definitely, the radio orders could factor in.
 
This crash seems to have had the broadest impact (most riders injured or taken out) ever in a TdF.

I agree with others, it's not the "worst" crash ever, but it was quite dramatic and it might be one of the biggest crashes ever.

High speed mass pile up ... not even in my nightmares do I think of that stuff. It's amazing the risks we take ... I guess in some ways I am surprised it has not happened before.
 
ulrikmm said:
The purpose of this thread is not to determine which crash is the worst. Please note that the title does not feature a questionmark. I chose the title, because the crash yesterday was the worst high speed pile up i ever have seen. I apology, if the title has caused confusion.

The purpose of this thread is to discuss the crash yesterday, its conseqences for the race, teams and individual cyclists, and possible ways of making the race safer.

Downhill mountain bikers travel at lower speeds than these tdf cyclists, yet wear lots of protective equipment. A few years ago, pro cyclist would protest against wearing helmets. Today, I think they will protest, if someone asks them to stop wearing the helmets.

One could imagine, that some sort of protection gear, of standsrdized weight, could become compulsory in the future.

Why dont racers use stuff like that when eg. Training downhills (the Schlecks could benefit during training.
Saddly I think there will always be more crashes early in the TdF. However, I think route planning makes a significant difference. Flat, windy profiles result in high speeds and people get tired ... then stupid things happen.

Perhaps they should shrink the teams to 6 riders instead of 9. Cuts the peloton by a third (one problem is simply the large number of riders) and forces a team to be even more selective of who they bring.
 
Fergoose said:
It's definitely one of the stupidest. There wasn't even a competitive breakaway to make the group go fast or take risks. I may not be the most impartial, but I blame DSes using race radio to order their riders to the front of the peloton. For me team usage of race radio makes the racing less rather than more safe. I doubt the teams would be so jittery without their bosses fuelling this self fulfilling madness of getting to the front to "keep safe". Get rid!

Gutted that so many riders who could compete for a top five have seen their ambitions go up in smoke and that the green jersey contest, like the yellow, is now pretty much a two horse race. What a waste.
At the same time, without race radios, you get a situation like Rubén Plaza's last year, when he was part of a big crash on a descent and wound up falling down part of a mountainside and shearing his leg half off. That could happen anytime, but he was screaming for help and nobody could hear him with the commotion around. Bjarne Riis spotted him but wasn't able to stop and was having to scrabble around his mechanics and the commissaires to get a telephone number for Movistar so they could get to their stricken rider.
 
RedheadDane said:
Quote from today's live update:

Gorka Verdugo of Euskaltel has joined Farrar back amongst the team cars. We are actually surprised to see Verdugo in the race today. He was involved in yesterday's crash and said to have a gash in his leg so deep that the bone was visible
:eek:

---

But yeah. I agree about the thread title... maybe something like Worst Crash Without Fatalties would be better.
Agree.

Gorka must be related to Hoogerland, no? ;) (nuts of steel.) At least Hoogie is just having bike troubles on today's stage, and there were no fatalities in this crash.
 
Libertine Seguros said:
At the same time, without race radios, you get a situation like Rubén Plaza's last year, when he was part of a big crash on a descent and wound up falling down part of a mountainside and shearing his leg half off. That could happen anytime, but he was screaming for help and nobody could hear him with the commotion around. Bjarne Riis spotted him but wasn't able to stop and was having to scrabble around his mechanics and the commissaires to get a telephone number for Movistar so they could get to their stricken rider.
For sure. But that isn't in any way a requirement for team input into race radio. A race radio with only neutral safety/repairs/medical personel on the other side would be just as good. I'm not trying to be dramatic, but the excessive and inappropriate use of team orders on race radio appears to be 100% manufacturing some of the crashes and is therefore creating situations that endanger the safety of riders and public alike. Setting aside entertainment, if DSes don't find a bit of nous and maturity quickly, that situation can't go on.

I'd missed (honest) the story where Voeckler was sharing my hunch, but he sounds as bitter as I do about radios (unsurprising being a breakaway rider) so it's not exactly evidence that radios were culpable.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/voeckler-blames-radio-earpieces-for-metz-crash

I'm sure in one of the TdF crashes last year the radio was implicated though. Hopefully all good evidence for when the UCI and Teams have another ding-d0ng over this issue at the end of the year.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY