11 major teams considering plans to break away from the UCI

[Rocksteady]

I'm surprised there hasn't been any speculation as to which 11 teams would break away. The new organization would be much more legit if it had the biggest names for each of the cycling disicplines. Would P-R and Flanders deal more if they lost Boonen and Canc?? I think so...

Teams I think are for sure on the list:
Garmin - obviously
The Shack
HTC
Leopard

Not so sure about:
Quickstep
BMC
Sky
Liquigas
FDJ??

Other thoughts?

 

[michaeld]

You can split the list up into 'Those who have something to win' and 'Those who have something to lose'.

Shack, Saxo, might be risking losing something. FDJ, Europcar, Geox, can only win by risking this.

 

[Archibald]

I think something needs to change because as others have said the big thing the UCI lacks is consistency.

If you are a manager looking for sponsors the conversation currently goes like this:

Sponsor: What races yield the most exposure for our brand
Manager: Races X, Y and Z
Sponsor: So how do we get to ride those races
Manager: Well you get onto this system called Pro-Continental and if you are good enough will get into the the Pro-Tour which means you might get to ride those races.
Sponsor: So how do they select who goes into the Pro-Tour
Manager: Nobody knows.
Sponsor: And if we actually got into the Pro-Tour that guarantees our guys a ride in races X, Y and Z?
Manager: Well not exactly, its a bit of a lottery really after that with no guarantees whatsoever and no concrete set of rules for us to get an invite.
Sponsor: So let me get this straight you are asking me to shell out a shed load investment into something that has no set of rules by which I can get a return.
Manager: Pretty much.............yes.

been wondering all along what the sponsors must be thinking of all this.
Any wonder that Saxo wanted to pull out last year... Caisse?

And Hog's example of FDJ just shows them more stupidity and reason not to get involved...

Radioshack must be a little miffed that their main draw card both failed, then went home crying to mummy...

Maybe the best person to replace McQuaid is John Cleese

 

[Ferminal]

VN: I presume it would also do the same for the world championships, given that it is a UCI race?

PMQ: Absolutely, yes. Plus any UCI event.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7...eagues-Grand-Tours-and-the-Olympic-Games.aspx

 

[thehog]

You may not know Test Cricket but it was dying in the late 70’s early 80’s. Dead. The governing bodies did not want to change the game. They wanted to keep it as it was. Then came along Kerry Packer. An Australian. He started buying players and created his own rebel World Series Cricket leuage. It became a one day game and it was day night. People could go to the games after work or watch it on a bar or at home on TV. Out went the white uniforms and in came colour outfits to represent each country. It was loud trashy and in your face but by god cricket become big. Massive.

The UCI is representing the purist perspective. When you let "purists" dominate then you pretty much fall out of step the demands of the mainstream. The same applies to "radicals" who turn sport into contrived made for TV spectacles.

Purists just don't get it. The use of radios in just about any sport is almost always unpopular with purists. They don't like it in motor racing (it makes the driver into a robot), not in Football (makes the QB into a robot) and in cycling it makes riders into robots and they break has no chance which is utter nonsense. I can't drive a car like Lewis Hamilton, I can't play Football like Tom Brady and I sure as hell can't sprint like Mark Cavendish. Put a radio in my ear and I still won't be able to do any of those things.

Of all of the team sports out there, cycling is the one sport left where the TV experience could be revolutionized by technology.

Just look at what is happening in America with football and baseball. Football has embraced technology and it is absolutely crushing every other sport here. Baseball, which dominated by purists is just now figuring this out and many think it has lost its place for good.

 

[JA.Tri]

Having a benevolent dictator (like Bernie Ecclestone) ....

OT...sorry. A benevolent dictator would be ok, however in no way do I categorize Bernie as a B.D. No wuckin fay.

 

[Mellow Velo]

You may not know Test Cricket but it was dying in the late 70’s early 80’s. Dead. The governing bodies did not want to change the game. They wanted to keep it as it was. Then came along Kerry Packer. An Australian. He started buying players and created his own rebel World Series Cricket leuage. It became a one day game and it was day night. People could go to the games after work or watch it on a bar or at home on TV. Out went the white uniforms and in came colour outfits to represent each country. It was loud trashy and in your face but by god cricket become big. Massive.

Well, there you have it. Proof positive that JV isn't up to the task.
He's gone from loud, trashy tricolour argyle kit, to dull men in black.
If only it were that simple.

Bottom line is we a list of changes/gimmicks to the "package", but no mention of any innovation that has the potential to make the actual racing more exciting. (technology ain't gonna cut it)

For that, we come back to the UCI and the radio ban.

 

[Scansorial]

What makes the World Championships the World Championships, though? If all the best riders agree to show up at a race and treat it like the Worlds, wouldn't it become the Worlds? If the TdF/Giro/etc. are all on board, they can even let the winner wear a modified rainbow jersey.

 

[Polish]

Breaking apart from the UCI would mean breaking apart from the UCI Bio-Passport Program I presume.

Maybe the recent CAS ruling against Pellizotti, giving the Bio Passport teeth, has something to do with the situation?

 

[Cobblestones]

It seems the teams, riders and organizers are happily doling out among themselves imaginary future cash from TV rights which has yet to materialize.

No one has an idea how to make more money out of cycling which is guaranteed to work. A new league? helmet cams? point systems? radios or no radios? more races outside Europe? etc. etc. Maybe it attracts more people (which doesn't necessarily mean making cycling better), maybe it attracts even fewer people.

The one single advantage I can see to stay within the olympic system, is that they are bound to anti-doping rules, however weak and unenforceable they are. If it turns into a private professional league, it's most likely ending as a spectacle such as wrestling. To have it run similar to the NBA, MBL, NFL, NHL or whatever JV thinks as a great example scares me even more than an incompetent and corrupt UCI.

We complain about stages being neutralized by riders. Wait until you see whole seasons being canceled because riders go on strike. And of course, MLB, NHL etc. are shining examples of clean sport? Would you like to see a transfer 'market' such as in the NFL? Or a system where one team can buy the championship year after year (MLB)? How lame is hockey where winning teams come from Anaheim, Tampa Bay and Carolina? You know, places without natural ice? I really like the idea of a Basque team such as Euskaltel only employing Basque riders. And I'm pretty sure, a lot of fans in the Basque country do so as well.

(I apologize for the doping references outside the clinic, but it seems so integral to the discussion at hand).

 

[BroDeal]

From McQuaid's Velonation interview:

"Looking back a few years, when the UCI was having discussions in Brussels with the European Union about the setting up of the ProTour, one thing which the European Union insisted on was also that the top of the pyramid is seen to assist the base of the pyramid. In other words, the top teams should be seen to assist in the development of the sport."

This brings up a big question. Will JV and The Hog's new American-style league pass muster with the EU? It also shows the difficulty that setting up a new league might entail. Fighting with governments and EU regulatory commissions could involve as much work as as fighting with the UCI.

 

[thehog]

From McQuaid's Velonation interview:

"Looking back a few years, when the UCI was having discussions in Brussels with the European Union about the setting up of the ProTour, one thing which the European Union insisted on was also that the top of the pyramid is seen to assist the base of the pyramid. In other words, the top teams should be seen to assist in the development of the sport."

This brings up a big question. Will JV and The Hog's new American-style league pass muster with the EU? It also shows the difficulty that setting up a new league might entail. Fighting with governments and EU regulatory commissions could involve as much work as as fighting with the UCI.

You're just anti-everything. What happened my friend? What made you so mad.

 

[BroDeal]

You're just anti-everything. What happened my friend? What made you so mad.

Just pointing out the realities. Things are not as easy as, "Screw you guys. I'm going home to set up my own league."

And as much of a clown as McQuid--Ka Ching!--is, I don't trust JV and The Hog. I trust them even less when they are working together.

 

[Cobblestones]

Just pointing out the realities. Things are not as easy as, "Screw you guys. I'm going home to set up my own league."

And as much of a clown as McQuid--Ka Ching!--is, I don't trust JV and The Hog. I trust them even less when they are working together.

In particular since JV's ten points did not seem very promising. If France television is correct that the two main issues are radios and the big D, then we know that JV and the Hog are on the wrong side of these issues.

 

[skippy]

Not being "in the know" i don't know who "the hog" is in tandem with "JV" ?

Has anyone thought of the possibility of SKY being the international TV carrier , since they already have a team , could it be a benefit to them ?

Kerry Packer changed cricket to benefit his TV network .

Noted BrianF7 asked about Mc Quaid who was "incognito" in Sth Africa and banned from the Olympics as a result . Strange that he is threatening racers with exclusion for "bending rules" ?

Mr "Mc Inconsistency" seems to make "rules up" as the situation suits his purposes ! " Pot calling the kettle black "?

 

[jaylew]

I'm surprised there hasn't been any speculation as to which 11 teams would break away. The new organization would be much more legit if it had the biggest names for each of the cycling disicplines. Would P-R and Flanders deal more if they lost Boonen and Canc?? I think so...

Teams I think are for sure on the list:
Garmin - obviously
The Shack
HTC
Leopard

Not so sure about:
Quickstep
BMC
Sky
Liquigas
FDJ??

Other thoughts?

Certainly Saxo as Riis and Bruyneel are the only names I've seen definitively linked to this.

 

[Race Radio]

Certainly Saxo as Riis and Bruyneel are the only names I've seen definitively linked to this.

Yes, McQuaid said this today

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7...eagues-Grand-Tours-and-the-Olympic-Games.aspx

"maybe some of the individuals running this feel that the UCI has gone too hard on anti-doping"

 

[skippy]

Read the Velonation items ! Caused me to start yawning so going to bed !

"pot calling kettle black" ! Mc Queasy was caught misbehaving in Sth Africa so wants to treat the current racers in the same way .

Don't think missing London 2012 will worry too many of the current racing lineup since there are only a few who would be able to afford to walk away from a team to appear in the OLympics !

 

[hrotha]

The South Africa debacle was 35 years ago. I'm sure we can find more relevant stuff to attack Pat.

 

[Michael Brown]

Bottom line is we a list of changes/gimmicks to the "package", but no mention of any innovation that has the potential to make the actual racing more exciting. (technology ain't gonna cut it)

For that, we come back to the UCI and the radio ban.

Tech innovations could help with making the sport more attractive to more people, increasing the fan base. Increasing revenue. Growing the sport. The UCI does not appear to be doing anything to achieve that.

As to making racing more exciting...if the teams start racing without radios, their tactics will adapt, and I just don't see how the outcomes will be affected. Big teams with great riders will still win. But I never followed the sport before radios...so maybe I am wrong.

 

[Anonymous]

Tech innovations could help with making the sport more attractive to more people, increasing the fan base. Increasing revenue. Growing the sport. The UCI does not appear to be doing anything to achieve that.

As to making racing more exciting...if the teams start racing without radios, their tactics will adapt, and I just don't see how the outcomes will be affected. Big teams with great riders will still win. But I never followed the sport before radios...so maybe I am wrong.

how about they address fans being able to watch cycling on tv, or on the internet via subscription before they worry about technical innovations. No point having tech innovations, and whathaveyou if you are all sitting on our laptops watching cycling in a foreign language, on a crappy stream unable to work out who is who because they are all wearing black.

 

[ksmith]

Not hijacking the thread, if Bruyneel and Riis do start a new 'league' what happens if the feds go after Bruyneel? It would seem to me that they would be on very thin ice.




Just an observation, if Bruyneel is in on this, wouldn't his mate Armstrong also be some where near by? Just asking.

 

[ksmith]

Move above if needed, just went to the clinic theres a JV and Hog thread in full swing.

 

[xmoonx]

I'm pretty sure the ASO (or the French broadcasting station that shoots the images) can do all those things if they want to. The Deutschland Rundfahrt experimented with a couple of those thing a few years back, cameras on the finish line, a camera on the bike etc. No one has followed in their footsteps, probably because most cycling-fans don't care about that stuff.

I think they're talking about GROWING the sport not appealing to an already existing fan base. Seriously if you can turn throwing a ball into a peach basket into the NBA, I think it's very likely you can do the same for cycling. Total 2009 revenue for the NFL was $8.5 Billion ($1.0B owners + $7.5 players). Cycling has a very, very long way to go before it even remotely has to deal with; and may never have to deal with NFL, NBA financial woes.
Higher revenues at the top end, would filter down to feeder teams as the competition for advertising/sponsorship dollars heated up and the demands for prospective future riders increased.

Truth is I like the old school approach to cycling ( I ride an old lugged steel bike ), but there definitely need to be some changes made. If only for it to survive.

 

[blutto]

Successful? Not on my continent.

I think before the last trainwreck I was referring to, there was an incident here where the leading rider let someone else pass him in the final lap? I don't remember why or the precise circumstances, but that's the stuff to turn people off.

Ah and circles? Not so much. You see, they're called ovals. :shakes head: Educate yourself before you talk about NASCAR (I can't believe I just said that).

...Earth to Cobblestones...there is a country just north of you called Canada...its quite large so that you really have work hard to not see it on a map...so I really can't understand how you missed it...or is this just more proof that Sarah Palin not an anomoly but just one example of a widespread cultural pre-disposition..

....there is a city there called Montreal...and in that city, they have, each year an event called the Montreal Grande Prix....it is widely successful...

....P.S....Montreal also hosts a major cycling event ( following an equally major cycling event in Quebec City )....

...Canada also has great beer...a world-class snack food called poutine...and a functional health care system ( though youse guys probably wouldn't like it because its kinda socialist...run by the gubbermint and all ...)...and Canada is also the No 1 energy supplier to youse guys...all in all a good place to know about...

....just trying to expand your horizons a bit....

Cheers

blutto