2012 Tour of California May 18 stage 7: Ontario - Mt. Baldy 126 km

[Parrulo]

dislike? more like proper evaluation of his climbing skills, or lack of them if you wish. he hadn't, and still hasn't show any indication that he can keep up with the best climbers when they truly go for it.

 

[El Pistolero]

Tejay is a talented cyclist, but he needs to stop thinking about becoming a climber for god's sake.

If I were him I'd focus on short stage races with hilly stages or medium mountains(Paris-Nice, Tirreno-Adriatico, Romandie, Eneco Tour, etc). And perhaps try for a hilly classic and see how that goes.

 

[Parrulo]

Tejay is a talented cyclist, but he needs to stop thinking about becoming a climber for god's sake.

If I were him I'd focus on short stage races with hilly stages or medium mountains(Paris-Nice, Tirreno-Adriatico, Romandie, Eneco Tour, etc). And perhaps try for a hilly classic and see how that goes.

i think you are right. i was mighty impressed by the work he did for gilbert on LBL, i think he can definitively get some results there.

 

[El Pistolero]

i think you are right. i was mighty impressed by the work he did for gilbert on LBL, i think he can definitively get some results there.

Oh my, I forgot for a second he rides in the same team as Gilbert. Guess I'm still not used to seeing Gilbert at BMC(with the nats jersey and all).

Yeah, him and Santaromita(I think) did great work for Phil in LBL.

 

[Angliru]

Tejay is a talented cyclist, but he needs to stop thinking about becoming a climber for god's sake.

If I were him I'd focus on short stage races with hilly stages or medium mountains(Paris-Nice, Tirreno-Adriatico, Romandie, Eneco Tour, etc). And perhaps try for a hilly classic and see how that goes.

TVG's problems in the mountains remind me of Evans before he learned to ration his efforts. It seems TVG allows himself to get so far into the red that he bonks. It's almost as if he's riding as a super domestique for himself, he rides himself into exhaustion trying to keep up with the best climbers and consequently ends up losing minutes when he could've limited his losses by letting them go much sooner.

 

[Moviefan1203]

TVG's problems in the mountains remind me of Evans before he learned to ration his efforts. It seems TVG allows himself to get so far into the red that he bonks. It's almost as if he's riding as a super domestique for himself, he rides himself into exhaustion trying to keep up with the best climbers and consequently ends up losing minutes when he could've limited his losses by letting them go much sooner.

He'll learn, he's still very young.

 

[Parrulo]

TVG's problems in the mountains remind me of Evans before he learned to ration his efforts. It seems TVG allows himself to get so far into the red that he bonks. It's almost as if he's riding as a super domestique for himself, he rides himself into exhaustion trying to keep up with the best climbers and consequently ends up losing minutes when he could've limited his losses by letting them go much sooner.

even so he would still be losing a lot of time to make him relevant to any mountainous stage race.

He'll learn, he's still very young.

yes that is still possible for him, but he hasn't show any improvement at all since he became a pro, his best performance on a mountain still is his 2010 alpe ride on the dauphine.

one thing i must say tho, if nelson oliveira, a rider know as a very bad climber on the u23 scene managed to improve from a rider that finishes on the autobus on every stage to a rider finishing just a few minutes behind the favorites(which is about TJVG real level on a GT) during a winter full of injuries while still having to lose 2 or 3 kilos according to himself TJVG can certainly make the next step if he works hard on it and is a bit lucky.

 

[Angliru]

He can still pursue his goals in the grand tours while continuing to compete in week long stage races and testing the waters of the hilly classics. He'll eventually find his niche. To bring up another Aussie, Michael Rogers took several years before he surmised that he just wasn't made for grand tour success.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

even so he would still be losing a lot of time to make him relevant to any mountainous stage race.



yes that is still possible for him, but he hasn't show any improvement at all since he became a pro, his best performance on a mountain still is his 2010 alpe ride on the dauphine.

one thing i must say tho, if nelson oliveira, a rider know as a very bad climber on the u23 scene managed to improve from a rider that finishes on the autobus on every stage to a rider finishing just a few minutes behind the favorites(which is about TJVG real level on a GT) during a winter full of injuries while still having to lose 2 or 3 kilos according to himself TJVG can certainly make the next step if he works hard on it and is a bit lucky.

Still an ominous sign that riders as Dombrowski, still a development rider, and Kelderman, 1st year pro, already outclimb him.
I mean it's no shame losing to Gesink, Duarte, Leipheimer and Horner etc being Van Garderen. But Kelderman, he wasn't even one of the best climbers at U23 level, he wasn't. Kelderman was not of the level of Bardet, Quintana, Talansky... and now this. Hmm has me puzzled

 

[Moviefan1203]

Still an ominous sign that riders as Dombrowski, still a development rider, and Kelderman, 1st year pro, already outclimb him.
I mean it's no shame losing to Gesink, Duarte, Leipheimer and Horner etc being Van Garderen. But Kelderman, he wasn't even one of the best climbers at U23 level, he wasn't. Kelderman was not of the level of Bardet, Quintana, Talansky... and now this. Hmm has me puzzled

It's pretty clear the Kelderman is a future GC rider of the highest degree. He's a phenomenal talent.

 

[Angliru]

Still an ominous sign that riders as Dombrowski, still a development rider, and Kelderman, 1st year pro, already outclimb him.
I mean it's no shame losing to Gesink, Duarte, Leipheimer and Horner etc being Van Garderen. But Kelderman, he wasn't even one of the best climbers at U23 level, he wasn't. Kelderman was not of the level of Bardet, Quintana, Talansky... and now this. Hmm has me puzzled

Some riders adapt mentally and physically faster than others. TVG may be a diesel engine who thinks he's turbo. He may have to adapt the Basso style of riding and ride his own tempo because it seems when the flurry of attacks begin he's quickly put into trouble.

 

[Parrulo]

Still an ominous sign that riders as Dombrowski, still a development rider, and Kelderman, 1st year pro, already outclimb him.
I mean it's no shame losing to Gesink, Duarte, Leipheimer and Horner etc being Van Garderen. But Kelderman, he wasn't even one of the best climbers at U23 level, he wasn't. Kelderman was not of the level of Bardet, Quintana, Talansky... and now this. Hmm has me puzzled

well some riders take longer to develop their climbing ability and some stop to develop very soon. either TJVG becomes some type of nibali and start to develop as a climber until his late 20's (nibali arguably is still improving as a climber) or he will never make it as a GC rider. those young guys aren't a GC riding level yet and they can all stagnate now and never make it.

u23 riding most times isn't really a sign of anything, kelderman was never a top climber in the u23 ranks (even tho he is only 20 so he is kind of special) and look at him now, oliveira was terrible as an u23 and over 1 winter improved exponentially from terrible to mediocre at 22/23

 

[greenedge]

Very impressive again by Gesink ( he really left it all on the road ) and a hugely entertaining stage.

I wonder if A Schleck has watched Gesink in this? He could learn a lot...

Don't show it to Andy otherwise one of two things will happen.

1. Frank his face is scary. It's so painful ( turn it off ). I don't want to ride anymore.
2. He might actually beat Contador.

Don't be too harsh on TJVG ( he still has time to improve and he will definitely win this race one day ).

One other thing i completely forgot about Talansky. How come Garmin did not have him as a option???

 

[boomcie]

Another epic fail by a dutchman in a final. I can sense another one in the making today

My work here is done

 

[theyoungest]

Still an ominous sign that riders as Dombrowski, still a development rider, and Kelderman, 1st year pro, already outclimb him.
I mean it's no shame losing to Gesink, Duarte, Leipheimer and Horner etc being Van Garderen. But Kelderman, he wasn't even one of the best climbers at U23 level, he wasn't. Kelderman was not of the level of Bardet, Quintana, Talansky... and now this. Hmm has me puzzled

You keep saying this about Kelderman, based on that one Tour de l'Avenir, but you do know that he crashed there as well? Afterwards he said that it went quite well "considering the circumstances", so I don't think he felt at his best. Bardet finished ahead of him because of a breakaway, BTW.

Kelderman is actually the same type of climber as Van Garderen, always in the saddle, steady tempo. The difference is he didn't try to follow when Gesink etc. went, so he didn't blow up.

My work here is done

Actually I don't know if you remember but before the race I said Gesink would win it. I just wasn't that sure anymore after seeing guys like Tommy D and Velits go so well.

 

[Arnout]

I was wrong about Gesink it seems, good job to him.

 

[greenedge]

You keep saying this about Kelderman, based on that one Tour de l'Avenir, but you do know that he crashed there as well?
Kelderman is actually the same type of climber as Van Garderen, always in the saddle, steady tempo. The difference is he didn't try to follow when Gesink etc. went, so he didn't blow up.

I am sure D_T would have ( being a Rabo fan ).

Besides why would he have chased Gesink after he did work for him/ was assured of the best young riders jersey ( as soon as Durbridge went back ).

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I still find it more of a suprise Duarte went back to Colombia.

Can't believe nobody else picked him up. Today again a great climb (after starting to far back when the attacks started)

for the 109383292 time. duarte wanted to go back to colombia. he had offers from other teams as well, also wt teams

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

This was definitely their best race as a team so far. The other guys at least got into breaks, and Rodriguez was with Duarte until the beginning of the final climb.
Suarez remains the big disappointment.

As others have said, it was a great stage to watch. I was hoping to see Atapuma hang on, but at the same time it's impossible to begrudge Gesink the win after the tough 18 months he's been through. Duarte could maybe have done a bit better if he hadn't been sitting at the back of the group all the time. Uran does the same, it's a little frustrating.

Horner's comments towards Atapuma seem like sour grapes to me.

duarte simply did not have a good day. he just suffered hard and on raw climbing skills and power finished 3rd. not far down gesink. the colombian team still sucks. nothing has changed. atapuma was in colombia 3 weeks longer cuz of visa problems. that's why he has less shortage of trainingbase and duarte simply has too much class to suck all the time. but they could be a lot better and so would their teammates

 

[BeachBum]

One other thing i completely forgot about Talansky. How come Garmin did not have him as a option???

I'm sure he was an option at the start of the day, but he dropped off (can't remember exactly where) and ended up in the grupetto. I never saw an explanation of what happened to him.

 

[greenedge]

I'm just confused is all ( thx for the explanation ). Even though he is still young he will never be a great climber ( in my view )- great counts like Shleck, Contador or even Lance.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

dislike? more like proper evaluation of his climbing skills, or lack of them if you wish. he hadn't, and still hasn't show any indication that he can keep up with the best climbers when they truly go for it.

I've always said his climbing abilities are way overrated.

talented rider, but not good enough in the cols for my liking.

It's pretty clear the Kelderman is a future GC rider of the highest degree. He's a phenomenal talent.

still hard to say.
But I thought it was pre-mature when commented kelderman might not be a guy for the mountains. He was unlucky in the cols he did as (and prepared for) a espoir. And himself commented he believed the cols were for him.

 

[staubsauger]

in conclusion this tour of california has been pretty successful for dutch cycling!

3 bicyclers from the netherlands (gesink, kelderman, weening) in the top 10. while one is taking the overall victory and another the young riders jearsey.

awesome!