2013 Giro d'Italia Stage 8: Gabicce Mare - Saltara 54,8 km ITT

[Bavarianrider]

ignorance is bliss

Fact (non MTT)

 

[Bavarianrider]

It's sort of a longer version of the Tour de Suisse TT last year. Technical, hilly first part, flatter second part. Which he absolutely nailed.

Actually it's not that technical at all.
Almost all of the corners in the first part are sweeping corners on a wide road.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Fact (non MTT)

Last years tour?

 

[maxmartin]

Fact (non MTT)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Tour_de_France,_Prologue_to_Stage_10#Stage_9

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Some people are really getting carried away here. Wiggins isn't going to be doing much steep descending on slippery roads tomorrow. He's going to be TTing, over a long distance. He will put a minimum of 2 mins into Nibali and Hesjedal.

(People are also getting carried away about his bike handling. He used to be a prologue specialist and he's attacked on downhills this year. He fell on a descent where large numbers were falling, including Mr Downhill himself, Nibali. Then he was shaken and took things super-carefully. He's no top tier bike handler, but he's no Euskaltel domestique either.)

I say this as someone who would much prefer to see any of the other top contenders win, before some clown comes along and starts calling me a fanboy.

 

[maxmartin]

Some people are really getting carried away here. Wiggins isn't going to be doing much steep descending on slippery roads tomorrow. He's going to be TTing, over a long distance. He will put a minimum of 2 mins into Nibali and Hesjedal.

(People are also getting carried away about his bike handling. He used to be a prologue specialist and he's attacked on downhills this year. He fell on a descent where large numbers were falling, including Mr Downhill himself, Nibali. Then he was shaken and took things super-carefully. He's no top tier bike handler, but he's no Euskaltel domestique either.)

I say this as someone who would much prefer to see any of the other top contenders win, before some clown comes along and starts calling me a fanboy.

keep dreaming

 

[Bavarianrider]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Tour_de_France,_Prologue_to_Stage_10#Stage_9

Losing 2 minutes in a hilly 40km TT is considered to be good

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Some people are really getting carried away here. Wiggins isn't going to be doing much steep descending on slippery roads tomorrow. He's going to be TTing, over a long distance. He will put a minimum of 2 mins into Nibali and Hesjedal.

(People are also getting carried away about his bike handling. He used to be a prologue specialist and he's attacked on downhills this year. He fell on a descent where large numbers were falling, including Mr Downhill himself, Nibali. Then he was shaken and took things super-carefully. He's no top tier bike handler, but he's no Euskaltel domestique either.)

I say this as someone who would much prefer to see any of the other top contenders win, before some clown comes along and starts calling me a fanboy.

sounds like typical fanboy stuff.

 

[maxmartin]

Losing 2 minutes in a hilly 40km TT is considered to be good

nobody said he is the best, top ten is not good? How funny you call that hilly ITT? I guess you are using different dictionary than everyone else.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Losing 2 minutes in a hilly 40km TT is considered to be good

taking 8th place, only being beaten by the very best tters, yes for people that does not only cheer for Tony Martin that is "good"

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

keep dreaming

Why would we expect weak descending or not looking great on a short, steep, climb to translate into a drastically below-par long time trial? Even if he's not on last year's form, he's still a much better TTer than his GC rivals here. With the solitary exception of a peak Evans, if such a creature still exists. Evans at his best could beat a sub par Wiggins, but not a top form one. If his form is good, then he's in a class of just four TTers, ie with the top three specialists.

 

[airstream]

keep dreaming

Do you admit that tomorrow you may look very foolishly? One should has a lot of garanties to reply this way.

 

[maxmartin]

Why would we expect weak descending or not looking great on a short, steep, climb to translate into a drastically below-par long time trial? Even if he's not on last year's form, he's still a much better TTer than his GC rivals here. With the solitary exception of a peak Evans, if such a creature still exists. If his form is good, then he's in a class of just four TTers, ie with the top three specialists.

He is hurt on TV obviously. And on 40KM flat course of last year Tour he only gained 2 mins on Nibali, what makes you think W can pull minimum 2 min on Nibali on a very technical course in wet condition. Plus nobody believed W is at his Tour level at the moment. Yes, he probably still can beat Nibali, but 2min minimum, that is a leap of faith.

 

[maxmartin]

Do you admit that tomorrow you may look very foolishly? One should has a lot of garanties to reply this way.

or may not, do you even know my position on ITT result?

 

[the sceptic]

He is hurt on TV obviously. And on 40KM flat course of last year Tour he only gained 2 mins on Nibali, what makes you think W can pull minimum 2 min on Nibali on a very technical course in wet condition. Plus nobody believed W is at his Tour level at the moment. Yes, he probably still can beat Nibali, but 2min minimum, that is a leap of faith.

Its not that technical so i doubt Wiggins will have to ride like a schoolgirl through the corners.

He took 3:30 in the final ITT in the tour. I think that is a better comparison. Obviously Nibali might have improved now and maybe Wiggins isnt in his best shape at the moment, but it wouldnt surprise me if he took 2 minutes tomorrow.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

He is hurt on TV obviously. And on 40KM flat course of last year Tour he only gained 2 mins on Nibali, what makes you think W can pull minimum 2 min on Nibali on a very technical course in wet condition.

He put 2:07 into him in the Tour and this is a substantially longer TT, which should add an extra advantage to the better time trial rider. It is also not "very technical".

If he's actually injured, then all bets are off, obviously. Although Sky are claiming that there's nothing wrong

 

[maxmartin]

Its not that technical so i doubt Wiggins will have to ride like a schoolgirl through the corners.

He took 3:30 in the final ITT in the tour. I think that is a better comparison. Obviously Nibali might have improved now and maybe Wiggins isnt in his best shape at the moment, but it wouldnt surprise me if he took 2 minutes tomorrow.

At final ITT, GC is almost set for stone for Nibali, he may not try as hard as he can.

Yes, maybe W can gain 2mins, but say 2mins minimum it a little bit too much, at best 2min I might agree with that, but we will see

 

[airstream]

С

He is hurt on TV obviously. And on 40KM flat course of last year Tour he only gained 2 mins on Nibali, what makes you think W can pull minimum 2 min on Nibali on a very technical course in wet condition. Plus nobody believed W is at his Tour level at the moment. Yes, he probably still can beat Nibali, but 2min minimum, that is a leap of faith.

The 1st TT was not flat. It had many powerful 3-4-5% pieces and the descent in the first part. Plus, that TT was the best long Nibali's TT ever. It is a significant amendment surely if you don't consider that Nibali is able only to improve and Wiggins is able onlt to digress.

The extent of technical difficulties and wet condition we'll know tomorrow. An outstanding bike handler Menchov won a 60 km TT in Cinque Terre.

 

[maxmartin]

He put 2:07 into him in the Tour and this is a substantially longer TT, which should add an extra advantage to the better time trial rider. It is also not "very technical".

If he's actually injured, then all bets are off, obviously. Although Sky are claiming that there's nothing wrong

It is not?? According to who? you?

 

[ElChingon]

Wiggins won't win. This will be a bit of a lottery imo.

Agree on Wiggo, but there are 5 or so riders with 90% of the tickets in hand.

 

[Netserk]

Agree on Wiggo, but there are 5 or so riders with 90% of the tickets in hand.

Which riders?

 

[cineteq]

Why would we expect weak descending or not looking great on a short, steep, climb to translate into a drastically below-par long time trial? Even if he's not on last year's form, he's still a much better TTer than his GC rivals here. With the solitary exception of a peak Evans, if such a creature still exists. Evans at his best could beat a sub par Wiggins, but not a top form one. If his form is good, then he's in a class of just four TTers, ie with the top three specialists.

Because he was dropped before he crashed, it's gonna be wet tomorrow, plus have you watched him since the Giro started?

 

[maxmartin]

Because he was dropped before he crashed, it's gonna be wet tomorrow, plus have you watched him since the Giro started?

they have unshakable faith of W's TT ability

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Because he was dropped before he crashed, it's gonna be wet tomorrow, plus have you watched him since the Giro started?

He looked less than stellar on a short, steep, climb and worse again on a descent. But I don't expect him to look great in those situations, even in top form.

His critics can't have it both ways. Either we expect him to be relatively weak on short, sharp, climbs because we think it's a general weakness of his. Or we take a bad performance on one as evidence that he's below par. But you can't really have both at the same time.

I'll judge his form by his TT and his ability to tempo climb, the two things his game is all about. The rest, well even in peak form he's not an Ardennes type rider and he's well capable of getting dropped on a wet descent, no matter what his form is like.

This isn't really a matter of "faith". I really hope that he does poorly tomorrow. But experience has taught me that, unless he's injured, he's a lot better in the TT than these guys.

 

[will10]

Taylor for the stage.