2014 Tour Down Under Stage 2: Prospect -> Stirling, 150km (2.WT)

[theyoungest]

I see the race yesterday and they climbed the KOM at the pace of a Garmin rider... very easy, I hoped a little bit more of yesterday, some people are training or afraid of his shape...40 Km/h in a short and flat stage with some wind, but neutral (circuit) and not very strong ,is not big average.

Gerrans has half the race in his pocket. I see Evans second and Ulissi or Gesink in the third possition of the podium.

SKY was dissapointing yesterday.. the worked and now Thomas is at 11 seconds and Porte at 15.

Ouch... not too impressed with Garmin, I gather?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I know Verona, I wouldnt say he is my friend, but I have talked with him several times by internet and in person and I always remerber when in Neila he was descending after the stage in a 20 % slope and give me the hand.

He is a very hard worker, ha has trained very hard this winter in Navacerrada, his home...he has a lot of quality, but his main strength is his mind, it is that make difference with him respect others, and he will be a big champion, even in this mundialized cycling that will be full of eritrean and things like that...

He is just 21..of course Sagan was a start at that age, but Verona is a different kind of rider, he go step by step, learning, but sometyimes is not possible to hide his quality, and yersterday, working, he was the first of the team and best young rider. he is humble anyway.

You can see me in crazy way screaming riders and pushing a little (I know is ilegal) to Verona in Vuelta a Castilla y León, puerto del Peñon, in a stage that finished in Sanabria, who was 18 years old (asking pushing is frecuent among people that have worked or behind in GC, dont think in the bad way )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vpW_ZYpRoc

I respect your knowledge about cycling from what I've seen so far but verona doesn't have much real talent don't you think? he may have great mind, but so does quintana for instance who has incredible talent. we life in a day and age of cycling where talent break through immediately or not at all.

 

[Arredondo]

Gerrans the men to beat. This is really a finish for the puncheurs, so Ulissi, Evans, Gavazzi are also good men. Greipel can make it, because last year, with even a more tougher finale, he made it till 1 k to, when he dropped of. Goss was second last year, so a strong sprinter can win here to (Greipel, Von Hoff, Matthews, but i don't see Orica working for him because they have Gerrans).

Interesting finale, because a lot of riders can win here, but Gerrans the most likely.

 

[Taxus4a]

I respect your knowledge about cycling from what I've seen so far but verona doesn't have much real talent don't you think? he may have great mind, but so does quintana for instance who has incredible talent. we life in a day and age of cycling where talent break through immediately or not at all.

Well, people as Quintana are from another planet.
But Verona is a more complete rider.
People as Quintana, Pinot,... has started very early, but that doenst mind that in 5 years Verona cant stay fighting with them.
For the moment, I hope he could help Urán some days.
We will see, it is always difficult to reach the top of a sport, but in Spain, he is with Landa and De La Cruz, mainly, our future. He could just be a good rider more for the top ten, it would be great, but for now I have my hopes in more. He is more disciplined, hard worked and inteligent, than talented, but he is really talented. Explosive riders, even pure climbers, start before, he is more diesel.

 

[theyoungest]

I respect your knowledge about cycling from what I've seen so far but verona doesn't have much real talent don't you think? he may have great mind, but so does quintana for instance who has incredible talent. we life in a day and age of cycling where talent break through immediately or not at all.

The best rider of the moment broke through when he was 26 years of age...

 

[Taxus4a]

Ouch... not too impressed with Garmin, I gather?

It was just one, and that one wanst a big name of cycling, nor Hesjedal, nor Dan Martin, Acevedo....he did a big work, that is for sure, he put half the peloton out, but I hoped more for the climb, some attacks. It was short but quite hard climb with most of the climb over 10 %

 

[theyoungest]

It was just one, and that one wanst a big name of cycling, nor Hesjedal, nor Dan Martin, Acevedo....he did a big work, that is for sure, he put half the peloton out, but I hoped more for the climb, some attacks. It was short but quite hard climb with most of the climb over 10 %

Yes, I know what you mean, I was just kidding

It was Nathan Haas BTW.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

The best rider of the moment broke through when he was 26 years of age...

yes the exception to any rule. any more examples?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Well, people as Quintana are from another planet.
But Verona is a more complete rider.
People as Quintana, Pinot,... has started very early, but that doenst mind that in 5 years Verona cant stay fighting with them.
For the moment, I hope he could help Urán some days.
We will see, it is always difficult to reach the top of a sport, but in Spain, he is with Landa and De La Cruz, mainly, our future. He could just be a good rider more for the top ten, it would be great, but for now I have my hopes in more. He is more disciplined, hard worked and inteligent, than talented, but he is really talented. Explosive riders, even pure climbers, start before, he is more diesel.

spains cycling future doesn't look very good. the protectionistic ways of their own u23, junior and elite racing has made talents weak and the level of competition also. of course it's a big country so they will always have some top riders but they are in their 30s now

 

[Ruudz0r]

spains cycling future doesn't look very good. the protectionistic ways of their own u23, junior and elite racing has made talents weak and the level of competition also. of course it's a big country so they will always have some top riders but they are in their 30s now

THeir juniors of last year are not bad: Christian Rodriguez, Alvaro Cuadros Morata, Torres, Jaume Sureda (will still be a junior in 2014) and especially Diego Pablo Sevilla (will also still be a junior in 2014. This is just from the top of my head so probably forgetting some.

 

[maltiv]

yes the exception to any rule. any more examples?

Wiggins, Hesjedal, Gerrans...

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

THeir juniors of last year are not bad: Christian Rodriguez, Alvaro Cuadros Morata, Torres, Jaume Sureda (will still be a junior in 2014) and especially Diego Pablo Sevilla (will also still be a junior in 2014. This is just from the top of my head so probably forgetting some.

I don't follow junior cycling, but what internayional results do they have?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Wiggins, Hesjedal, Gerrans...

gerrans became pro late and within 2 years broke through. wiggins was already a major star when he was in early 20s in track cycling. hesjedal was in mtb.

 

[Ruudz0r]

I don't follow junior cycling, but what internayional results do they have?

They dont ride much international, same as the Italians doesnt mean they arent talented though. I personally dont really think its necesarry for a 17 year old to ride around the world anyway. Cuadros will now move to ethixx so he will be riding a more international calender in his first U23 year.

 

[barmaher]

Sastre broke through aged 25 when he won the Vuelta KOM and came 8th. His real breakthrough was much later.

I remember Danilo Hondo as being very late when he broke through.

Tyler Hamilton broke through very late, too.

Bradley Wiggins (never mind!)

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

They dont ride much international, same as the Italians doesnt mean they arent talented though. I personally dont really think its necesarry for a 17 year old to ride around the world anyway. Cuadros will now move to ethixx so he will be riding a more international calender in his first U23 year.

the problem is they also don't ride internationally when they aren't juniors. and their domectic elite cycling level has become very low. in itay it's still high

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Sastre broke through aged 25 when he won the Vuelta KOM and came 8th. His real breakthrough was much later.

I remember Danilo Hondo as being very late when he broke through.

Tyler Hamilton broke through very late, too.

Bradley Wiggins (never mind!)

those were doping days

 

[Taxus4a]

yes the exception to any rule. any more examples?

Froome, friend of Carlos, is a similar kind of rider, more diesel, more need to develop, rider for Tours, he started cycling at the age that Verona is now, so, it is a different case, Verona knows a lot of things about cycling that Froome didnt know even with 24, and his illness make him explode late. But anyway, Froome showed his quality, as Verona did yesterday, in a lot of times before that Vuelta despite his illness.

Froome and Carlos has now similar experience in cycling, they are taking seriusly cycling since about 6 years for Verona, 8 years for Froome.

 

[Popchu]

Froome, friend of Carlos, is a similar kind of rider, more diesel, more need to develop, rider for Tours, he started cycling at the age that Verona is now, so, it is a different case, Verona knows a lot of things about cycling that Froome didnt know even with 24, and his illness make him explode late. But anyway, Froome showed his quality, as Verona did yesterday, in a lot of times before that Vuelta despite his illness.

Froome and Carlos has now similar experience in cycling, they are taking seriusly cycling since about 6 years for Verona, 8 years for Froome.

Hmm, I believe you that Verona is a talented rider, but being fifteenth in a sprint in a TDU-stage isn't exactly "showing his quality" in my opinion. He needs to do more than that to convince me that he really is a talented rider.

 

[Taxus4a]

yes the exception to any rule. any more examples?

A lot of them, in cycling is not how good you are with 17 years old, but how you are with 25 or even later.

Anyway, Verona impresed everybody in Spain as junior. He was like in another level.

The important yesterday is not that he did 15, best young rider, it is that he was working for his team mates. He is going to be working all the year...so he is not going to get results...

We dont know if Quintana will be much better, nor Sagan, nor Pinot, they are supossed to improve, but maybe just a little.

Urán won a stage and was 9th in GC in Tour de Suisse with just 20 years old... he has always got good results, but maybe is this year when he really explode.

People talk about Mohoric, well, we will see... yesterday he wanst impressive, Ulissi has a similar story, he is a good rider, but not the rider some people talked when he started pro, he can improve, of course, and he will be a rider to take really in account.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

uran is an example of a rider who was top immediately and to anyone who knew him as a junior no surprise. uran was top at 19 and he still is now. he hasn't improced that much nor does he need to be. quintana has only been cycling since he is 17. so he is incredible. he will still improve a lot but I think your opinion is way colored on verona. spanish junior cycling I don't take serious. when foreigners go there they destroy the spanish, that even happens now in elite cycling too

 

[Taxus4a]

Hmm, I believe you that Verona is a talented rider, but being fifteenth in a sprint in a TDU-stage isn't exactly "showing his quality" in my opinion. He needs to do more than that to convince me that he really is a talented rider.

If you think that yesterday was just an sprint, just becouse a sprinter as Greipel was second, with Porte loosing time, after a climb, and 2,5 kms at the end uphill, you need to learn a lot still about cycling.

There are some people that only noticed when riders as Sagan won stages at Paris Nice with 20, or Pinot winning at the Tour, but there are a lot of things to notice in cycling that most of people dont notice, and Verona is on the right track. You maybe say, Jungels (same age) is better, he has showed more... wrong (althoug Jungels is a big rider), they are differents, and time will say, for the moment you cant say one of them is better, but Jungels is more for one day races.

 

[manafana]

Geschke was looking strong yesterday. I'll go with him.

like this call will be focus for giant, otherwise an orica wildcard.

 

[Taxus4a]

Today is a similar stage as yestarday, there is no really a climb, but harder stage and finish, so the names are supossed to be the same.

We will see if SKY, BMC and Lampre put so easy to Orica to get more seconds.
Orica said yesterday he is not worried about the leader jersey, but Gerrans has a lot of chances to win the stage again, and is the team to lose more if a breakaway takes 5 minutes, so, Orica should work...

It is an interesting Poker day among teams.

 

[Wilba60]

OGE have a few options open to them today and there is no necessity for Gerrans to win the stage given that he has some tough riding coming up in the next few days. OGE love to share the opportunities around and if Gerro is a bit tired, or the team want to keep him safe in the lead bunch, they could well throw a winning option open to someone like Mathews, Impey or Goss. I wouldn't be surprised to see a smokey like Impey get up for the stage win. The Gerro/Impey combo worked beautifully at the TDF last year and a tough uphill sprint is perfect for him.