2018 Tour of Flanders

[alspacka]

Re: Re:

And he was the pre-race favourite, both with the bookies and in the poll in this thread. And he was strong enough to drop all the other favourites on the final climb of the race. Yet once again, came away without even really coming close to challenging for the win.

Of course he is a main discussion point.

He had the shortest odds but the field is always favoured in such races. Except maybe vs 2010 Fabian. I agree though the focus is natural, biggest star in the sport.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: Re:

+ Sagan missing a decisive move +

let's face it, if Sagan would have gone with Terpstra it for sure would not have been a decisive move (Terpstra would not have contributed an inch) ....
QS was too strong today, unlike in former years they now seem to know how to play their cards (attacking one by one) - in order to put something against QS the other teams (or a other team) would need one or two more potential winners, which they can send out whenever someone from QS makes the attack ...

Are you sure about this? This is the same Terpstra who co-operated with Kristoff for the last 40km of the same race a few years ago, and is in even better form now than he was then.

I think there is a very good chance Terpstra would have co-operated and tried to drop Sagan on the Paterberg (like his plan was with Kristoff). It would have been his only hope at winning after all.

Trolling on its best. Sure. Terpstra would be pulling Sagan and trying to drop him on Paterberg.

 

[mrhender]

In any case QS will be happy and can ride more relaxed next Sunday (which i think will help them). They really needed this.

As for Sagan. He always pretends its not a big deal. On the inside i doubt this to be the case.

Come sunday, a few from today has something to make up for. For many of them it will be last chance of putting a mark on 18'.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

And he was the pre-race favourite, both with the bookies and in the poll in this thread. And he was strong enough to drop all the other favourites on the final climb of the race. Yet once again, came away without even really coming close to challenging for the win.

Of course he is a main discussion point.

He had the shortest odds but the field is always favoured in such races. Except maybe vs 2010 Fabian. I agree though the focus is natural, biggest star in the sport.

Agreed. I think he was only 25% or so chance to win according to the bookies. But he's been similar odds in about his last 15 attempts at monuments and has only won once, so it does seems like he's underachieving in relation to the expectations on him.

I also was wondering who the last rider was to be odds on to win a monument? Probably Cancellara or Boonen like you said. Or maybe Nibali at Lombardia last year?

 

[Son of Amsterhammer]

QS is so strong this year. The strength in numbers they have is giving all the other top riders horrible decisions to make. None of the other teams have figured out what to do or that they have to work together to stop this. As soon as Terpstra got away it was over. He proved last week that you don’t give him a gap right Now.

 

[Squire]

Re: Re:

I also was wondering who the last rider was to be odds on to win a monument? Probably Cancellara or Boonen like you said. Or maybe Nibali at Lombardia last year?

Valverde must have had pretty low odds before last year's LBL.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

+ Sagan missing a decisive move +

let's face it, if Sagan would have gone with Terpstra it for sure would not have been a decisive move (Terpstra would not have contributed an inch) ....
QS was too strong today, unlike in former years they now seem to know how to play their cards (attacking one by one) - in order to put something against QS the other teams (or a other team) would need one or two more potential winners, which they can send out whenever someone from QS makes the attack ...

Are you sure about this? This is the same Terpstra who co-operated with Kristoff for the last 40km of the same race a few years ago, and is in even better form now than he was then.

I think there is a very good chance Terpstra would have co-operated and tried to drop Sagan on the Paterberg (like his plan was with Kristoff). It would have been his only hope at winning after all.

Trolling on its best. Sure. Terpstra would be pulling Sagan and trying to drop him on Paterberg.

Please stop trying to derail the discussion with childish accusations of trolling.

What is you're evidence that Terpstra wouldn't co-operate? Because the one time he has been in this situation with a much faster sprinter, he absolutely did co-operate until about the last 2km. Let's deal with facts here, not your baseless (and clearly biased) opinion please.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

I also was wondering who the last rider was to be odds on to win a monument? Probably Cancellara or Boonen like you said. Or maybe Nibali at Lombardia last year?

Valverde must have had pretty low odds before last year's LBL.

Yeah, possibly he would have been odds on (I imagine he certainly would have been for Fleche). I always got the impression that in the past LBL and MSR were the two monuments where the favourites had the longest odds. But maybe Valverde's dominance has changed that in the last couple of years.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: 2018 Ronde van Vlaanderen

If not trolling this is even worse with you then I thought.

 

[jaylew]

So, who's won both PR and RVV in the 2000s? Boonen, Cancellara, Van Petegem, and now Terpstra? That's a short list.

 

[red_flanders]

Re:

So, who's won both PR and RVV in the 2000s? Boonen, Cancellara, Van Petegem, and now Terpstra? That's a short list.

Spot on. If Terpstra were a Flandrian, he'd be regarded as a legend.

I say this as a person who is half Flemish.

 

[The Blues]

Massively impressive ride from Mads Pedersen to attack so far out and hold on for 2nd place with all the favourites hunting him down. Especially considering this was his first participation at De Ronde and his young age (22). The young Danes were particularly strong today with Valgren finishing 4th as well.

Terpstra clearly the strongest of the favourites and he's collecting a really nice palmarès in the cobbled classics (Le Samyn x 2, DDV x 2, E3, PR, and Ronde).

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

So many people saying how obvious it was when Terpstra went that Sagan should've followed, but literally no one saying it pages ago on this forum when it happened. You post race geniuses aren't fooling anyone.

If Sagan promptly chased down Terpstra then it would've come back together and Stybar would've gone. Then when Sagan chased him, Gilbert would've gone, and the same people would be saying how naive Sagan was, trying to cover every attack.

Sagan's best hope was to form an alliance with a small group like with GVA and Vanmarcke, but they didn't have it today.

The reality is QS just have too many strong cards to play for one rider to beat them alone.

There wasn't much road left for all that, which is the crucial bit. And by keeping the race together it would have suited him more imo. I agree that it's very, very hard to beat qs alone, but you cannot say that sagan did not make it harder for himself (even if outside the climbs, he didn't have the legs)

 

[alspacka]

Luke Rowe DQ seems perfectly reasonable watching it back

https://streamable.com/71vjt

 

[LPP68!]

Re: Re:

One win and three podiums in 24 attempts at monuments now for Sagan. Surely he is better than that?

Easier said than done. He has a world class punch/sprint, but lacks a good engine. His team is never there when he actually needs them (bora tactics ). He's also one of a few who can win by both attacking and sprinting so it can be difficult to decide how he´s going to approach it.

It's the lack of podiums which surprised me most. We all know he's only won one monument. But only three podiums in the other 23 attempts is really poor for someone with such a fast finish.

I guess we should probably re-assess how prestigious a WC win is nowdays as well. Because it certainly appears a lot easier to win than a monument - which never used to be the case.

As with any monument, it is a race that the absolute elite on the terrain will try to win. And only 1 rider can win it. I cannot remember a time where the WC was not a main target for possible winners.

 

[jaylew]

Re:

Luke Rowe DQ seems perfectly reasonable watching it back

https://streamable.com/71vjt

Really? Seems the opposite to me. He didn't want to cut through those people.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Luke Rowe DQ seems perfectly reasonable watching it back

https://streamable.com/71vjt

Really? Seems the opposite to me. He didn't want to cut through those people.

It was completely stupid and unnecessary to ride inbetween the spectators there.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Sagan with a pretty poor ride again today. He was riding extremely passively since he obviously realise he isn't in a shape that allows him to race differently - still, its kinda funny in the light of his recent comments about making a show. Not much show today apart from one, maybe two relatively weak and unsustainable attacks which never were going to amount to anything since he is a pretty poor rouleur at this moment. Still, he was the marginally the strongest on Paterberg, but I honestly don't think he could have raced different - had he been more aggressive he would simply have burnt himself out and wouldn't be able to put that kinda effort forth at that point. So I don't really dont buy into Sagan riding tactically bad today - no matter the circumstance he would have very little chances of winning.

I enjoyed todays race. It obviously wasn't 2017-esque, but a solid race which you always can expect out of RVV. As suspected and predicted by everyone, more or less, Gilbert, GVA and Sagan are all on a level below their 2017-shape which means everyone are pretty equal. It was a unpredictable race, but in the end, it was probably a very expected outcome - a QS win.

 

[macbindle]

Not so sure about Rowe. It looks like he was pushed to the right, took the bike path to avoid a lamp post but couldn't get back off it because a couple of spectators moved into his line. It's clear he braked hard. Seems a bit harsh to DQ him.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Solo win for Terpstra completely as expected. But wow, what a ride by Pedersen!

 

[LiquidCrystalDynamic]

Re: Re:

So, who's won both PR and RVV in the 2000s? Boonen, Cancellara, Van Petegem, and now Terpstra? That's a short list.

Spot on. If Terpstra were a Flandrian, he'd be regarded as a legend.

I say this as a person who is half Flemish.

Next week that list will be a little less short.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re:

Sagan with a pretty poor ride again today. He was riding extremely passively since he obviously realise he isn't in a shape that allows him to race differently - still, its kinda funny in the light of his recent comments about making a show. Not much show today apart from one, maybe two relatively weak and unsustainable attacks which never were going to amount to anything since he is a pretty poor rouleur at this moment. Still, he was the marginally the strongest on Paterberg, but I honestly don't think he could have raced different - had he been more aggressive he would simply have burnt himself out and wouldn't be able to put that kinda effort forth at that point. So I don't really dont buy into Sagan riding tactically bad today - no matter the circumstance he would have very little chances of winning.

I enjoyed todays race. It obviously wasn't 2017-esque, but a solid race which you always can expect out of RVV. As suspected and predicted by everyone, more or less, Gilbert, GVA and Sagan are all on a level below their 2017-shape which means everyone are pretty equal. It was a unpredictable race, but in the end, it was probably a very expected outcome - a QS win.

Now I have to agree

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

Luke Rowe DQ seems perfectly reasonable watching it back

https://streamable.com/71vjt

Really? Seems the opposite to me. He didn't want to cut through those people.

It was completely stupid and unnecessary to ride inbetween the spectators there.

Strange how we see it so differently. I'm thinking from cyclist perspective, that looked a lot different. Could have even been a split second of inattention. In any case, I certainly don't think it warranted a DQ.

 

[RedheadDane]

Re:

So, who's won both PR and RVV in the 2000s? Boonen, Cancellara, Van Petegem, and now Terpstra? That's a short list.

Aren't we technically in the 2010s now?

 

[vladimir]

Re: Re:

Laporte abandons. It's anyone's race now.

Oh that's too bad! With Laporte out I don't know if anybody will be able to upset the Quickstep train.

Maaaaaaaarten saw it coming first. He wins the prophet award for this edition of the Ronde :lol: