86th Tour de Suisse (2.UWT) // June 11th - 18th 2023

[Landeirovic]

the 1st 17km Evenepoel will be able to take time on Skjelmose and Ayuso. but the last 8.7km I see Evenepoel losing time. 1.6km 8.2% and then another km 3-4% with then 4km of descent.

Here.

 

[Landeirovic]

because Evenepoel doesn't impress me this round when it goes uphill and certainly when the % are quite high. that piece of 8.2% are strips of 12% I see a skjelmose and Ayuso there taking time on Evenepoel. and that has to do with the form she showed this round.

🤷‍♂️

 

[Danskebjerge]

I dont think that needs to take anything from the winners.

And yet it kind of does.

I'm not saying the statements are necessarily wrong. I just find cycling more interesting when there is a wide range of potential winners of a race.

 

[HelloDolly]

Looks like Evenepol is too old already !!!

I couldnt bring myself to watch anymore of this race since Thursday but just saw the results now

The new Eddie Merkx needs to hurry up and win a GT or he will be passed by

 

[Lequack]

Lanterne rouge

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jP2DR_juGXM

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

Please, no, it‘s like a queen stage finishing on the Zoncolan.

With Monte Crostis as tiny warmup.

 

[nightowl]

In his defense it looks like AG2R still have that Romain Bardet era performance handicap in ITT's.

Gall might be 'bad' in time trials but I think we'd need to see him in a better team with better equipment before a final judgement (although if someone has evidence of a top ITT performance from an AG2R rider in recent years, I'll stand corrected).

O’Connor was 5th in the Dauphiné TT less than 30 seconds behind Vingo, so they must be able to give riders at least a reasonably good set-up.

Even from the first pedal stroke today Gall clearly looked very uncomfortable on the bike so I find it hard to believe they’ve done much to optimize his TTing. After his performances this week I’d expect that to change though

 

[Escarabajo]

Looks like Evenepol is too old already !!!

I couldnt bring myself to watch anymore of this race since Thursday but just saw the results now

The new Eddie Merkx needs to hurry up and win a GT or he will be passed by

He already did!

 

[search]

Gall only turned into a GC rider the past couple of weeks. Initially his main goal was to go stage hunting in the Giro, and races like Itzulia or Trentino didn't have a time trial anyway.

He improved a lot on the climbs this year, and not having an eye on time trialing in the meantime is completely fine, I think. He can start working on that next winter.

 

[HelloDolly]

He already did!

Yes but I meant the Tour

 

[Nick2413]

This TT made for a very exciting lawn mowing experience. Thought Ayuso would get the GC but very nice comeback by Skjelmose. Not sure how aggressively he planned to negative split but that was quality stuff. I don’t think Remco is in that bad of form, this was a nice ride by the top 2 and about on par with what I’d expect from Remco in a hilly TT.

Overall the tour was maybe the most exciting stage race of the year aside from the tragedy. In the end the guy with the reputation for having the most bad days was the only one without a bad day and won. Feeling a bit bad for Gall, not sure how his TT is quite this bad but maybe his team will get him some resources for that now. I think Ayuso is the provisional Vuelta favorite and his TT has moved up a full tier this year.

 

[dazaau]

This TT made for a very exciting lawn mowing experience. Thought Ayuso would get the GC but very nice comeback by Skjelmose. Not sure how aggressively he planned to negative split but that was quality stuff. I don’t think Remco is in that bad of form, this was a nice ride by the top 2 and about on par with what I’d expect from Remco in a hilly TT.

Overall the tour was maybe the most exciting stage race of the year aside from the tragedy. In the end the guy with the reputation for having the most bad days was the only one without a bad day and won. Feeling a bit bad for Gall, not sure how his TT is quite this bad but maybe his team will get him some resources for that now. I think Ayuso is the provisional Vuelta favorite and his TT has moved up a full tier this year.

Was a great stage race for sure. Never sure who would win it, and this was reflected in the TT, which was plenty entertaining

 

[jaylew]

All the young guns hitting age 23-24 years old set to dominate cycling.


Ayuso says hold my beer.

I really hope so. I need a GT guy to get behind.

One of the sad things about cycling these years is that every time one of the usual suspects loses, people say it's because they're out of shape.

I hear you but it's nothing new. We've (cycling fans) been doing that for years. And it's often true. I'm not a Remco fan by any stretch but it would be silly to suggest he was in top form. That said, Ayuso is likely not at top form either, nor is Wout. Hell, for all we know, half the top 10 could have not been on their top form. . Sure, we can speculate based on rider comparisons, past results, rider/team comments, etc...but we never truly know how fit a rider is compared to their current max capacity. At some point you just have to appreciate and value a win. since you are almost never going to have all contenders at 100% of their capacity

I often wonder what it would be like if we could see a rider's actual form % displayed above them on screen at all times like it was a Black Mirror episode. "Look, Simon Yates is at 91%, I wonder if he can beat 85% Pogacar and 95% Gaudu"

 

[Ulle97]

I really hope so. I need a GT guy to get behind.

I hear you but it's nothing new. We've (cycling fans) been doing that for years. And it's often true. I'm not a Remco fan by any stretch but it would be silly to suggest he was in top form. That said, Ayuso is likely not at top form either, nor is Wout. Hell, for all we know, half the top 10 could have not been on their top form. . Sure, we can speculate based on rider comparisons, past results, rider/team comments, etc...but we never truly know how fit a rider is compared to their current max capacity. At some point you just have to appreciate and value a win. since you are almost never going to have all contenders at 100% of their capacity

I often wonder what it would be like if we could see a rider's actual form % displayed above them on screen at all times like it was a Black Mirror episode. "Look, Simon Yates is at 91%, I wonder if he can beat 85% Pogacar and 95% Gaudu"

Fantastic point and one that applies to all sports. Sometimes you just have to go in there and perform to the best of your ability relative to your condition/form.


Well done to Skjelmose on a great win.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Gall only turned into a GC rider the past couple of weeks. Initially his main goal was to go stage hunting in the Giro, and races like Itzulia or Trentino didn't have a time trial anyway.

He improved a lot on the climbs this year, and not having an eye on time trialing in the meantime is completely fine, I think. He can start working on that next winter.

They send him to a big altitude training camp during the Giro.

 

[staubsauger]

In the end Gall was the decision-maker of the 2023 Tour de Suisse. His attack towards Leukerbad exposed Ayuso!

Dunno whether Evenepoel & Skjelmose would've been tempted to knockout the Spaniard as well!

 

[search]

They send him to a big altitude training camp during the Giro.

but not to practice time trialing, I guess?!

What I meant to say is that (I think) it made sense for him to focus on other things first.

 

[Danskebjerge]

I hear you but it's nothing new. We've (cycling fans) been doing that for years. And it's often true. I'm not a Remco fan by any stretch but it would be silly to suggest he was in top form. That said, Ayuso is likely not at top form either, nor is Wout. Hell, for all we know, half the top 10 could have not been on their top form. .

Yeah, and if Skjelmose and Ayuso had not raced, Evenepoel would have won, and his supremacy would have been praised even more.

As mentioned, it may very well be true that if one of those from another planet doesn't win, it is because he is under-performing. And it's not like it's a new phenomenon - it's just more common when there is a big gap between the riders' capabilities.

I often wonder what it would be like if we could see a rider's actual form % displayed above them on screen at all times like it was a Black Mirror episode. "Look, Simon Yates is at 91%, I wonder if he can beat 85% Pogacar and 95% Gaudu"

Some years ago, the heartrate of the riders was actually displayed during races. I guess there were good reasons for it not to be continued. If you also know what a rival's maximum heart rate is, you can pretty much calculate how to beat him.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

everybody needs to stop acting like we've seen top evenepoel here and he's been surpassed. The guy did like a week and some days of training between the giro and this. Base level Evenepoel was enough to finish 3rd in Suisse. I'm not a big fan but don't kid yourselves and think he's washed on the basis of this.

 

[tobydawq]

Wout - at 28 - is a grizzled veteran? Do you want to make me feel old?

I always think of you as grizzled.

 

[Bushman]

everybody needs to stop acting like we've seen top evenepoel here and he's been surpassed. The guy did like a week and some days of training between the giro and this. Base level Evenepoel was enough to finish 3rd in Suisse. I'm not a big fan but don't kid yourselves and think he's washed on the basis of this.

I believe one can acknowledge that this was not the best version of Remco and still feel like he might have big trouble with Ayuso come La Vuelta. IMO Evenepoel still has some questions to answer with regards to his climbing ability. Not in terms of being a very good climber (which he already is) but in terms of being able to match the best climbers in the world (Vingegaard, Pogacar, and I have a hunch that Ayuso sooner rather than later will belong in this bracket, too).