Antoine Vayer

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TheSpud

Jul 3, 2014
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Not sure if this is the right place but as he was linked to Festina I thought I'd try here. I'm pretty sure I have read a book (in English) by / about Vayer that covers his life - as a school teacher and later with Festina.

I cannot find it in my bookshelf or online. Have I dreamt this? Anyone know if this exists or what its called?

Apologies if this is the wrong forum.

Thanks
 
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Parker

Mar 4, 2011
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There's no Vayer biography that's for sure. Why would there be?

On the other hand there was a book he self published called "Je Suis Le Cycliste Masque" which claimed to be the opinions of a peloton insider, but was most likely just Vayer's opinions.

Some media like to flock around Vayer because he tells them what they want to hear. He's not a credible sports scientist, real sports scientists have described him as a fraud and clown.. He defines himself by his time as a coach at Festina. Either he knew all about the doping or he was a gulliable front, a stooge.

The only talent he has is for self publicity. And journalists who were burnt by Armstrong lap it up.
 
T

TheSpud

Jul 3, 2014
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Parker said:
There's no Vayer biography that's for sure. Why would there be?

On the other hand there was a book he self published called "Je Suis Le Cycliste Masque" which claimed to be the opinions of a peloton insider, but was most likely just Vayer's opinions.

Some media like to flock around Vayer because he tells them what they want to hear. He's not a credible sports scientist, real sports scientists have described him as a fraud and clown.. He defines himself by his time as a coach at Festina. Either he knew all about the doping or he was a gulliable front, a stooge.

The only talent he has is for self publicity. And journalists who were burnt by Armstrong lap it up.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, I'm not claiming he's a guru or anything, I'm just convinced I have read about him / his story somewhere and I cant find it and its annoying me!
 
fmk_RoI

fmk_RoI

Sep 16, 2010
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Possibly you're mixing up the Bassons book with other things you know? Short of the Voet one it's the only English-language book that covers that subject (excluding the Abt/Whittle/Fotheringham books that look at the 98 Tour).

Agree with Parker on him being a bit of a PR manipulator. Try getting him to actually answer a question...
 
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TheSpud

Jul 3, 2014
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Thanks both - I have the Bassons book, and re-read Breaking the Chain the other day. I'll check out that interview.
 
Logic-is-your-friend

Logic-is-your-friend

Jun 7, 2011
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Le breton said:
You must have a very selective reading of his tweets.
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Oh? Well, maybe. I don't know. I never read all his tweets and have stopped reading them since last year. Can you show us some tweets where he points fingers to French riders of this generation currently in the peloton? Like he does on a regular basis with other riders? Or is it only French riders that ride for French teams that are clean? Or am i talking about the wrong twitter account? I see there are multiple "Antoine Vayer" accounts on Twitter, tweeting about cycling, so that's actually very possible, i guess.

Edit: nope, Festinaboy... that's the one i was talking about.
Edit2: apparently i'm not the only one thinking so:

#pinotetgaudusontlesdeuxseulsmecscleansdanslepeloton

https://twitter.com/x/status/1159233893654028288
View: https://twitter.com/SaDefourny/status/1159233893654028288

https://twitter.com/x/status/1182318658925858818
View: https://twitter.com/EganBernaal/status/1182318658925858818
 
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Le breton

Nov 10, 2009
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Vayer has been pretty quiet recently, for some time actually; I check his Chronoswatts messages from time to time. There he hands the reins over to Portoleau and his calculations, physics is blind to nationality. I guess his criticisms towards French racers (and trainers, managers) maybe more subdued than towards other nationalities, but I perceive them as just as real.
In any case, since 1998 he has made an impact and it has become very difficult to ridicule calculations (as was so common before) based on physics and facts. Others, like Ammatti Pyöraïly and Mihail Cazacu are on the same wavelength.
 
M

Merckx index

Jul 27, 2010
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The available numbers support what Vaughters is saying. Remco's reported 10-20 min power numbers are about the same as what Pinot reported back in 2013. If someone can show that his sustained power numbers during a race or ITT are that high, or higher, then doping suspicions would get much more traction.
 
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L'arriviste

L'arriviste

Feb 23, 2010
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Le breton said:
Vayer has been pretty quiet recently, for some time actually; I check his Chronoswatts messages from time to time. There he hands the reins over to Portoleau and his calculations, physics is blind to nationality. I guess his criticisms towards French racers (and trainers, managers) maybe more subdued than towards other nationalities, but I perceive them as just as real.
In any case, since 1998 he has made an impact and it has become very difficult to ridicule calculations (as was so common before) based on physics and facts. Others, like Ammatti Pyöraïly and Mihail Cazacu are on the same wavelength.
Click to expand...

I had a chat with him last year in person. He was a bit tired with all the travelling but he did give me the impression that, although he didn't like what he was seeing, he had no clear explanation for it and it frustrated him. Same for any of us, really. Whatever his online output, and a lot of that is beyond the pale, I found him quite likeable.
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
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L'arriviste said:
I had a chat with him last year in person. He was a bit tired with all the travelling but he did give me the impression that, although he didn't like what he was seeing, he had no clear explanation for it and it frustrated him. Same for any of us, really. Whatever his online output, and a lot of that is beyond the pale, I found him quite likeable.
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No explanation as in didn't have an idea what the cocktails were/what's going around?
 
L

Le breton

Nov 10, 2009
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Parker said:
...He's not a credible sports scientist, real sports scientists have described him as a fraud and clown....
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Has he ever claimed to be a sports scientist? Could you source such a claim from Vayer?
Also : could you name some of the sports scientists who have described him as a fraud and clown ?
Are you a sports scientist?
Thanks for your answers.
 
L

Le breton

Nov 10, 2009
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L'arriviste said:
... Whatever his online output, and a lot of that is beyond the pale, I found him quite likeable...
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He irritates me when he states "facts" that he doesn't actually support with evidence/data.
Glad to read that he can sometimes be pleasant :)
 
P

Parker

Mar 4, 2011
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Le breton said:
Has he ever claimed to be a sports scientist? Could you source such a claim from Vayer?
Also : could you name some of the sports scientists who have described him as a fraud and clown ?
Are you a sports scientist?
Thanks for your answers.
Click to expand...


He's often billed as a Professor of Sports Science (a mistranslation of PE teacher) and doesn't correct it and he presents himself as a scientist

Fredrick Grappe from FdJ has. Most were a few years ago on twitter. So I can't name them, but I remember how the French scientists viewed him (and Pierre Sallet)

No, but I know a fair bit about data analysis
 
fmk_RoI

fmk_RoI

Sep 16, 2010
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Well, he's lost a platform:
L'Humanité later unpublished the Espé cartoon and Vayer’s chronicle and issued an apology to Rousse.

“We totally share the indignation at this drawing. We quickly unpublished it. It is contrary to the values of L'Humanité, which promotes the dignity of human beings and the feminist struggle. We ask Marion Rousse to excuse us for this lack of vigilance."

L'Humanité also issued a statement to AFP, which was reported in La Presse, saying the publication had ended its collaboration with Espé and Vayer.

“Such a publication is contrary to the history of the newspaper," the statement read. "All those who read us regularly know that our titles fight daily for the emancipation of women and defend values of universal equality. We hope that the lack of vigilance which has led to this situation will not be repeated. We are delighted with the end of the collaboration between our daily, the designer Espé and the chronicler Antoine Vayer, whose texts the latter illustrated."

Vayer defended the drawing on his Twitter account, drawing a parallel with the Charlie Hebdo cartoons.
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pastronef

Aug 19, 2011
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L'arriviste said:
I had a chat with him last year in person. He was a bit tired with all the travelling but he did give me the impression that, although he didn't like what he was seeing, he had no clear explanation for it and it frustrated him. Same for any of us, really. Whatever his online output, and a lot of that is beyond the pale, I found him quite likeable.
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likeable? wtf his twitter feed is 24/7 accusations, finger ponting, hints, mocking. he´s off his head. it´s a continous stream of tweets and hints and free accusation and jokes and mocking. ffs, he even has a jouno pass. but finally serves him well that L´Humanité ended its collaboration with him after the Marion Rousse awful drawings and his comments on that.
 
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macbindle

macbindle

Dec 22, 2017
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Vayer is a publicity seeker jumping on the doping band wagon. His problem is that he just isnt very good at it.
 
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Mayomaniac

Mayomaniac

Apr 10, 2019
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pastronef said:
likeable? wtf his twitter feed is 24/7 accusations, finger ponting, hints, mocking. he´s off his head. it´s a continous stream of tweets and hints and free accusation and jokes and mocking. ffs, he even has a jouno pass. but finally serves him well that L´Humanité ended its collaboration with him after the Marion Rousse awful drawings and his comments on that.
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Those drawings were tasteless and also really disrespectful, she's a former cyclist after all an more than qualified to do her job.
Vayer looks like the yellow press version of the guys who actually do serious calculations about w/kg, it's all about headlines and clickbait.
 
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