Antoine Vayer

[42x16ss]

I'm not necessarily a fan of Antoine Vayer. He's weird but weirdness can go both ways : good and bad.

I think he's not very good at PR since he is annoying so many people. That said, who else puts a spotlight on "suspicious" performances ? I don't really see anyone else in the press or social media question the speeds and performances of the peloton (except for the clinic, obv.). And the data shows that 2020 has quite few ascents records up its sleeve. Maybe it's not that bad to have people look into that.

Also, I find the way people complain about him very close to some sort of bashing, which is very typical of... Omerta. And IMO everything i better than Omerta.

It kind of echoes that Irish journalist who questioned an American classics rider a few years ago doesn't it.

 

[macbindle]

It was after Festina he started using his sports physiology background and knowledge to assess riders performance and willingly admits he was naive.

You think he was naive? I dont.

Working with a massive doping team during an era where everyone knew that doping was ubiquitous...and poor little Antoine couldn't see what was going on right under his nose?

Yerrite

 

[42x16ss]

You think he was naive? I dont.

Working with a massive doping team during an era where everyone knew that doping was ubiquitous...and poor little Antoine couldn't see what was going on right under his nose?

Yerrite

Even so. It doesn't automatically discount an informed opinion.

There's a reason reformed hackers are readily hired as IT Security experts...

 

[Skele]

I don't think Vayer has ever been close to an expert on doping though.
Wasn't he just a soigneur or something?


- Training coach apparantly, but coming from a job as a physical education teacher i don't think he was the big brain behind their doping scheme.

 

[Parker]

I don't think Vayer has ever been close to an expert on doping though.

He worked for Festina. He was close to lots of experts on doping.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Drop it like it's hot.

L'Humanité criticised for publishing sexist cartoon of Marion Rousse

French news outlet severs ties with columnist Antoine Vayer and cartoonist Espé

www.cyclingnews.com

 

[macbindle]

Like I said before, Vayer is a pure idiot

 

[Le breton]

Like I said before, Vayer is a pure idiot

And very knowledgeable at that. He kept all the files of the hundreds of stress tests that he ran for the Festina team in 1998 (maybe 1997 also, I don't know). In the early 2000's I saw on his (?) website (Alternativ) tests implying that Brochard most likely had a VO2 max exceeding 100 ml/kg.sec. and emailed him to ask about calibration issues.
He never answered but the graph in question disappeared as well as most of the "interesting" stuff on Alternativ.
From then on I printed compromising info as soon as it appeared, for example on Cyclingnews, about Froome (Vuelta 2011) or in the Tour de Romandie about Hamilton's famous 132.9 value on a famous test score (name escapes me.
Maybe before calling him an idiot you might wonder how others consider you.

 

[macbindle]

He is still a pure idiot.

See previous posts about his time at Festina.

 

[Rackham]

Drop it like it's hot.

L'Humanité criticised for publishing sexist cartoon of Marion Rousse

French news outlet severs ties with columnist Antoine Vayer and cartoonist Espé

www.cyclingnews.com

"lol"

Marion Rousse, aka a former "pro" with merely a 3 year career who landed a job as TV co-commentator (after having done several risqué sexy photoshoots as well), i.e. a woman who jumped from one yellow jersey (her former husband Tony Gallopin) to another (Julian Alaphilippe who she now poses with "romantically" & ostensibly on social media), handpicked & reposted a poorly done cartoon which clumsily exposed her bias which she cried about all over Instagram, stomped her feet online, got an army of white knights to defend her honor (including entire media outlets, politicians & TV networks) & "conveniently" got Vayer (aka literally one of the most famous anti-doping figures in France) fired.

Yeah, I wasn't born yesterday. Personally I believe Vayer is a bit of an eccentric dinosaur, but I'll be damned before I take the agendas & games played by the likes of Marion Rousse & Julian Alaphilippe at face value.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Wow, you have issues. Serious issues.

 

[Rackham]

Wow, you have issues. Serious issues.

Are you talking to me? Really?

So the guy (Alaphilippe) who rode a mutant time trial last year & performed way, way above his level in the Tour 2019 + his careerist girlfriend who quit her husband to hook up with the new "star" of French cycling are the "normal ones" whilst I have issues for defending Vayer aka a man who I don't even particularly support because he's often hit & miss with his assessments!

...

Okie dokie. Wake me up when you wake up.

 

[Sciatic]

"lol"

Marion Rousse, aka a former "pro" with merely a 3 year career who landed a job as TV co-commentator (after having done several risqué sexy photoshoots as well), i.e. a woman who jumped from one yellow jersey (her former husband Tony Gallopin) to another (Julian Alaphilippe who she now poses with "romantically" & ostensibly on social media), handpicked & reposted a poorly done cartoon which clumsily exposed her bias which she cried about all over Instagram, stomped her feet online, got an army of white knights to defend her honor (including entire media outlets, politicians & TV networks) & "conveniently" got Vayer (aka literally one of the most famous anti-doping figures in France) fired.

Yeah, I wasn't born yesterday. Personally I believe Vayer is a bit of an eccentric dinosaur, but I'll be damned before I take the agendas & games played by the likes of Marion Rousse & Julian Alaphilippe at face value.

It’s the 21st century dude. It seems you’re the sensitive one here, especially that you seem appalled about her personal life when that has nothing to do with ability to do commentary and interviews.
Personally, I don’t understand the sometimes abhorrent reaction to cartoon caricatures, because they’re well, caricatures, and not meant to be fair representations of an individual. They necessarily hyper-exaggerate the looks that people recognize about that person. This one (Rousse) was particularly offensive though, because it plays off the damaging sexism that undermines women’s professional strengths or qualities.

 

[Rackham]

It’s the 21st century dude. It seems you’re the sensitive one here, especially that you seem appalled about her personal life when that has nothing to do with ability to do commentary and interviews.

It's merely a distraction. The Humanité outlet in which the cartoon originated is a miniscule communist paper which is read by a handful of dinosaurs. No one would have even seen the image... if Rousse herself hadn't reposted it. Now Vayer is fired. Wonderful, let's not ask questions, right?

Don't insult my intelligence, don't mix current-year identity politics with the conversation & don't fall into the trap of allowing pseudo 2020 (which you used yourself) virtue signalling to mask the fact we're fully allowed to believe neither Rousse nor Alaphilippe are genuine, especially when those current-year feminist political weapons are used as a shield against more "interesting" questions regarding Alapihilippe's performances & her own careerism.

We used to able to discuss this stuff without a barrage of white knights with itchy pseudo moralistic trigger fingers just waiting to scream "you have issues! you're sexist" etc. at people who question the rich & powerful + their agendas.

 

[red_flanders]

I thought the cartoon made Alaphillipe look worse than Rousse. Pretty bad either way though, I can't imagine giving the green light to something like that, it's just unnecessary. Whatever one thinks of Rousse and whatever gold-digger trope one wants to roll out.

That said, firing people over this kind of thing is way, way over the top. It amounts to silencing.

 

[RedheadDane]

Are you talking to me? Really?

So the guy (Alaphilippe) who rode a mutant time trial last year & performed way, way above his level in the Tour 2019 + his careerist girlfriend who quit her husband to hook up with the new "star" of French cycling are the "normal ones" whilst I have issues for defending Vayer aka a man who I don't even particularly support because he's often hit & miss with his assessments!

Do we actually know that Rousse left Gallopin for Alaphillipe? The marriage might just not have worked out for whatever reason.

 

[fmk_RoI]

We used to able to discuss this stuff without a barrage of white knights with itchy pseudo moralistic trigger fingers just waiting to scream "you have issues! you're sexist" etc. at people who question the rich & powerful + their agendas.

God I miss those days. And the slaves, I miss them too. We really need to get back to the good ol' days and get rid of all this com'nist virtue signalling.

 

[macbindle]

It's merely a distraction. The Humanité outlet in which the cartoon originated is a miniscule communist paper which is read by a handful of dinosaurs. No one would have even seen the image... if Rousse herself hadn't reposted it. Now Vayer is fired. Wonderful, let's not ask questions, right?

Don't insult my intelligence, don't mix current-year identity politics with the conversation & don't fall into the trap of allowing pseudo 2020 (which you used yourself) virtue signalling to mask the fact we're fully allowed to believe neither Rousse nor Alaphilippe are genuine, especially when those current-year feminist political weapons are used as a shield against more "interesting" questions regarding Alapihilippe's performances & her own careerism.

We used to able to discuss this stuff without a barrage of white knights with itchy pseudo moralistic trigger fingers just waiting to scream "you have issues! you're sexist" etc. at people who question the rich & powerful + their agendas.

Err.....yeah.

Some issues there.

 

[Rackham]

Err.....yeah.

Some issues there.

We're in a forum where doping is often pronounced based on zero hard truth, merely educated guesses, conjecture, motive & suspect behaviors.

Yet here I am getting current year dogmatic politics thrown in my face (including the ubiquitous "you have mental health issues!!" insult which is a cliché at this point & another clown screaming about slavery above...) because I dare suggest a rich TV journalist & her rich cycling boyfriend (with himself suspect performances) are not exactly trustworthy or legitimate in their moral outrage over this cartoon (especially considering the target of their ire, aka Vayer).

Pas normal. But I won't beat my head against this particular wall any longer.

 

[macbindle]

You managed to get in all the current right-wing tropes (identity politics, virtue signalling) into a post dripping with misogyny.

You could have just talked about doping/not doping instead.

 

[Rackham]

You managed to get in all the current right-wing tropes (identity politics, virtue signalling) into a post dripping with misogyny.

You could have just talked about doping/not doping instead.

Wrong. That's just the part some people chose to lose their minds over because they've been conditioned into a dogmatic, aggressive response against wrong-think (like sniffer dogs). People could easily focus on the fact Rousse & Alaphilippe are not saints & not trustworthy, but they allow current-year politics to dictate their thinking when rich celebrities & sports people (Rousse, for example) manipulate it & use it as a shield.

That's their problem, not mine.

 

[fmk_RoI]

That's their problem, not mine.

Oh we know that's not your problem. We know your problem is waaaaaay different.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

This stuff isn’t even sexist in some generic sense, it’s really intensely misogynistic. Both the cartoon and certain comments in this thread.

 

[RedheadDane]

People could easily focus on the fact Rousse & Alaphilippe are not saints & not trustworthy

What exactly have they done that's so morally questionable? Okay, Alaphilippe got sort of indirectly implicated in that case with the female rider because his coach, and cousin, was also the female rider's coach, but that doesn't really have anything to do with the debate at hand.

 

[BlueRoads]

Maybe people would listen more to doping-questions regarding for instance Alaphilippe, if it was done in a more scientific, reasonable and less personal/ vulgar way.
As to bias from tv-commentators: it's there everywhere in cycling, tv-commentary towards riders from the same country is pretty much always extremely biased, the "own" riders are always the nicest, most admirable ones, nobody has to sleep with anybody for that...