Best All-Rounder Rider Today?

[Midnightfright]

If we ranked each rider based on say 7 skills, we could figure this out better.

I say sprinting, hills, mountains, TT, descending, flat, & cobbles, with each rider given a number in relation to other riders.

I am going to add in Scarponi & Samu to satisfy some posters

Okay so:
Sprint = EBH>GILBERT>VALVERDE>EVANS>SCARPONI>SAMU>MARTIN>CONTADOR>NIBALI>WIGGINS

Hills = PG>AV>CE>SS>AC>MS>VN>EBH>BW>TM

Mountains = AC>SS>MS>AV>VN>CE>BW>EBH>TM>PG

TT = TM>BW>AC>CE>MS>VN>EBH>SS>AV>PG

Descending = SS>VN>CE>AC>AV>EBH>PG>MS>BW>TM

Flat = TM>EBH>BW>CE>PG>VN>MS>AC>AV>SS

Cobbles = EBH>PG>CE>AV>VN>TM>MS>BW>AC>SS

Totals:
Evans 47
EBH 44
Valverde 41
Gilbert 40
Contador 39
Nibali 37
Scarponi & Samu 36
Martin 33
Wiggins 29

This is obviously not all that accurate of a method,but it is interesting to think about.

I don't agree with some of the orders that you have done but it seems like a sound principal. For example I've never seen Cadel do anything in a Sprint that wasn't on a hill and I would put that down to his being an excellent hilly rider. I certainly have no problem with Cadel as most rounder rider though when I do the ranking system EBH comes out on top but obviously its subjective.

 

[El Pistolero]

In what world does Samuel Sanchez and Contador descend better than Philippe Gilbert? Lol.

Gilbert has out-descended both already, give him some more credit.

Edvald Boasson Hagen better than Phil on the cobbles? Again, in what world?

EBH can't win any GT or Monument. How's that for all-round lol.

 

[Midnightfright]

In what world does Samuel Sanchez and Contador descend better than Philippe Gilbert? Lol.

Gilbert has out-descended both already, give him some more credit.

Edvald Boasson Hagen better than Phil on the cobbles? Again, in what world?

EBH can't win any GT or Monument. How's that for all-round lol.

He hasn't won a monument it doesn't mean he can't. On guessing most of the people on the list havdnt won a GT or monument at his age altough I do agree that he will never win any GT.

 

[El Pistolero]

He hasn't won a monument it doesn't mean he can't. On guessing most of the people on the list havdnt won a GT or monument at his age altough I do agree that he will never win any GT.

What results does he have in the Monuments? Nothing to suggest he'll win one in the future. He's a guy who peaked early, should be taken into account as well as these guys usually fade out quicker. He can very well go on to win Monuments in a few years, but so far none of his results seem to indicate that. Hence he can't win one. This isn't a thread about best all-rounder in the future. Otherwise you might as well pick Sagan.

 

[Midnightfright]

What results does he have in the Monuments? Nothing to suggest he'll win one in the future. He's a guy who peaked early, should be taken into account as well as these guys usually fade out quicker. He can very well go on to win Monuments in a few years, but so far none of his results seem to indicate that. Hence he can't win one. This isn't a thread about best all-rounder in the future. Otherwise you might as well pick Sagan.

I was digressing about the future i was addressing your assertion that he will never win a monument but has shown as much as his age as most monument winners will hes certainly no lock but I dont think he has peaked just like you think he has.So if your stating wether or not he can win a monument then i have to talk about the future. If you want to take diffrent sentencesand piece them together have fun. He is a great allrounder currwntly he certainly isn't supremely strong at climbing but seems very solid elsewhere. You have to remember i was using someone else's criteria when I came to that not something I pulled up myself.

 

[El Pistolero]

I was digressing about the future i was addressing your assertion that he will never win a monument but has shown as much as his age as most monument winners will hes certainly no lock but I dont think he has peaked just like you think he has.So if your stating wether or not he can win a monument then i have to talk about the future. If you want to take diffrent sentencesand piece them together have fun. He is a great allrounder currwntly he certainly isn't supremely strong at climbing but seems very solid elsewhere. You have to remember i was using someone else's criteria when I came to that not something I pulled up myself.

I never said that. Nor was my first post referred to you, but towards the guy who made that list.

 

[Midnightfright]

I never said that. Nor was my first post referred to you, but towards the guy who made that list.

Well that's fair enough my bad but you did say it after quoting me.

 

[maltiv]

What results does he have in the Monuments? Nothing to suggest he'll win one in the future. He's a guy who peaked early, should be taken into account as well as these guys usually fade out quicker. He can very well go on to win Monuments in a few years, but so far none of his results seem to indicate that. Hence he can't win one. This isn't a thread about best all-rounder in the future. Otherwise you might as well pick Sagan.

I've said this a billion times but Edvald has never done the monuments while being healthy. This year he was injured and barely made it back to RVV (where he was very offensive and generally did a surprisingly good ride) but then he broke his rib at Scheldeprijs. In 2010 he missed all the classics because of his achilles.

In 2009 he was 21 (I don't know if you remember how well Gilbert did in the ardennes at that age?)...Also he gave his bike to Hincapie in P-R. Hard to get a result without a bike.

 

[El Pistolero]

I've said this a billion times but Edvald has never done the monuments while being healthy. This year he was injured and barely made it back to RVV (where he was very offensive and generally did a surprisingly good ride) but then he broke his rib at Scheldeprijs. In 2010 he missed all the classics because of his achilles.

In 2009 he was 21 (I don't know if you remember how well Gilbert did in the ardennes at that age?)...Also he gave his bike to Hincapie in P-R. Hard to get a result without a bike.

And what was his excuse at the Canadian races? Or the Worlds this year?

I just don't see it in him right now to be honest. And this thread is about the present and not the future... You can't be the best all-rounder if everyone kicks your *** in a one day race. Especially because he won't ever win a GT.

So he can't win the 8 most important events in cycling... And he's being called one of the greatest all-rounders? I know a certain gladiator who's a far better all-rounder

 

[Midnightfright]

And what was his excuse at the Canadian races? Or the Worlds this year?

I just don't see it in him right now to be honest. And this thread is about the present and not the future... You can't be the best all-rounder if everyone kicks your *** in a one day race. Especially because he won't ever win a GT.

So he can't win the 8 most important events in cycling... And he's being called one of the greatest all-rounders? I know a certain gladiator who's a far better all-rounder

Robert Gesink?!?

 

[maltiv]

And what was his excuse at the Canadian races? Or the Worlds this year?

In the Canadian races he was 2nd in Quebec last year. In Montreal he would also have been 2nd or 3rd, but he fell on the last corner while being in the 6 man chase group. He even followed accelerations by Samuel Sanchez uphill, but of course, Gesink was too strong. So you might want to find another example.

At worlds this year he was 2nd on the road with about 100 meters to go but faded a bit and gave up, but he still ended up 8th. He wasn't in form at all though.

 

[theyoungest]

In the Canadian races he was 2nd in Quebec last year. In Montreal he would also have been 2nd or 3rd, but he fell on the last corner while being in the 6 man chase group. He even followed accelerations by Samuel Sanchez uphill, but of course, Gesink was too strong. So you might want to find another example.

At worlds this year he was 2nd on the road with about 100 meters to go but faded a bit and gave up, but he still ended up 8th. He wasn't in form at all though.

He was definitely very strong in the Canadian races last year, certainly in Montreal. The guy certainly can climb, if Greg van Avermaet can follow Gilbert and the Schlecks in LBL, why couldn't EBH?

But I think the main problem for him is the distance, he clearly doesn't have a natural talent for it. But neither did Gilbert, so there's hope.

 

[El Pistolero]

He was definitely very strong in the Canadian races last year, certainly in Montreal. The guy certainly can climb, if Greg van Avermaet can follow Gilbert and the Schlecks in LBL, why couldn't EBH?

But I think the main problem for him is the distance, he clearly doesn't have a natural talent for it. But neither did Gilbert, so there's hope.

Simple, because GVA couldn't follow the Schlecks/Phil.

 

[El Pistolero]

In the Canadian races he was 2nd in Quebec last year. In Montreal he would also have been 2nd or 3rd, but he fell on the last corner while being in the 6 man chase group. He even followed accelerations by Samuel Sanchez uphill, but of course, Gesink was too strong. So you might want to find another example.

At worlds this year he was 2nd on the road with about 100 meters to go but faded a bit and gave up, but he still ended up 8th. He wasn't in form at all though.

I'm talking about the Canadian races this year when they had a better field then last year and the races were longer and harder this year as well.

As for EBH performance at the Worlds, it was poor. How can he be a better all-rounder than let's say Cancellara if he sprints slower then him in the important races...

Why are you all talking about the future anyway? This thread is about the present. And in the present EBH can't win Monuments.

 

[theyoungest]

I'm talking about the Canadian races this year when they had a better field then last year and the races were longer and harder this year as well.

This year a huge group arrived at the finish together in Montreal, the race was partly killed by headwind. Last year the strongest riders survived.

Also, a better field? Yeah, Gilbert was there, but he wasn't in great form.

 

[maltiv]

I'm talking about the Canadian races this year when they had a better field then last year and the races were longer and harder this year as well.

Well that's just nonsense and you know it. In Montreal last year the peloton was absolutely shattered and they came in in small groups. This year was more or less a bunch sprint. It's simple, EBH wasn't in form anymore. He was exhausted after a great TDF followed by winning eneco tour and vattenfall.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Gee, Evans is not leading the poll results as best allrounder. I guess I will have to get my sockpuppet accounts out!

 

[maltiv]

As for EBH performance at the Worlds, it was poor. How can he be a better all-rounder than let's say Cancellara if he sprints slower then him in the important races...

Also, you can't just use 1 race for references like this. By your amazing logic, Rui Costa is better than Gilbert in both hills and sprints. I mean in Montreal Costa was 1st and Gilbert was 3rd. In worlds, Costa was 15th and Gilbert was 17th. Evidently, Costa must be the better rider, right?

 

[El Pistolero]

Also, you can't just use 1 race for references like this. By your amazing logic, Rui Costa is better than Gilbert in both hills and sprints. I mean in Montreal Costa was 1st and Gilbert was 3rd. In worlds, Costa was 15th and Gilbert was 17th. Evidently, Costa must be the better rider, right?

Breakaway.

Of course I can use the Worlds to compare the 2. It suited EBH more then it suited Cancellara and who finished before who? Cancellara is pretty fast, awesome at time trials, awesome at descends, awesome at cobbles, can handle him self ok in hills like he proved at the Worlds in 2009 and Olympics, can win big stage races, etc

Yet he's not in the poll and EBH has 19 votes.

 

[Angliru]

Cant see how it can be anyone other than Evans! Top 5-10 time trialler in the world, top 5-10 in the mountains, top 5 in the hills, top 10 on the downhill, great bike handler and not too bad at sprinting from a select group. Can go well in 1 week or grand tour stage race and also win classics. Valverde comes closest to him but I cant see him as a genuine GT contender these days in particular in the TDF and Giro. His TT is no where near the same level as Evans nor is his ability in the mountains!

Evans
Valverde
Contador
Boasson Hagen
Gilbert
Nibali

I recognize that you said "these days" but still the fact that he's made the Vuelta podium multiple times and did eventually win it has to still leave him as a "genuine GT contender".

 

[abbaskip]

I missed the 'he'.

Maybe that was included specifically to exclude Vos, otherwise she owns the category miles ahead of anybody else.

It's going to reach the point where by the time she's 30 she's entering men's races simply because there is literally nothing left for her to win. They'll be creating races specifically so that she can win them and then let other people have a chance the year after.

I disagree. I think Valverde would thrash Vos...hey, if we're not being sexist, we shouldn't treat her differently for being a female.

 

[The Hitch]

Sprint = EBH>GILBERT>VALVERDE>EVANS>SCARPONI>SAMU>MARTIN>CONTADOR>NIBALI>WIGGINS

Sorry but while Gilbert may have improved his sprint in the last few years, its stretching it to say hes better at it than Valverde whose been using it for almost a decade (actually 2 decades if you go back to his total dominance of the youth ranks which gave him the name "El Imbatrido" )and its one of his most important weapons.

Also I would add Cancellara to the list since he clearly is an all rounder.

Finaly, Evans and Scarponi do not have a better sprint than Samu.

Cancellara and Rebellin are both pretty decent sprinters, and when it mattered most, when the lights were on bright, Samu proved his sprint is no joke. Havent seen anything from Evans nor scarponi to rank them above him.

Id have it as

EBH> Sagan> Valverde> Gilbert> Cancellara> Samu> the rest pretty equal.

 

[cineteq]

Also I would add Cancellara to the list since he clearly is an all rounder.

Yup, Cancellara is definitely an all-rounder that can't climb.

 

[cineteq]

If we ranked each rider based on say 7 skills, we could figure this out better.

I say sprinting, hills, mountains, TT, descending, flat, & cobbles, with each rider given a number in relation to other riders.

I am going to add in Scarponi & Samu to satisfy some posters

Okay so:
Sprint = EBH>GILBERT>VALVERDE>EVANS>SCARPONI>SAMU>MARTIN>CONTADOR>NIBALI>WIGGINS

Hills = PG>AV>CE>SS>AC>MS>VN>EBH>BW>TM

Mountains = AC>SS>MS>AV>VN>CE>BW>EBH>TM>PG

TT = TM>BW>AC>CE>MS>VN>EBH>SS>AV>PG

Descending = SS>VN>CE>AC>AV>EBH>PG>MS>BW>TM

Flat = TM>EBH>BW>CE>PG>VN>MS>AC>AV>SS

Cobbles = EBH>PG>CE>AV>VN>TM>MS>BW>AC>SS

Totals:
Evans 47
EBH 44
Valverde 41
Gilbert 40
Contador 39
Nibali 37
Scarponi & Samu 36
Martin 33
Wiggins 29

This is obviously not all that accurate of a method,but it is interesting to think about.

I like your point system, just don't agree completely on how you rated the riders, but the results kind of make sense.

 

[The Hitch]

Yup, Cancellara is definitely an all-rounder that can't climb.

did you see the Mendrisio worlds?