Bjarne Riis, saved by silence?

[TourOfSardinia]

At least Vino only resorted to sending a letter to Nibali.
This is another order of magnitude.

HAMLET/Rijs
  O, I die, Horatio....
The rest is silence/ometa

 

[Tonton]

For Riis (or Wonderboy, and soon Vino - I hope), I would have liked an epilogue with handcuffs or being booed off the sport by an angry mob of spectators, but I'll take what I can get. Adios Bjarne. No team in their right mind will want the PR nightmare and hire you. It sems like you stood up for your team: why don't you stand up for the sport before you fade away? You have nothing left to lose: sing us a song.

 

[mrhender]

Re:

For Riis (or Wonderboy, and soon Vino - I hope), I would have liked an epilogue with handcuffs or being booed off the sport by an angry mob of spectators, but I'll take what I can get. Adios Bjarne. No team in their right mind will want the PR nightmare and hire you. It sems like you stood up for your team: why don't you stand up for the sport before you fade away? You have nothing left to lose: sing us a song.

I doubt Bjarne leaving will make the team clean(er)

Also I'am sure he has interesting stories to tell..

Why should he sing a song that would only sacrifice a big portion of his "current" and former riders...?
Furthemore he would gain nothing from it whatsoever...

I understand the desire to get someone standing up for the sport but there has to be some logical incentive other than clinic morals...

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

For Riis (or Wonderboy, and soon Vino - I hope), I would have liked an epilogue with handcuffs or being booed off the sport by an angry mob of spectators, but I'll take what I can get. Adios Bjarne. No team in their right mind will want the PR nightmare and hire you. It sems like you stood up for your team: why don't you stand up for the sport before you fade away? You have nothing left to lose: sing us a song.

I doubt Bjarne leaving will make the team clean(er)

Also I'am sure he has interesting stories to tell..

Why should he sing a song that would only sacrifice a big portion of his "current" and former riders...?
Furthemore he would gain nothing from it whatsoever...

I understand the desire to get someone standing up for the sport but there has to be some logical incentive other than clinic morals...

Is there enough bad blood between the two to make Riis want to take Oleg down? That would be an incentive/motive. Doubtful IMO, probably dangerous as well. You are right that his departure won't make the team cleaner. I wish he told the stories, though. After all, Bjarne is the Forrest Gump of cycling: Big Mig, Marco, Jan, Wonderboy, Berto, The Bee Gees (Andy and Frank), he's been at the center of the golden era of doping...past and present.

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

Is there enough bad blood between the two to make Riis want to take Oleg down? That would be an incentive/motive. Doubtful IMO, probably dangerous as well. You are right that his departure won't make the team cleaner. I wish he told the stories, though. After all, Bjarne is the Forrest Gump of cycling: Big Mig, Marco, Jan, Wonderboy, Berto, The Bee Gees (Andy and Frank), he's been at the center of the golden era of doping...past and present.

If he really want's to hurt Tinkov he can start a new team with SaxoBank as sponsor...
They have always said they were sponsoring him and not the team and i'am sure they have a release clause...

Maybe even Contador and some others have a Riis clause in their contract..
That would in effect be very humuliating for Tinkov..

None of this is likely short term though..
In any case Riis is not the type to go full *** (unless on the bike)

I think Tinkov, if he want's to succeed needs a counterweight in the team to his loose cannon persona...
Only problemis he seems to be appalled by questions to his authority..

Rumors say that every time someone has spoken up to him he has either become frozen towards them or hammer them on twitter...

I think a total meltdown is possible, and that Riis is more likely to be last man standing than Tinkov...
Only it might be on a different platform (starting over again)...

 

[Samson777]

Re: Re:

Is there enough bad blood between the two to make Riis want to take Oleg down? That would be an incentive/motive. Doubtful IMO, probably dangerous as well. You are right that his departure won't make the team cleaner. I wish he told the stories, though. After all, Bjarne is the Forrest Gump of cycling: Big Mig, Marco, Jan, Wonderboy, Berto, The Bee Gees (Andy and Frank), he's been at the center of the golden era of doping...past and present.

If he really want's to hurt Tinkov he can start a new team with SaxoBank as sponsor...
They have always said they were sponsoring him and not the team and i'am sure they have a release clause...

Maybe even Contador and some others have a Riis clause in their contract..
That would in effect be very humuliating for Tinkov..

None of this is likely short term though..
In any case Riis is not the type to go full *** (unless on the bike)

I think Tinkov, if he want's to succeed needs a counterweight in the team to his loose cannon persona...
Only problemis he seems to be appalled by questions to his authority..

Rumors say that every time someone has spoken up to him he has either become frozen towards them or hammer them on twitter...

I think a total meltdown is possible, and that Riis is more likely to be last man standing than Tinkov...
Only it might be on a different platform (starting over again)...

I agree with most of your post, but not the bolded. Tinkov is many things, but a bad businessman is not one of them. Contador recently extended he's contract, no way in hell Tinkov would let him get a Riis clause.. Actually Tinkov played it "smart" letting Contador extend contract with Riis still on board, then cut out Riis. Also he used Riis as bait to get Sagan. ( plus money) Now if Contador and Sagan wants to go after the season, and there is a fairly good chance that could be the case. As it is, Tinkov will make the call. And if they go, he will get compensated.

In a another scenario; if let's say Aloson or others more serious peple, with similar plans, wants to buy a cycling team. In case Tinkov wants out after this season.Tinkov now have a World Tour licensed team, with Sagan and Contador. That is not the worst product to get, for a buyer, who wants instant fame and publicity.

This is not to say that the cycling team overall is good business. I mean what cycling team is? Obviously this is Tinkov's personal toy. But still, the idea that he would allow Contador or others such as Sagan, Majka etc. Get a Riis clause, that I want to see before I believe it.

Edit: Just realized, you bring forward the suggestion from the Chicken. Sounds weird to me from a Tinkov perspective. Plus it certainly begs the question, for how long can you be suspended? Should this be the reason, why Riis have not been fired..

Would make more sense if this has to do with Saxo Banks money. Finding a new co sponsor in the middle of the season is not that easy.

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

I agree with most of your post, but not the bolded. Tinkov is many things, but a bad businessman is not one of them. Contador recently extended he's contract, no way in hell Tinkov would let him get a Riis clause.. Actually Tinkov played it "smart" letting Contador extend contract with Riis still on board, then cut out Riis. Also he used Riis as bait to get Sagan. ( plus money) Now if Contador and Sagan wants to go after the season, and there is a fairly good chance that could be the case. As it is, Tinkov will make the call. And if they go, he will get compensated.

In a another scenario; if let's say Aloson or others more serious peple, with similar plans, wants to buy a cycling team. In case Tinkov wants out after this season.Tinkov now have a World Tour licensed team, with Sagan and Contador. That is not the worst product to get, for a buyer, who wants instant fame and publicity.

This is not to say that the cycling team overall is good business. I mean what cycling team is? Obviously this is Tinkov's personal toy. But still, the idea that he would allow Contador or others such as Sagan, Majka etc. Get a Riis clause, that I want to see before I believe it.

Edit: Just realized, you bring forward the suggestion from the Chicken. Sounds weird to me from a Tinkov perspective. Plus it certainly begs the question, for how long can you be suspended? Should this be the reason, why Riis have not been fired..

Would make more sense if this has to do with Saxo Banks money. Finding a new co sponsor in the middle of the season is not that easy.

I agree that the Riis clause for AC/Sagan seems unikely to have been "granted" by Tinkov...

But I do think Riis and Contador are confidents and that if contador have asked such clause he would have got it... Anyway I don't think much will happen this season, but that the action will come post-season and may be very dramatic depending on many factors such as:

1. Is there more to the suspension (ADD report issues)?
2. Will Tinkov be able to get the riders behind him and perform?
3. What will SaxoBank do (wait to season is over?)
4. Will the atmospheare within the team in general be productive? (staff etc)
5. What does Riis want -short term and long term? (and what can he do)

Tinkov is clearly not stupid in successful bank-bussiness from his base in Russia.
His approach to Pro-cycling however seem quite militarian and over the top counter-productive...

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Re: Re:

Tinkov is clearly not stupid in successful bank-bussiness from his base in Russia.
His approach to Pro-cycling however seem quite militarian and over the top counter-productive...

His approach to pro-cycling is most likely the same approach that netted him his successful businesses.

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

Tinkov is clearly not stupid in successful bank-bussiness from his base in Russia.
His approach to Pro-cycling however seem quite militarian and over the top counter-productive...

His approach to pro-cycling is most likely the same approach that netted him his successful businesses.

Successful businesses...we'll see. The wheel spins. I would call Oleg a Bernard Tapie...on steroids lacking the results though. Tapie got Hinault and Lemond, "won" the TdF in '85-'86, went into football and "won" the Champions' League in '93. Then he went to jail, still got the millions, is now giving them back, may go to jail again. Oleg on steroids is a Tapie Light, is under-achieving and upset about it. Ahhh, Nanard

 

[Irondan]

Re: Re:

Tinkov is clearly not stupid in successful bank-bussiness from his base in Russia.
His approach to Pro-cycling however seem quite militarian and over the top counter-productive...

His approach to pro-cycling is most likely the same approach that netted him his successful businesses.

The problem is he thinks he's a better 'Cycling' mind than Riis, and can use his experience in business to run 'his' pro cycling toy. Results to follow...

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Re: Re:

Tinkov is clearly not stupid in successful bank-bussiness from his base in Russia.
His approach to Pro-cycling however seem quite militarian and over the top counter-productive...

His approach to pro-cycling is most likely the same approach that netted him his successful businesses.

The problem is he thinks he's a better 'Cycling' mind than Riis, and can use his experience in business to run 'his' pro cycling toy. Results to follow...

Oh I have no issue with ejecting him and his attitude from the sport. I was just commenting on what seemed like a
1. he's not stupid coz business success BUT
2. man he's being militant and over the top in cycling

comparison.

 

[sniper]

as loaded with cash as Tinkov is, he should pay Gert Lienders to sing like a tropical bird.

 

[doperhopper]

Generalissimus Tin reveals yet another piece of wisdom to the world, nice wtf tweet (thou save the Universe from masonic Bjarne?):


Oleg Tinkov @olegtinkov · 5h 5 hours ago

For Masonic Denmark,it'shard to understand that people follow religious traditions and stay 8 weeks without meat,alcohol #OrthodoxChristian
5 retweets 7 favorites

 

[doperhopper]

Btw, Oleg is even proud of "his way" of doing bussiness (my imperfect translation of not russian nor english native speaker):

- In general, I'm not ready to just invest into something, never did and don't plan to. It's not my nature to be a partner. What I can only do is to buy 100% of the company and give the founders the work orders.

—Я вообще не готов во что-то инвестировать, никогда этого не делал и не собираюсь. Я не умею быть партнёром. Могу только купить 100% компании и предложить основателям работу.

http://secretmag.ru/longread/2015/03/22 ... d-dollarov

 

[movingtarget]

The trouble with this sport is that there are too many comebacks. After doping throughout his career and admitting it Riis is allowed to manage and own a team ? The sport is littered with former dopers working in the DS role, administration or management for their country etc. The UCI worry about what the riders are doing but they could have cleaned out a lot of potential problems and no doubt active ones with some house cleaning on the inside of the sport. How can they say the bad old days are over when so many of the players are still involved in the sport. Even if Tinkov is good at splashing the cash around he is a liability with a shady past who thinks he is one of the sport's oligarchs and he probably is in the worst possible sense.

 

[DirtyWorks]

If Riis did a Landis, he only harms himself. The UCI will align itself with Tinkoff's money. For reasons unknown, Contador is as protected as Armstrong by the UCI. Riis isn't going to affect that.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

For Riis (or Wonderboy, and soon Vino - I hope), I would have liked an epilogue with handcuffs or being booed off the sport by an angry mob of spectators, but I'll take what I can get. Adios Bjarne. No team in their right mind will want the PR nightmare and hire you. It sems like you stood up for your team: why don't you stand up for the sport before you fade away? You have nothing left to lose: sing us a song.

I doubt Bjarne leaving will make the team clean(er)

Also I'am sure he has interesting stories to tell..

Why should he sing a song that would only sacrifice a big portion of his "current" and former riders...?
Furthemore he would gain nothing from it whatsoever...

I understand the desire to get someone standing up for the sport but there has to be some logical incentive other than clinic morals...

+1.

Just like everything else in life. Look at Armstrong, still trying to protect Ferrari.

 

[Big Doopie]

saxo tinkoff about to go full ***.

 

[Tonton]

So Bjarne Riis wasn't saved after all, not by silence, not by a loud mouth like Oleg, I bet he'll write a book, with half-truths, vanilla, swearing that the sport is now clean. Being a victim: "yes, I was a rider in the '90s". Too bad. If that bird could sing, now that would be a book!!!

 

[TailWindHome]

"Cycling has to change. The times of Sainz, Bryneel and Riis are over - they were stuck in the 2000s and that is not necessarily about doping. They just don't get some obvious things and don't know how to manage teams in modern way. Managing a team is not just about issuing instructions from a car radio or about casting a spell over the riders at which Riis was unsurpassed, for example. Managing a team is about boring, monotonous work in the office. The day of the boring and meticulous managers has come - guys like Dave Brailsord and, I hope, our new Director Stefano Feltrin.

Directing the team and its riders from preparation today must be driven by mathematical and statistical analysis and data mining. Sport science is the king now! Today the winner is not the one that trains the most but the one who trains the right way, not the one who injects EPO, but the one with a healthy diet and the one who consumes the right drinks before, after and during lengthy training sessions. "

 

[Tonton]

Re:

"Sport science is the king now! Today the winner is not the one that trains the most but the one who trains the right way, not the one who injects EPO, but the one with a healthy diet and the one who consumes the right drinks before, after and during lengthy training sessions. "

Yeah, don't work harder, work smarter: the lazy a$$ motto. Yeah, science, Conconi, Ferrari, Chris Carmichael, oval chain ring and don't forget the thermos. No need to train in a wind tunnel Dawg! Just visualize...It evolved from the Dr. Mabuse days, but come on: same old, same old.

 

[Archibald]

Oleg has a point - Riis never gave out the right drinks to his riders before, during or after races...
Exibit A - all makes sense why he fell off and is out of the sport...

 

[vedrafjord]

Re:

Directing the team and its riders from preparation today must be driven by mathematical and statistical analysis and data mining. Sport science is the king now! Today the winner is not the one that trains the most but the one who trains the right way, not the one who injects EPO, but the one with a healthy diet and the one who consumes the right drinks before, after and during lengthy training sessions. "

That's why you hire people like Yates, Julich, De Jongh, and Vila - kings of sport science and data mining who would never waste their time injecting EPO.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

Directing the team and its riders from preparation today must be driven by mathematical and statistical analysis and data mining. Sport science is the king now! Today the winner is not the one that trains the most but the one who trains the right way, not the one who injects EPO, but the one with a healthy diet and the one who consumes the right drinks before, after and during lengthy training sessions. "

That's why you hire people like Yates, Julich, De Jongh, and Vila - kings of sport science and data mining who would never waste their time injecting EPO.

LOL.

I forgot that now it is all about the rice cakes. If Hinault and Merckx knew that it would have been beyond ludicrous speed!!!

 

[neineinei]

A couple of months ago ADD said the report was ready for printing, but now they say they are still working on it, getting the quotes approved for the report by the interviewees. They have interviewed ca 50 persons. And the report is to be published in 2015....

http://www.jyllands-posten.dk/protected/premium/sport/ECE7689143/Cirka-50-har-vidnet-i-dansk-dopingsag/ (Danish, paywall)