Cavendish Vs Kittel 2015

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Jun 5, 2014
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Jspear said:
If you look at Hugo's post you'll see Kittel has been beating Cav for more than a year.
Yes, he was beaten by Kittel in 2013. However his year was not bad. I think he was a bit tired after racing the Giro with the horribly cold conditions. Then that 3day race inbetween instead of resting ahead of the Tour.

IMO if Cavendish has trained well, he'll be marginally weaker than Kittel and beat him at least 2 times out of 6.
 
blackcat said:
actually, even when Mcewen retired about 36, he still had the best jump in the peloton. I think the best jump would now be either the new French guy, or still Chicchi if he has a team, he had an awesome jump. Petacchi raved about him when they were on Fassa.
Well there's a difference between "best jump" and best sprinter.
McEwen was well past his prime in his later years.
Cipollini had his best season at the age of 34.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Bavarianrider said:
Well there's a difference between "best jump" and best sprinter.
McEwen was well past his prime in his later years.
Cipollini had his best season at the age of 34.
i am well aware of that. Robbie Mac's last 3 years were disappointing. but his career was phenomenal. his last major was London 2007 which was about the best sprint win I have ever seen besides Cavendish's 2009 San Remo.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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The Chicken said:
Cavendish will be causing lots more crashes during sprints until he retires, it'll be his way of dealing with the fact he can no longer challenge and is effectively FINISHED as a rider. He'll get nowhere near Kittel.
this could actually not be more wrong. there are two times where cav has caused an infraction. i know once where haussler crashed because of him. Plus, he rode across Hushovd's line when he was protecting Hincapie's yellow jersey in the Tour when they rode on High Road. And it lost him the green jersey because of that penalty.

But apart from these few cases, out of the ~150 sprints Cav has contested, he always sprints straight as a die, like a spirit level straight.

He is not a dirty sprinter, he never moves across his line, does not flick you or squeeze your line down the barriers, basically, Cav gives his competitors a straight run at the finish. And he beats them mano a mano. Unlike alot of the Australian sprinters who grew up on the track, and unlike Bettini when the little smurf ran Cooke into the Barriers in the 2006 Giro.

that was just a BS post. Cav is the fairest sprinter i have seen. Cant compare Frodo to Djamolodin Abdoujaporov or however his name is spelled
 
Aug 26, 2014
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Dr. Juice said:
Yes, he was beaten by Kittel in 2013. However his year was not bad. I think he was a bit tired after racing the Giro with the horribly cold conditions. Then that 3day race inbetween instead of resting ahead of the Tour.

IMO if Cavendish has trained well, he'll be marginally weaker than Kittel and beat him at least 2 times out of 6.
I agree with this. I think Kittel is probably the stronger, but I wouldn't write Cav. off just yet. If he gets his head together, he's got the drive and the ability, no doubt. He's got more versatility and can use that to take sprints that Kittel can't. He also seems to last a lot better through the grand tours, so will fare better in weeks 2 and 3.

I certainly hope so.
 
blackcat said:
this could actually not be more wrong. there are two times where cav has caused an infraction. i know once where haussler crashed because of him. Plus, he rode across Hushovd's line when he was protecting Hincapie's yellow jersey in the Tour when they rode on High Road. And it lost him the green jersey because of that penalty.

But apart from these few cases, out of the ~150 sprints Cav has contested, he always sprints straight as a die, like a spirit level straight.

He is not a dirty sprinter, he never moves across his line, does not flick you or squeeze your line down the barriers, basically, Cav gives his competitors a straight run at the finish. And he beats them mano a mano. Unlike alot of the Australian sprinters who grew up on the track, and unlike Bettini when the little smurf ran Cooke into the Barriers in the 2006 Giro.

that was just a BS post. Cav is the fairest sprinter i have seen. Cant compare Frodo to Djamolodin Abdoujaporov or however his name is spelled
To be fair to Abdoujaparov, he didn't deliberately flick people or try to run them into barriers. He certainly didn't throw bottles a la Steels/Cipo or headbutt like McEwen/Renshaw.

He just had his head down and sprinted in the general direction of the finish line. If there was anything in the way (riders, motos, barriers, spectators, bollards) so be it :D
 
Mar 13, 2009
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42x16ss said:
To be fair to Abdoujaparov, he didn't deliberately flick people or try to run them into barriers. He certainly didn't throw bottles a la Steels/Cipo or headbutt like McEwen/Renshaw.

He just had his head down and sprinted in the general direction of the finish line. If there was anything in the way (riders, motos, barriers, spectators, bollards) so be it :D
how about Mcewen riding MAtti Breschel into the barriers at 3 Days of De Panne in about 2006?

And I know Mcewen did an even worse job on Fabrizio Guidi in the 1998 Denmark Rundt. And he had all the azzuri crew lining up around him threatening him, which would have been about 12 mafiaso, and he stared them all down, and challenged them to the fight they were threatening him with, just as Guidi was put in the ambulance.

I had new and great respect for Mcewen hearing that anecdote from a Danish mate who was at the race.
 
blackcat said:
how about Mcewen riding MAtti Breschel into the barriers at 3 Days of De Panne in about 2006?

And I know Mcewen did an even worse job on Fabrizio Guidi in the 1998 Denmark Rundt. And he had all the azzuri crew lining up around him threatening him, which would have been about 12 mafiaso, and he stared them all down, and challenged them to the fight they were threatening him with, just as Guidi was put in the ambulance.

I had new and great respect for Mcewen hearing that anecdote from a Danish mate who was at the race.
He also offered to rearrange Armstrong's teeth when him and Ulrich were getting in the way during the intermediate sprints at the end of the '03 TDF.

Noone f#$ked with Robbie :D
 
Mar 13, 2009
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42x16ss said:
He also offered to rearrange Armstrong's teeth when him and Ulrich were getting in the way during the intermediate sprints at the end of the '03 TDF.

Noone f#$ked with Robbie :D
not as badass as Robbie HUNTER tho. At Tour of California in about 2007, he challenged Popo to a fistfight and they both got off their bikes on one of the climbs.

they did not throw a punch, but I dont think Hunter was aware Popo was a golden gloves winner back in Ukraine in his teenage years. Would have been a good fight imo.

sounds like the redhead Australian sprinter Steven PAte
 
Mar 13, 2009
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42x16ss said:
He also offered to rearrange Armstrong's teeth when him and Ulrich were getting in the way during the intermediate sprints at the end of the '03 TDF.

Noone f#$ked with Robbie :D
but this was after Mcewen had crossed Armstrong when Mcewen wanted to chase for intermediate sprint points I think it was earlier than your anecdote, and it may have even been before Mcewen was chasing green and Armstrong had won July and was le patron.

And MCewen wanted to have riders chase from his team, for the points for the intermediate sprint, and Armstrong was happy with the break.

in hindsight, it sounds like we are remembering the one anenecdote, but with a minor alteration in the percaption and chinese whispers of age/time
 
Miburo said:
Please put a 500m hill of 2% in the last 10 km, then we don't have to talk about Kittel.

It's still beyond me that a guy like him is so popular. Talks about changing cycling while he's barely a cyclist. Sprints 200meters, that's his career.
He's not especially popular. People just acknowledge, whether they like him or not, that he's the fastest sprinter atm
 
In a very, very flat stage then obviously Kittel has the edge, it is quite pathetic though that even a tiny speedbump is enough to have the big German struggling. At least Cav won MSR, Kittel couldn't even make it over the first Capi :D
 
Apr 2, 2014
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hfer07 said:
just to put things in perspective:

Cav was out sprinted & beaten yesterday at the Tour of San Luis by a "Colombian" .....:eek:


:D
Cav goes to San Luis to train not to race
 
Kittel is a much faster sprinter now than Cav. He has been beating him for the last two years despite questionable positioning - when he gets that sorted he will win by yards.

Stick a hill in the final few kilometres and Bouhanni / Degenkolb will get over it better than Cav and beat him in the sprint.

Make the race over 250km and Degenkolb / Kristoff will still be there and fresher than Cav.

Can't see the misile winning many big races or stages this year.
 
blackcat said:
this could actually not be more wrong. there are two times where cav has caused an infraction. i know once where haussler crashed because of him. Plus, he rode across Hushovd's line when he was protecting Hincapie's yellow jersey in the Tour when they rode on High Road. And it lost him the green jersey because of that penalty.

But apart from these few cases, out of the ~150 sprints Cav has contested, he always sprints straight as a die, like a spirit level straight.

He is not a dirty sprinter, he never moves across his line, does not flick you or squeeze your line down the barriers, basically, Cav gives his competitors a straight run at the finish. And he beats them mano a mano. Unlike alot of the Australian sprinters who grew up on the track, and unlike Bettini when the little smurf ran Cooke into the Barriers in the 2006 Giro.

that was just a BS post. Cav is the fairest sprinter i have seen. Cant compare Frodo to Djamolodin Abdoujaporov or however his name is spelled
My post was BS? Your whole life is BS.

Cavendish is a dirty sprinter. There are countless examples of this, the Veelers incident being a standout example in recent years. The problem with a thug like Cav is that he'd rather wipe out the bunch than lose. He's a big baby. I fear for the safety of the other riders this season because Cav, with his speed/jump on the wane but his "win sprint or die tryin'" mindset still present, will likely be more reckless than ever.
 
Jul 29, 2012
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Cance > TheRest said:
He's not especially popular. People just acknowledge, whether they like him or not, that he's the fastest sprinter atm
He's popular, very popular and i hate it. That's my opinion of course, people might have different views but someone with his abilities shouldn't be praised as often as he is.

He literally can't do do anything besides a sprint. Riders like him disgust me, especially when they talk about changing cycling.

It's not because of people like him that people watch cycling, it's cause all these guys training their *** off in the mountains (who he often trashes) that makes sure he gets paid.

Disgusting.
 
I also hate that he tries to call out dopers while he had his blood treated with ozone. He seems so ingenuine to me.

Cav is just a straight dude who says what he thinks and apologises when he's done something wrong
 
Jan 5, 2013
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Miburo said:
He's popular, very popular and i hate it. That's my opinion of course, people might have different views but someone with his abilities shouldn't be praised as often as he is.

He literally can't do do anything besides a sprint. Riders like him disgust me, especially when they talk about changing cycling.

It's not because of people like him that people watch cycling, it's cause all these guys training their *** off in the mountains (who he often trashes) that makes sure he gets paid.

Disgusting.
Seriously? He may not train as much or as hard as non-sprinters (if that is even true, I wouldn't know), but I really doubt he doesn't train/have discipline or is worth whatever he earns for his team and sponsor. To say that he disgust you is a little extreme, don't you think? Top sprinters contribute just as much to the cycling-economy as climbers do, if not the sponsors wouldn't be willing to pay them out, so it's kind of silly to think that.

And hell, even if he didn't train at all and would still be this fast, that'd just raise my respect towards him. I highly prefer a mountain stage over a sprint stage, but I do respect and admire riders like Kittel. If it was that easy, there'd be a lot more of him.
 
Jul 29, 2012
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NairoQ said:
Seriously? He may not train as much or as hard as non-sprinters (if that is even true, I wouldn't know), but I really doubt he doesn't train/have discipline or is worth whatever he earns for his team and sponsor. To say that he disgust you is a little extreme, don't you think? Top sprinters contribute just as much to the cycling-economy as climbers do, if not the sponsors wouldn't be willing to pay them out, so it's kind of silly to think that.

And hell, even if he didn't train at all and would still be this fast, that'd just raise my respect towards him. I highly prefer a mountain stage over a sprint stage, but I do respect and admire riders like Kittel. If it was that easy, there'd be a lot more of him.
So people watch the tour, the giro, the vuelta for the sprinters just as much as for the climbers? Don't be a tool.
 
NairoQ said:
Seriously? He may not train as much or as hard as non-sprinters (if that is even true, I wouldn't know), but I really doubt he doesn't train/have discipline or is worth whatever he earns for his team and sponsor. To say that he disgust you is a little extreme, don't you think? Top sprinters contribute just as much to the cycling-economy as climbers do, if not the sponsors wouldn't be willing to pay them out, so it's kind of silly to think that.

And hell, even if he didn't train at all and would still be this fast, that'd just raise my respect towards him. I highly prefer a mountain stage over a sprint stage, but I do respect and admire riders like Kittel. If it was that easy, there'd be a lot more of him.
The notion that sprinters don't train as hard as others is so un****inbelievable off it's not even funny.:(:mad::eek:
 
Jan 5, 2013
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Miburo said:
So people watch the tour, the giro, the vuelta for the sprinters just as much as for the climbers? Don't be a tool.
Excuse me, but why exactly do you think top sprinters get payed this much?

Wins for a team -> $$$ for the sponsor -> directly stimulates cycling as a sport, because without sponsors your beloved climbers would reconsider their life as a cyclist.

Thinking they just get their money while not being worth something for their team and thus the sport is just against al logic, sponsors are not all philantropics who want to waste their money, you know.
 
Miburo said:
He's popular, very popular and i hate it. That's my opinion of course, people might have different views but someone with his abilities shouldn't be praised as often as he is.

He literally can't do do anything besides a sprint. Riders like him disgust me, especially when they talk about changing cycling.

It's not because of people like him that people watch cycling, it's cause all these guys training their *** off in the mountains (who he often trashes) that makes sure he gets paid.

Disgusting.
This is one of the worst posts I've ever seen.

Firstly, Kittel won numerous time trials at junior level (including the worlds twice), so he's not one-dimensional - he's just chosen to focus on deveoping his main strength. As the fastest sprinter in the world it makes sense to focus on that, rather than losing some bulk and top end speed. He has probably been advised to do that by his team because they already have Degenkolb for those kind of sprints.

If he is one dimensional, then what are all the other riders in the peloton who just work as domestiques and never challenge for a stage, regardless of the terrain?

Also, to imply he trains less than climbers is ridiculous. He has to put a huge effort to get over climbs and stay in time limits, given the massive weight disadvantage he has. That will require him doing loads of threshold work throughout the year, in addition to maintaining and improving his top end speed. Arguably he works harder than a climber that only has to focus on one aspect and can largely ignore the anaerobic stuff.
 
Since Kittel appears not to have a dedicated thread(?!), this one will do: he won the bunch sprint for 6th in Rund um Koln yesterday but wasn't dominant and didn't look entirely comfortable. But can he seriously not do the TDF?
 

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