Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[maxmartin]

I sugested on a Sky Sports story about Froome becomming tdf captain, that it was because Sky and Brailsford knew Wiggins did not stand a chance against real competition. Then I added, that neither did Froome.

I have never received 80 negative votes and zero positives before.

I applaud you here

 

[T-Nielsen]

I applaud you here

Thank you.

It was like the fifth post I have made on Sky Sports. The other four was just mildly critical of Sky and Brailsford, but they did not get posted on the side because the side admins or whoever has to aprove them. This time they posted my perhaps sharpest post. Go figure.

 

[Parrulo]

Yep, 4th place 1 month after being the best climber at the Tour and medaling the Olympics is a bit of a fail.

Trying to remember how the best GT rider of his generation managed a couple of years ago when he tried back to back GTs, but I can't quite remember. Must have been much better, I'm sure.

it certainly was a much better attempt. he won the first GT which happened to be the toughest GT of the last decade parcours wise and went to the usually toughest GT of the year in terms of contention, and despite losing 2 minutes due to a crash and a TTT on the first 2 stages and injuring his knee on crashes caused by the lack of strength of his team he still "only" finished 5 minutes back and was until the very last day on the greatest animators of the race.

froome got second on the tour and went to the vuelta where despite having no bad luck and getting a fantastic support from his team he still finished 10min back being an absolute non factor on the decisive part of the race.

 

[ILovecycling]

Looks to me like Wiggo & Brailsford are waiting for the final ruling on Saxo's License to make up their mind on the Tour title defense-that's all. Froome well knows that as soon as Contador gets the green line to participate, Brad will abandon his tour campaign for fear of embarrassment & rather go for the Giro against Nibali.....

Agree.For me its the same.If Alberto goes for Giro -Vuelta,Wiggo for Tour and Froome to match Alberto.If Alberto goes for Tour,it will be the opposite with Sky duo

 

[cineteq]

Yep, 4th place 1 month after being the best climber at the Tour and medaling the Olympics is a bit of a fail.

A fail in my book. Too much of a difference between a rider that dominated the Tour, finishing with a lot left in the tank and the rider that placed 10 minutes behind the winner with arguably a weaker field.

 

[Waterloo Sunrise]

it certainly was a much better attempt. he won the first GT which happened to be the toughest GT of the last decade parcours wise and went to the usually toughest GT of the year in terms of contention, and despite losing 2 minutes due to a crash and a TTT on the first 2 stages and injuring his knee on crashes caused by the lack of strength of his team he still "only" finished 5 minutes back and was until the very last day on the greatest animators of the race.

froome got second on the tour and went to the vuelta where despite having no bad luck and getting a fantastic support from his team he still finished 10min back being an absolute non factor on the decisive part of the race.

It's how you tell them, it really is.

He was the top climber at the Tour, won a TT medal at the Olympics and then tried another GT 3 weeks later where unsurprisingly he was completely empty, but still managed 4th. I can count on 1 hand the number of cyclists in history who would expect to do better in that combo of races (and no, before you all get hysterical, I'm not saying he's up there, I'm just saying the objective results are clearly very good when stated without the usual caveats and desire to ignore the relevance of doing 2 GTs in a row, which is happily used as an excuse for other riders).

 

[airstream]

It's a fail if you consider Sky management's plans of grand tour domination. I wouldn't call it a fail though on Froome's part, just on Sky management's.

How could you explain their determination then? Cavendish was practically kicked away from the team.

 

[airstream]

it certainly was a much better attempt. he won the first GT which happened to be the toughest GT of the last decade parcours wise and went to the usually toughest GT of the year in terms of contention, and despite losing 2 minutes due to a crash and a TTT on the first 2 stages and injuring his knee on crashes caused by the lack of strength of his team he still "only" finished 5 minutes back and was until the very last day on the greatest animators of the race.

froome got second on the tour and went to the vuelta where despite having no bad luck and getting a fantastic support from his team he still finished 10min back being an absolute non factor on the decisive part of the race.

It is not quite correct comparison. What's the use to extol the parcours if there were no proper attackers (only the man with a frying pan instead of working gear in a blue shirt)? I would gladly see Contador at his 2nd GT against multiple rivals who shoot all possible guns. You know, to сompare uneventful until Galibier Tour and Vuelta is just cynical. By the way you prudently didn't say that Froome rode 'toughest GT of the year in terms of contention'. Unsurprising.

Why do you always underline a team aspect? The team is nothing, when a rider can't hang on. The team may help only if opponents are very very close by strength. Froome didn't have a fantastic support at the Vuelta. And support which could help him to get on the podium simply doesn't exist considering his form.

 

[wwabbit]

It's how you tell them, it really is.

He was the top climber at the Tour, won a TT medal at the Olympics and then tried another GT 3 weeks later where unsurprisingly he was completely empty, but still managed 4th. I can count on 1 hand the number of cyclists in history who would expect to do better in that combo of races (and no, before you all get hysterical, I'm not saying he's up there, I'm just saying the objective results are clearly very good when stated without the usual caveats and desire to ignore the relevance of doing 2 GTs in a row, which is happily used as an excuse for other riders).

I thought he wasn't completely empty until the end of the first week of the Vuelta when he attempted that fail lead out for Ben Swift... Before that he was doing pretty well, even dropping Valverde and Cantador on Stage 6.

 

[serfla]

I thought he wasn't completely empty until the end of the first week of the Vuelta when he attempted that fail lead out for Ben Swift... Before that he was doing pretty well, even dropping Valverde and Cantador on Stage 6.

He needs voice in his ears. Mustn't listen to himself.
But so needs Wiggo too.

 

[JimmyFingers]

I thought he wasn't completely empty until the end of the first week of the Vuelta when he attempted that fail lead out for Ben Swift... Before that he was doing pretty well, even dropping Valverde and Cantador on Stage 6.

That was one of the most moronic moves I saw: Sky burnt themselves up trying to deliver a stage for swift and Froome was taking multiple turns on the front. Appalling tactics and I think they paid for it. That and poor tactics in the mountains, misusing Henao and Uran making them ride tempo at silly points and meaning they weren't there to help Froome when he was isolated by the Armada.

The Tour was well executed, the Vuelta was terrible, form aside

 

[cineteq]

That was one of the most moronic moves I saw: Sky burnt themselves up trying to deliver a stage for swift and Froome was taking multiple turns on the front.

Is this a new excuse to be added to a long set of excuses on why Froome finished so far in GC?

 

[serfla]

Is this a new excuse to be added to a long set of excuses on why Froome finished so far in GC?

He wasn't that far.
Best foreign rider is a nice achievement.

 

[cineteq]

He wasn't that far.
Best foreign rider is a nice achievement.

Should it be an award for that?

 

[serfla]

Should it be an award for that?

No, but maybe for second best Spaniard...

 

[JimmyFingers]

Is this a new excuse to be added to a long set of excuses on why Froome finished so far in GC?

Less an excuse, more a statement of fact. Not a huge fan of Froome, and certainly didn't think he would walk the Vuelta. At the end of the day he didn't ride that well and the team didn't ride that well ergo he lost. Quod erat demonstratum.

And it was moronic, particularly as Swift didn't look like he could buy a sprint win in the Vuelta. Impressive on the track, and took some handy wins in Poland in the build up, he was massively outclassed in the Vuelta. I'm hoping its a blip of form but considering he's the one Sky will looking to fill Cav's boots next season I doubt they'll be winning 50 races again.

 

[cineteq]

Less an excuse, more a statement of fact. Not a huge fan of Froome, and certainly didn't think he would walk the Vuelta. At the end of the day he didn't ride that well and the team didn't ride that well ergo he lost. Quod erat demonstratum.

And it was moronic, particularly as Swift didn't look like he could buy a sprint win in the Vuelta. Impressive on the track, and took some handy wins in Poland in the build up, he was massively outclassed in the Vuelta. I'm hoping its a blip of form but considering he's the one Sky will looking to fill Cav's boots next season I doubt they'll be winning 50 races again.

Gotcha. Agree that was fkcing moronic by Sky regardless if it affected Froome or not.

 

[Angliru]

How could you explain their determination then? Cavendish was practically kicked away from the team.

Admittedly I'm far from a fan of Sky or Wiggins although many of their individual riders I enjoy watching, it's just that something about their announcing their plans/ambitions of "dominating" grand tours rubbed me the wrong way. I don't question their determination regarding Wiggins/Sky's singular pursuit of winning the Tour or doing well in stage races. We have to keep in mind how Wiggins was at threat of being dumped from the team after his quite disappointing 2010 season, that being motivation for him to sacrifice all, take on the monk-like dedication to train to regain favor with the team and show he was worth their investment. I don't think he'll have the same level of commitment to his task as he had in 2011 & 2012 and as a result won't be reaching the same heights and level of success. This will lessen the liklihood of Sky pulling the grand tour triple as they had hoped. Which has me happily looking forward to the 2013 season, one that will restore order to the world.

 

[Angliru]

He wasn't that far.
Best foreign rider is a nice achievement.

10 minutes is quite a gap however you look at it.

 

[airstream]

We have to keep in mind how Wiggins was at threat of being dumped from the team after his quite disappointing 2010 season

I never heard about that. To damp for who? Was there any available GC alternative on the market? This sounds not very plausible to put it mildly.

I don't think he'll have the same level of commitment to his task as he had in 2011 & 2012 and as a result won't be reaching the same heights and level of success.

Sure he won't the same as Gilbert will never reproduce his 2011 results and no one will win 2 GTs in a row during the season. The contention is too tight. And any grandiose achievement requires huuuge concatenation of circumstances.

This will lessen the liklihood of Sky pulling the grand tour triple as they had hoped. Which has me happily looking forward to the 2013 season, one that will restore order to the world.

Well, thank you for your thoughts. Apparently it is the way of reasoning of all those who feel antipathy towards Sky or simply doesn't wanna see changes at the top. It is like Hitch's race theory. If a rider is weaker, it is his place and he can not get stronger otherwise it is not normal and his threads must bristle with thousands of posts in other subforum or something.

I still don't know how to treat Sky. Probably I will root for them cos two my compatriots ride for the team, but they will be the main driving force that slices the pie. There is no doubt.

 

[serfla]

10 minutes is quite a gap however you look at it.

How tight was it between the Spaniards?

 

[cineteq]

How tight was it between the Spaniards?

You have a strange way on trying to make your point. Can't wait for you to elaborate on your question.

 

[Angliru]

I never heard about that. To damp for who? Was there any available GC alternative on the market? This sounds not very plausible to put it mildly.

So you're calling me a liar? I read this in one of the many articles that CN has dedicated to Sky/Wiggins. I'm sure someone more resourceful than myself could find it and post a link, or you could search yourself since you find the scenario so hard to fathom.

 

[serfla]

You have a strange way on trying to make your point. Can't wait for you to elaborate on your question.

Race for which Spaniards care the most.
It was clear long before the race Spanish trio is targeting it.
After Nibali's victory in 2010. Froome's the best foreigner.

 

[dolophonic]

I didnt know there was a "Best Foreigner" category... WTF!

He was the best 4th place.