Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[Taxus4a]

Yeah, it's a horrific style attacking at 80 km from the finish in a mountain stage of a grand tour.
He wasn't the most spetacular rider ever, but he had his moments.

I predicted that attack...he was just the best at the end of that Giro, He just showes his tipical level on a profile made to put ten minutes to the second if you are just the stronger. The Pogacar we saw this Giro would have done something similar.He was the best rider of that era. He might come back to a similar level, not the same, but similar of that. It is a question of time and lot of work and mental strengh to know wich level he could get again, Meanwhile, lot of people emjoy with his progress and the process in general.

 

[lenric]

I predicted that attack...he was just the best at the end of that Giro, He just showes his tipical level on a profile made to put ten minutes to the second if you are just the stronger. The Pogacar we saw this Giro would have done something similar.He was the best rider of that era. He might come back to a similar level, not the same, but similar of that. It is a question of time and lot of work and mental strengh to know wich level he could get again, Meanwhile, lot of people emjoy with his progress and the process in general.

he would need 2 bionic legs

 

[Pinot's goat]

It's just a bike race & Froome is just a former champ who has permanently lost his legs & level as a result of Sky waving goodbye

ISN had a much bigger performance increase in their new signings these past two seasons than Ineos have.

 

[Rackham]

ISN had a much bigger performance increase in their new signings these past two seasons than Ineos have.

I said Sky, not Ineos.

It's clear that Sky with Froome as their number one rider & Nicolas Portal as sporting director offered an entirely different level of support for Froome than anything he's had since (including at post-Sky aka Ineos where he was no longer the main guy).

It's just a fact that those glory years are done & Sky as it was back then played a huge, huge role in making Froome a champion.

 

[CTQ]

Ouch, you might have sunk my battleship... except no, you totally missed the mark.

It's this Twitter account (actually followed by Benji Naesen from Lantern Rouge because is was funny):

Has Froome Been Dropped Yet? (@FroomeHas) / Twitter

And no, not my account. I can have a laugh for a minute or so at the situation surrounding Froome's current condition but after a while it gets boring real fast, i.e. a situation created by 3 concordant delusional groups of varying levels of honesty & dishonesty: his team because they talked him up & gave him a massive Tour winning salary whilst labelling him the "Lionel Messi of cycling" (true quote, look it up), his fans for actually believing he can get back to his level again (& fanatically fighting his critics & "nonbelievers" just to prove their fandom) & Froome himself for fuelling it all... whilst also taking himself way, way too seriously.

It's just a bike race & Froome is just a former champ who has permanently lost his legs & level as a result of Sky waving goodbye, his age & also his injury. That should have been the end of the story right there & you know what? Lots of people (even those who hated him) might have rooted for the guy, but no, he had to ruin everything for himself with a barrage of outrageous claims surrounding his form which in realty only further dupes his own fans.

It's pretty much impossible to cheer for this guy based on what he was (i.e. including the "how" he won & "who" he won with) & what he's become.

so, it's pretty much impossible to cheer for a lot of guys based on what they are, including the How they won, who they win with, .....Unless you're a hypocrite and biased

 

[Rackham]

so, it's pretty much impossible to cheer for a lot of guys based on what they are, including the How they won, who they win with, .....Unless you're a hypocrite and biased

Froome was a different breed of rider than most with his own riding style (no point denying that) & he won his Tours using a Sky train which crushed dreams & souls.

So his fans should probably learn to live with the fact he was polarizing & not everyone liked him. The only way this sort of rider could become popular & easy to cheer for once he's past his best is if he combined his current human performances with a human attitude.

I don't see it, to be honest. His entire social media presence nowadays & communication is just propaganda & strange updates about his form (always geared towards demonstrating he's getting back to his former level). And his actual bike rides in races are totally forgettable, i.e. he's a tourist in almost every race he competes in & nothing he shows on a bike matches the stuff he talks about or posts online.

Give us some realism.

 

[Froome]

Ouch, you might have sunk my battleship... except no, you totally missed the mark.

It's this Twitter account (actually followed by Benji Naesen from Lantern Rouge because is was funny):

Has Froome Been Dropped Yet? (@FroomeHas) / Twitter

And no, not my account. I can have a laugh for a minute or so at the situation surrounding Froome's current condition but after a while it gets boring real fast, i.e. a situation created by 3 concordant delusional groups of varying levels of honesty & dishonesty: his team because they talked him up & gave him a massive Tour winning salary whilst labelling him the "Lionel Messi of cycling" (true quote, look it up), his fans for actually believing he can get back to his level again (& fanatically fighting his critics & "nonbelievers" just to prove their fandom) & Froome himself for fuelling it all... whilst also taking himself way, way too seriously.

It's just a bike race & Froome is just a former champ who has permanently lost his legs & level as a result of Sky waving goodbye, his age & also his injury. That should have been the end of the story right there & you know what? Lots of people (even those who hated him) might have rooted for the guy, but no, he had to ruin everything for himself with a barrage of outrageous claims surrounding his form which in realty only further dupes his own fans.

It's pretty much impossible to cheer for this guy based on what he was (i.e. including the "how" he won & "who" he won with) & what he's become.

So, tell me what guys you cheered for in the past that you think it worth it. Just a honest question, not being ironic.

 

[Rackham]

So, tell me what guys you cheered for in the past that you think it worth it. Just a honest question, not being ironic.

How about riders (champions, to be more precise) I didn't cheer for when they were winning but who later became someone I could support because of their perseverance & attitude?

• Valverde (I never liked him until he got old & never quit, i.e. this guy lives & breathes cycling).
• Sagan (who I thought was an arrogant bstard back in his prime) who I literally cheered for in the Giro last year because he was having a sh*t season & that stage win of his was epic as hell.
• Nibali (for various reasons but I didn't get the whole "Squale" aka Shark thing which wasn't/isn't cool). But now? He's got that "I'm not done yet, I can still give something" attitude I can get behind. He's not a liar about his form nor is he delusional either.
• Contador before he retired (he went from an annoying Verbier Terminator to someone more likeable by the end, even if he quit before he totally lost his legs).

That's just 4 of the recent/current ones I can think of. Froome would have to become normal off the bike before he joins those ranks.

 

[red_flanders]

Yeah, it's a horrific style attacking at 80 km from the finish in a mountain stage of a grand tour.
He wasn't the most spetacular rider ever, but he had his moments.

This is what I mean by horrible style.

He's freaking ghastly to watch, and the tactics killed any enjoyment of racing. Not spectacular? No. Not watchable. I literally missed 2 Tours as the outcome wasn't in doubt and the racing was both boring, ugly, and frustrating. Never missed a Tour since 1983 previously.

The sport has been absolutely incredible the last two years, with so many exciting racers and new blood in the sport. Froome had his day. The idea that he's missed by anyone just blows my mind.

 

[Froome]

This is what I mean by horrible style.

He's freaking ghastly to watch, and the tactics killed any enjoyment of racing. Not spectacular? No. Not watchable. I literally missed 2 Tours as the outcome wasn't in doubt and the racing was both boring, ugly, and frustrating. Never missed a Tour since 1983 previously.

The sport has been absolutely incredible the last two years, with so many exciting racers and new blood in the sport. Froome had his day. The idea that he's missed by anyone just blows my mind.

Ok, if you are talking of that syle in the bike it's different, i respect that, it's your opinion.
Yeah, i agree in that, cycling has been awesome lately, with this new generation. But i would like to see this new generation fighting with nibali,quintana, froome, contador at their best, unfortunately it's not possible.

 

[FroomeWagon]

I follow the debate with interest, sometimes thinking 'that's harsh', sometimes finding it amusing.
Personally I think great champions earn the right to keep going or retire when they want.
I quite like Gilbert and Nibali are still continuing to ride .
To get to the top the you need ultimate faith in your ability and Froome has demonstrated this right throughout his career, if he believes he can win again one day so be it.

Here is the problem with that argument. It suggests that ISN should not expect to get any kind of return for their capital (ie money + roster spots). If you were a team owner, would you be willing to fill out your roster with former champions with zero chance of results because those riders "earned the right?" Would you pass on signing an up and coming rider because you needed to save a roster spot for an over the hill former champ? If ISN had a chance to obtain Bernal (2.7M) in a transfer, would you pass on that because you had committed most of your budget to Froome's salary?

For the amount of money ISN is paying Froome (4.5M), they could hire 3 top 20 riders (by salary: #20 Simon Yates 1.5M, #19 Lopez 1.5M, #18 Avermat 1.6M) or ISN could sign Bernal (2.7M) and Roglic (2.0M).

 

[Froome]

How about riders (champions, to be more precise) I didn't cheer for when they were winning but who later became someone I could support because of their perseverance & attitude?

• Valverde (I never liked him until he got old & never quit, i.e. this guy lives & breathes cycling).
• Sagan (who I thought was an arrogant bstard back in his prime) who I literally cheered for in the Giro last year because he was having a sh*t season & that stage win of his was epic as hell.
• Nibali (for various reasons but I didn't get the whole "Squale" aka Shark thing which wasn't/isn't cool). But now? He's got that "I'm not done yet, I can still give something" attitude I can get behind. He's not a liar about his form nor is he delusional either.
• Contador before he retired (he went from an annoying Verbier Terminator to someone more likeable by the end, even if he quit before he totally lost his legs).

That's just 4 of the recent/current ones I can think of. Froome would have to become normal off the bike before he joins those ranks.

And what froome needs to do off the bike to become normal?
I understand what you're saying about that riders, but i think froome's behavior off the bike has been good. Ok, sometimes it's annoying is conversation about getting better when we see that isn't true, but we have to see the big picture. He's been a example of resilience and don't give up, he could end is career and he is trying the almost impossible, comeback to his best after almost dying, i think he's been a example. Like i said, i get it, sometimes is annoying is conversation about im saying that things about getting better, but we should understand that is body unfortunately are not following what he wants in his head, it's a really difficult situation for him.
Other thing very criticized it's her salary, i don't know the hate around that, froome didn't force israel to pay him 5.5 millions, we all would accept if we were in froome's position. He should take care of is life, like we need also too do.

 

[red_flanders]

Ok, if you are talking of that syle in the bike it's different, i respect that, it's your opinion.
Yeah, i agree in that, cycling has been awesome lately, with this new generation. But i would like to see this new generation fighting with nibali,quintana, froome, contador at their best, unfortunately it's not possible.

Why? They had their time, they had their battles. There are plenty, in fact many more big stars now. And they ride with much more aggression and panache than that generation, Contador and occasionally Nibali being exceptions.

 

[Rackham]

And what froome needs to do off the bike to become normal?
I understand what you're saying about that riders, but i think froome's behavior off the bike has been good. Ok, sometimes it's annoying is conversation about getting better when we see that isn't true, but we have to see the big picture. He's been a example of resilience and don't give up, he could end is career and he is trying the almost impossible, comeback to his best after almost dying, i think he's been a example. Like i said, i get it, sometimes is annoying is conversation about im saying that things about getting better, but we should understand that is body unfortunately are not following what he wants in his head, it's a really difficult situation for him.
Other thing very criticized it's her salary, i don't know the hate around that, froome didn't force israel to pay him 5.5 millions, we all would accept if we were in froome's position. He should take care of is life, like we need also too do.

The salary issue is linked to the attitude issue. The money isn't the problem (for example I mentioned Nibali, i.e. I'd bet Astana pay him quite well in his new contract & good for him). It's what the money is "officially" for which is the problem (winning the Tour or at least finding his former form, to the point his team called him the Lionel Messi of cycling) & the fact Froome & his team disrespect the cycling world & cycling fans (& even Froome's own fans) by constantly spouting this delusional talk.

I mean why not be honest? Just admit the former condition is gone & say "I'm just here to race, help my team & enjoy racing". There's no need to constantly talk about "getting back" to what he had before & make it literally his entire signature (every video on his channel & almost everything he says is about getting his legs back to what they were).

If he thinks he can recover that level, don't advertise it (because there's always uncertainty) & if he doesn't, don't lie to everyone. Right now it just looks like he conned his team into paying him a fortune based on a lie.

 

[CTQ]

How about riders (champions, to be more precise) I didn't cheer for when they were winning but who later became someone I could support because of their perseverance & attitude?

• Valverde (I never liked him until he got old & never quit, i.e. this guy lives & breathes cycling).
• Sagan (who I thought was an arrogant bstard back in his prime) who I literally cheered for in the Giro last year because he was having a sh*t season & that stage win of his was epic as hell.
• Nibali (for various reasons but I didn't get the whole "Squale" aka Shark thing which wasn't/isn't cool). But now? He's got that "I'm not done yet, I can still give something" attitude I can get behind. He's not a liar about his form nor is he delusional either.
• Contador before he retired (he went from an annoying Verbier Terminator to someone more likeable by the end, even if he quit before he totally lost his legs).

That's just 4 of the recent/current ones I can think of. Froome would have to become normal off the bike before he joins those ranks.

from you:
It's pretty much impossible to cheer for this guy based on what he was (i.e. including the "how" he won & "who" he won with) & what he's become.

it's funny , you don't care with these names how they won and who they won with.................

 

[Rackham]

from you:
It's pretty much impossible to cheer for this guy based on what he was (i.e. including the "how" he won & "who" he won with) & what he's become.

it's funny , you don't care with these names how they won and who they won with.................

I think I was pretty clear: I didn't like what those riders were & how they won, but I can support what they became. With Froome I didn't like what he was when he was winning & I don't like what he became after.

Simple.

 

[bigcog]

How about riders (champions, to be more precise) I didn't cheer for when they were winning but who later became someone I could support because of their perseverance & attitude?

• Valverde (I never liked him until he got old & never quit, i.e. this guy lives & breathes cycling).
• Sagan (who I thought was an arrogant bstard back in his prime) who I literally cheered for in the Giro last year because he was having a sh*t season & that stage win of his was epic as hell.
• Nibali (for various reasons but I didn't get the whole "Squale" aka Shark thing which wasn't/isn't cool). But now? He's got that "I'm not done yet, I can still give something" attitude I can get behind. He's not a liar about his form nor is he delusional either.
• Contador before he retired (he went from an annoying Verbier Terminator to someone more likeable by the end, even if he quit before he totally lost his legs).

That's just 4 of the recent/current ones I can think of. Froome would have to become normal off the bike before he joins those ranks.

LOL, the only one out of them that hasn't had anything suspect linked to them is Sagan as far as I know, so giving that as one of the reasons why you don't like Froome is somewhat laughable.

 

[Rackham]

LOL, the only one out of them that hasn't had anything suspect linked to them is Sagan as far as I know, so giving that as one of the reasons why you don't like Froome is somewhat laughable.

If you're implying I uniquely referenced clinically issues, don't. It's an entire Sky method which involved killing races & the joy of watching them with a rider I found totally dubious in terms of character.

But this is cycling, i.e. riders can evolve & change (either for better or worse). Froome hasn't changed though, i.e. he's an insincere now regarding questions about his legs as he was back when he was deliberately dropping Bradley Wiggins in the 2012 Tour.

 

[CTQ]

If you're implying I uniquely referenced clinically issues, don't. It's an entire Sky method which involved killing races & the joy of watching them with a rider I found totally dubious in terms of character.

But this is cycling, i.e. riders can evolve & change (either for better or worse). Froome hasn't changed though, i.e. he's an insincere now regarding questions about his legs as he was back when he was deliberately dropping Bradley Wiggins in the 2012 Tour.

so, it's not about Froome posting about , some days, how he feels about his legs, but it's related to Wiggins. perharps you have not been sincere................

 

[Froome]

Why? They had their time, they had their battles. There are plenty, in fact many more big stars now. And they ride with much more aggression and panache than that generation, Contador and occasionally Nibali being exceptions.

Just curiosity to see who would won, compare their levels.

 

[Froome]

Two stages without losing time on giro di Sicília, even if they were flat stages.
Very curious to see his performance on the next two stages.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Chris Froome set to take part in British Championships for the first time since 2011

Mark Cavendish and Ethan Hayter to race men's road race

www.cyclingnews.com

ITT not RR

 

[bigcog]

Has he been dropped or is he still there ?

 

[Poursuivant]

Has he been dropped or is he still there ?

There was two ISN riders about 5/6th from last over the previous climb

 

[bigcog]

There was two ISN riders about 5/6th from last over the previous climb

Brian Smith on GCN suggested he was still there near top of penultimate climb, but think he was mistaken unless he was and got dropped subsequently, which would be a bit strange if he made up the biggest climb of the stage in the peleton.