Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[red_flanders]

He certainly did more today than I'd expected. Chapeau. I think now that he not only joined a break and survived, but looked good doing it, it's fair to hope he can win a stage. I'm honestly not seeing it unless he gets a fair bit stronger and faster, but I wouldn't blame anyone for thinking he has a chance at this point. IMO there are too many good riders, way too motivated for that, but at least he's visible in the race for the first time, for the right reasons.

All his talking and posting about how he was improving didn't matter a whit. Just perform and we can all see it. Still an atrocious looking rider, such a contrast from Pidcock who rides with style and can really drive that thing uphill or downhill. And lets his legs do the talking.

Anyway, good for all you Froome fans. Glad you had your day.

Can he retire now? So many more exciting and interesting riders to watch these days.

 

[macbindle]

So bitter.

I'm just amazed that after the injuries he had at the age he had them that he managed to do what he did today. Of course he was allowed to do what he did today when he wouldn't have been allowed pre-crash, so it has to be viewed through that prism. I still think it's over for him in terms of results, stages or GC.

 

[Savant12]

Did not expect him to get in any breakaway but he proved me wrong. To finish on the podium at L'Alpe d'Huez is progression - to what level, I don't know.

 

[FroomeWagon]

Hats off to Froome ... and just in time for a contract extension.

 

[Sciatic]

Did not expect him to get in any breakaway but he proved me wrong. To finish on the podium at L'Alpe d'Huez is progression - to what level, I don't know.

It was good to see, after all he’s worked for. He still lost 2minutes in the last 10 km of a climb to a breakaway companion who did much more work than Froome did, so it’s not a stunning result, but it must be an encouraging one for him.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

On The Move, Johan Bruyneel said that, even if Chris Froome we’re back to his peak level, it wouldn’t be enough to make the Tour podium. How quickly people forget. If we’re sticking with numbers, Froomey did the Ventoux at 5.91w/kg; Vingegaard did it in 5.77, dropping Pogacar last year.

 

[memyselfandI]

Just listened this very JB2 (JB square) podcast too, I think Bruyneel nails overall very well the past-present-future of Chris Froome, in a very honest and straight way that is. Agree fully.

https://stages.libsyn.com/

 

[Red Rick]

On The Move, Johan Bruyneel said that, even if Chris Froome we’re back to his peak level, it wouldn’t be enough to make the Tour podium. How quickly people forget. If we’re sticking with numbers, Froomey did the Ventoux at 5.91w/kg; Vingegaard did it in 5.77, dropping Pogacar last year.

Only climb they did slower than the Froome years.

They're going significantly faster on average

 

[ppanther92]

On The Move, Johan Bruyneel said that, even if Chris Froome we’re back to his peak level, it wouldn’t be enough to make the Tour podium. How quickly people forget. If we’re sticking with numbers, Froomey did the Ventoux at 5.91w/kg; Vingegaard did it in 5.77, dropping Pogacar last year.

That said, Froome's AdH record is 40:42 (2015). The other two attempts: 40:55 (2013), 41:20 (2018). 2013 and 2015 he raced the climb (and was dropped by Quintana). 2018 was arguably a bit more conservative with Thomas only sprinting away in the end. Yesterday (and according to Lantern Rouge), Pogacar, Vingegaard and Thomas climbed it in 39:12, Mas and Kuss 39:15, Bardet 39:31, Yates 39:50, Gaudu 40:06, Quintana 40:33, Kruijswijk 40:35. Thats 10 riders faster than Froome in his peak and his absolute best try. So I think there is actually a bit of a case that the field is now stronger than in the Ineos domination years after yesterday, tbh.

 

[ppanther92]

Only climb they did slower than the Froome years.
They're going significantly faster on average

Yes, exactly.

 

[roundabout]

That said, Froome's AdH record is 40:42 (2015). The other two attempts: 40:55 (2013), 41:20 (2018). 2013 and 2015 he raced the climb (and was dropped by Quintana). 2018 was arguably a bit more conservative with Thomas only sprinting away in the end. Yesterday (and according to Lantern Rouge), Pogacar, Vingegaard and Thomas climbed it in 39:12, Mas and Kuss 39:15, Bardet 39:31, Yates 39:50, Gaudu 40:06, Quintana 40:33, Kruijswijk 40:35. Thats 10 riders faster than Froome in his peak and his absolute best try. So I think there is actually a bit of a case that the field is now stronger than in the Ineos domination years after yesterday, tbh.

If Thomas is stronger now than he was before, is there any reason that Froome would not have been apart from being just1 year older?

 

[ppanther92]

If Thomas is stronger now than he was before, is there any reason that Froome would not have been apart from being just1 year older?

No but thats a theoretical scenario only now. We will never know.

 

[mrgmyers]

I find it ironic that Chris goes to the Tour with no hope of obtaining anything, but Cav is sidelined with the feasable chance of making history. Weird sport.

Individual teams, individual objectives, individual budgets,

 

[mrgmyers]

Cav should have joined ISN then.

And who says he will not now he is leaving Quickstep ISN certainly have the budget and a desire for publicity!

 

[spalco]

But are there stage WINNERS that are same or older age? Makes a podium spot moot

Because I was interested myself:

Tour de France 2022 Stage 21 results

Jonas Vingegaard is the winner of Tour de France 2022, before Tadej PogaÄar and Geraint Thomas. The stage from Paris La Défense to Paris (Champs-Ãlysées) was won by Jasper Philipsen.

www.procyclingstats.com

Poulidor won a stage aged 38, but of course famously never won the Tour.

Vinokourov won a stage aged 36y + 304d, a couple months younger than Froome is now, but also never won the Tour.

Next one would be Van Impe winning stage 19 in 1983, aged 36y + 274d, in what seems to have been a mountain ITT.
In fact his palmares are supremely impressive. He got a succesfull career stretching 17 years! His 11 years between first and last TdF stage win is crazy too.

 

[Pinot's goat]

That said, Froome's AdH record is 40:42 (2015). The other two attempts: 40:55 (2013), 41:20 (2018). 2013 and 2015 he raced the climb (and was dropped by Quintana). 2018 was arguably a bit more conservative with Thomas only sprinting away in the end. Yesterday (and according to Lantern Rouge), Pogacar, Vingegaard and Thomas climbed it in 39:12, Mas and Kuss 39:15, Bardet 39:31, Yates 39:50, Gaudu 40:06, Quintana 40:33, Kruijswijk 40:35. Thats 10 riders faster than Froome in his peak and his absolute best try. So I think there is actually a bit of a case that the field is now stronger than in the Ineos domination years after yesterday, tbh.

Everyone is going faster including Thomas who is the same age as Froome. There is no reason why Froome's level would not have risen as well.

 

[memyselfandI]

Well climbing times are prolly different for everybody depending how they arrive to that climb. After hard working in a small escape group or sheltered leader or number of different scenarios..

 

[dutchdescent]

Because I was interested myself:

Tour de France 2022 Stage 21 results

Jonas Vingegaard is the winner of Tour de France 2022, before Tadej PogaÄar and Geraint Thomas. The stage from Paris La Défense to Paris (Champs-Ãlysées) was won by Jasper Philipsen.

www.procyclingstats.com

Poulidor won a stage aged 38, but of course famously never won the Tour.

Vinokourov won a stage aged 36y + 304d, a couple months younger than Froome is now, but also never won the Tour.

Next one would be Van Impe winning stage 19 in 1983, aged 36y + 274d, in what seems to have been a mountain ITT.
In fact his palmares are supremely impressive. He got a succesfull career stretching 17 years! His 11 years between first and last TdF stage win is crazy too.

Fabulous! Thx for bothering to look it up

 

[Taxus4a]

Happy to see him up there at the Queen stage 14 years after his first Tour, the same stage, where he was better than this year, but he did a mistake at the booton of Alp D Huez. Now, experience counts.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Happy to see him up there at the Queen stage 14 years after his first Tour, the same stage, where he was better than this year, but he did a mistake at the booton of Alp D Huez. Now, experience counts.

Do you mean that he was better this year when he finished third vs 30th in 2008?

 

[RobertCrawley]

He certainly did more today than I'd expected. Chapeau. I think now that he not only joined a break and survived, but looked good doing it, it's fair to hope he can win a stage. I'm honestly not seeing it unless he gets a fair bit stronger and faster, but I wouldn't blame anyone for thinking he has a chance at this point. IMO there are too many good riders, way too motivated for that, but at least he's visible in the race for the first time, for the right reasons.

All his talking and posting about how he was improving didn't matter a whit. Just perform and we can all see it. Still an atrocious looking rider, such a contrast from Pidcock who rides with style and can really drive that thing uphill or downhill. And lets his legs do the talking.

Anyway, good for all you Froome fans. Glad you had your day.

Can he retire now? So many more exciting and interesting riders to watch these days.

Dawg will consult his power meter and then decide when (and if) he will retire.

 

[tonymikejoe]

The 2022 Tour so far from the man himself!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7aw0UT-urM

 

[witeken]

Froome missing 0.5W/kg. So more like 30-40W instead of 10-15W.

View: https://youtu.be/DnMRAPCerVE?t=226

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Only climb they did slower than the Froome years.

They're going significantly faster on average

That said, Froome's AdH record is 40:42 (2015). The other two attempts: 40:55 (2013), 41:20 (2018). 2013 and 2015 he raced the climb (and was dropped by Quintana). 2018 was arguably a bit more conservative with Thomas only sprinting away in the end. Yesterday (and according to Lantern Rouge), Pogacar, Vingegaard and Thomas climbed it in 39:12, Mas and Kuss 39:15, Bardet 39:31, Yates 39:50, Gaudu 40:06, Quintana 40:33, Kruijswijk 40:35. Thats 10 riders faster than Froome in his peak and his absolute best try. So I think there is actually a bit of a case that the field is now stronger than in the Ineos domination years after yesterday, tbh.

Sure, they are going faster, and there have been some advancements, possibly better riders, too. But between old / oldish guard riders like Quintana, Tomas, Bardet, and Yates hanging in there on big climbs at least periodically throughout the season and producing large numbers to a comparison of some of the numbers copied below, I'm not seeing evidence that peak Froome and Contador couldn't get on the Tour podium, as Bruyneel stated, or win a Tour. GT isn't even out of it this year at age 36. And he was never on the level of Froome and Contador.

Look at this comparison of Froome and Vingegaard. Pick some points, say 10 minutes. Froome is at ~7.1; Vingo is at ~6.8. Let's do 20. Froome is at ~6.6; Vingo is at 6.4. Vingo's curve is likely understated here because it overweights last year's climbs vs. this years. But Froome also has higher outliers as well; he seems to just suck at the Alpe, which has taken his performance down.

 

[dutchdescent]

Everyone is going faster including Thomas who is the same age as Froome. There is no reason why Froome's level would not have risen as well.

Everyone’s going faster than Pinot too, re: your username