CN's profile on Pantani's bike

[kiwirider]

This is going to make me sound like a real trainspotter, but as a Pantani fan, I've gotta write something ...

First off I was really pleased to see the profile on "Pantani's 1998 Tour and Giro winning bike". I thought it was a nice touch and a good way of showing respect to a great (albeit also tragic) rider of a past era by profiling his bike.

However after a read and a look at the photos, I am pretty disappointed as - based on what I have seen and read elsewhere (including a review of Pantani's bike in a 1998 or 1999 edition of ProCycling), that's not the bike he rode in those races. Or at least, if it was the bike, it has had some parts changed since then. It's the little things like:
- the carbon Ergo levers - every picture of Pantani in '98 has him with alloy levers, which isn't surprising since Campag didn't introduce carbon levers until '99;
- the 44 inner ring - when the other review had a 39 and most anything that I've read has him riding 39 inner rings;
- every picture I've seen of Pantani in the 98 Tour has him using red Time pedals (I realise that they're easily changed, but as the Bianchi museum is famous for having Coppi's bike complete with road dirt from his last race, the expectation is that they wouldn't change anything);
- I recall the ProCycling profile of his bike having it with 172.5 cranks, an unembroidered yellow seat and no nickname on the bike - I do have to say I'm not 100% on these details, but I have the magazine out in the shed and will dig it out some time over the next 24 hours to check (if anyone wants to call me on it ...)

So, my question is - what's the real story with the bike? Is it a Pantani replica? Has Bianchi put up another bike of his in their museum? Or has CN made a mistake??

Again, apologies for the geekiness, but I guess that I just feel that, if you're going to put up an article that is, by its very nature, partly a mark of respect to Pantani, it seems somehow disrespectful to his memory not to get the details right ...

 

[cmason]

i heard the real bike was hanging in a bike shop in manchester! does'nt sound right to me, but that's what i heard. i agree about the 44 inner ring, ok for roubaix, but les deux alpes/ mortirolo? even pantani ripped to the tits would struggle with that.

 

[ImmaculateKadence]

Thee 44 inner ring and the carbon levers seemed odd, but I can't accurately speculate as to the bike's authenticity. I know what you're saying though.

On a side note, completely accurate or not, it was interesting to see a bike from that era included in CN's tech section. I'd like to see more of that.

 

[James Huang]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the notes. This bike is supposedly authentic and Bianchi's original frame geometry drawing (which we have) matches up with the actual measurements so we've little doubt the frame is correct.

As for the carbon Ergopower levers, I'll have to look into this further as yes, old race photos that I'm pulling up do show alloy levers so far.

Verifying the chainring sizes that Pantani used on road stages is obviously much more difficult to do but if you were able to dig up that old issue, I'd be curious to see what's listed there.

We do our best but don't claim to be perfect. Thanks again for the keen eyes and we'll be sure to update as necessary once we gather up more info.

 

[usedtobefast]

i liked the feature too. keep doing more of those. cool stuff. hey i have some
old bikes...

 

[RTMcFadden]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the notes. This bike is supposedly authentic and Bianchi's original frame geometry drawing (which we have) matches up with the actual measurements so we've little doubt the frame is correct.

As for the carbon Ergopower levers, I'll have to look into this further as yes, old race photos that I'm pulling up do show alloy levers so far.

Verifying the chainring sizes that Pantani used on road stages is obviously much more difficult to do but if you were able to dig up that old issue, I'd be curious to see what's listed there.

We do our best but don't claim to be perfect. Thanks again for the keen eyes and we'll be sure to update as necessary once we gather up more info.

I think Kiwirider deserves an honorable mention in any update. The level of detail he provided was impressive.

 

[frankdstrack]

Pantani's Real Bike

I'm a big fan of the retro bike pieces, and am a huge fan of the 1998 Bianchi Pirate machine, that thing was a work of art.

Unfortunately, the machine reviewed on CyclingNews (http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/marco-pantanis-1998-mercatone-uno-bianchi-mega-pro-xl-reparto-corse) has several problems and does not appear to be Pantani's bike - in fact, as built, I would be surprised if it is actually even a bike from 1998. There are several reasons I say this:

1) Il Pirata's frame was much more dramatically sloped than the one pictured in the article

2) He rode aluminum Ergo levers, not the carbon ones pictured which were released in 1999

3) He rode red time pedals, not the magnesium set on this bike

4) The detail on his saddle was red, not blue

5) He rode solid yellow tubulars, not the vittoria tt's with the black center bead

6) He used a front dt shifter with the Ergo guts removed, apparently even on flat stages as seen here in this shot: http://www.justride.gr/portal/images/stories/pantani.jpg

Sadly, the bike featured in the article (and at the Bianchi museum) is not his bike; but appears to bear a closer resemblance to the replica issued by Bianchi the following year.

I have discussed this more thoroughly on Velominati:

http://www.velominati.com/blog/racing/il-piratas-1998-bianchi-the-elusive-stallion/

 

[toby@RIDECyclingReview]

You are spot on mate... we have featured this bike in our magazine and the CN bike is not the right one.

 

[David Suro]

You guys are impressive. Just when a guy thinks he knows a thing or two about bikes, he is truly humbled.

 

[big jonny]

Well done, gentlemen.

I would also make note of the following: The claimed 44t ring does not appear to be what was commonly used in the many race photos available. The handlebars are the wrong drop/bend. And, the silver seat post clamp in the race photographs is a much more finely machined bit than that stock looking black clunker on the featured bicycle.

Small points, yes. But it certainly looks to be a different bike than what was used throughout 1998.

 

[usedtobefast]

could there more than one bike? i think so, but have no proof.

 

[kiwirider]

Head over to http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=5903 (in Bikes & Gear/General if the link doesn't work) and check out James's responses to my post on the same topic a couple of days back ...

I note that the article now says that this bike is in the Santini offices ... whereas I was sure that the bike Pantani rode was held by Bianchi itself. Still, credit to CN for making changes in response to a bunch of detail geeks like all of us ...

I haven't looked for the review that I mention in my original post yet - but if someone can tell me how to post a pdf scan of the pages on the forum I will do over the next couple of days ...

 

[James Huang]

Hi all,

First off, thanks to all of you for the information-laden posts. After looking at some race photos from the '98 season, it does appear that some of the parts may have been changed from their original spec but the frame geometry does match up with the drawing supplied to us from Bianchi so I'm rather confident this isn't just some replica with a Pantani sticker on it.

Nevertheless, we're going to look into this further and will update as needed. While I think this *was* Pantani's bike, it's possible it was his spare machine or something and perhaps not his primary rig. But again, we'll delve deeper and figure things out. Thanks again for the posts.

 

[frankdstrack]

James,
Thanks for your reply and for continuing to look into this and investigate; this is why we love CyclingNews! It would be great to find the real original some day...

Would it be possible for you to post the drawings from Bianchi, or are you under agreement not to disclose?

 

[James Huang]

I didn't have firm confirmation from Bianchi one way or the other on that frame drawing so I opted not to post it out of prudence. If I get the go-ahead otherwise, I'll have it added to the image gallery.

 

[Anonymous]

Could it be that after the season some parts or bits (ie - seat collar, pedals, etc) were scavenged from the bike so whoever got possession of the bike afterwards threw on their spare bits that fit the bike?

Just because some of the bits aren't the exact same doesn't make it any less the genuine thing. But as an automotive purist I understand where everyone is coming from. That's like putting dubs on Fangio's 1957 Maserati 250F.

 

[frankdstrack]

@James
Thanks for continuing to investigate. It would be really cool if you could share it.

@Gee333

It's possible, but I think it's pretty visually obvious that the top tube on Pantani's race-winning machine is more dramatically sloping, so it seems even the frame is not the one we're looking for.

That said, the standard team-issue frame did not have a sloping top tube, so this frame could be an early-season issue that has since been pillaged for parts or became a training machine the next season. In that sense, it could be a Pantani machine, just not the one he did the Giro-Tour double on.

I find it really hard to believe that after winning those races aboard a bike like that, that one wouldn't keep it as-is and store. I would think either the rider, the team, or the manufacture would in all likelihood recognize the significance of the piece and store it.

 

[James Huang]

frankdstrack:

I think you'd be surprised. Oftentimes the historical significance of these things isn't realized until well after the fact. When it really comes down to it, these things are tools used in a job, and sometimes they need to be used/reused for something else once the job is done instead of put away in a museum somewhere.

I'm actually already working on another retro pro bike piece and there have been some definite equipment changes to it post-season - a wheel was loaned to a younger rider on the team, some prototype parts were returned to the manufacturer, etc.

 

[frankdstrack]

@James

I suppose you're right. I'm already looking forward to your next piece!

As a point of interest, a sharp-eyed reader, Marko, on Velominati made the following comment regarding some further frame details:

Not only does the geometry seem distinctly different, look at the yellow paint on the seat tube. In the above “giro bike” photo the yellow goes all the way down to almost the end of the letter C. The other bike, the yellow paint stops in the N. Plus the stickers on the forks are a different color, the above yellow, the below blue. It’s a different bike. No doubt in my mind.

(There are a series of photos on Velominati's post the make it easy to compare.)

 

[Sprocketboy]

Fascinating stuff. A few years ago I was at Cadence Cycling in Philadelphia and up on the second floor was a small Bianchi time trial bike purporting to have been one of Pantani's.

 

[Boostland]

If you want to see old review on his bike (1998) they have one over at Campyonly.

http://www.campyonly.com/marcobike.html

According to the article the pics were taken a few weeks after the 98 tour.

Note the seat is a different colour, also the seat clamp is different, time sticker on front forks is a different colour, there is a speedo fitted, frame also appears to be a different size note the gap between the top and bottom tube at the head, there are also some frame sticker variations.

These are in addition to the other differences that were noticed earlier.

 

[kiwirider]

If you want to see old review on his bike (1998) they have one over at Campyonly.

http://www.campyonly.com/marcobike.html

According to the article the pics were taken a few weeks after the 98 tour.

Thanks for the link

I was in Denmark in July-August '98 (sadly without my bike) and remember that ride - it was a few weeks after the Tour finished and went from Copenhagen up the coast for about 40km or so. The ride was organised by Riis - who had also raced the Tour that year and who managed to entice Pantani to Denmark for it. Apparently it was a great day - Pantani was reportedly very approachable ...

 

[big jonny]

Thought I'd offer up a nice pic of another Pantani bike in another collection: http://www.herneweb.com/image.php?imageID=194

 

[Polish]

Marco had a habit of throwing chains,
so his mechanic would often put a "chain watcher" on his bici....
just another distinquishing bit besides the front DT shifter.

 

[MadonePro]

Geez the amount of drugs this guy took, it's sad he only one decent stage race