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Contador's fframe of mind and his attacks in the mountain stages

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What was Contador's frame of mind during the Tour?

  • Had Lance not taken time on me, I would have beeen ok with Lance and Klodi No. 2 and 3.

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ALMATY, Kazakhstan (AP) — The future of Tour de France champion Alberto Contador's Astana team is again in doubt after cycling's ruling body made new demands for financial guarantees.

Kazakh Cycling Federation deputy president Nikolai Proskurin said Tuesday that the International Cycling Union is demanding a bank guarantee of Astana's annual budget before it will renew its ProTour license.

Proskurin says the demand is unreasonable and that he is unsure whether Astana can meet Wednesday's deadline.

The team's inclusion in competition next season had appeared certain last week, when the oil-rich Kazakhstan government pledged $22 million in financial support for next season
 
Aug 4, 2009
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AC may fancy himself to be a lone gunman like the pre-Banesto-era champions, but I'd bet you my Confente he will never EVER solo-attack the way BH or EM characteristically did. Well, he'll never attack that way successfully...ain't got it in him. Besides, no one in today's peloton would risk such an attack, successful or no, for fear of being railroaded into retirement by the beloved french doping Clouseau's

pink_panther.jpg


You really wanna know who's ruined the sport (those of you who think it's "ruined") ?

See pic above
 
Oct 19, 2009
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^^^

No he will, and he did something like that in Paris-Nice this year.
But it's still your opinion, or maybe just taste

And I don't think that that kind of attacks suit modern cycling.
BH and EM was another era, and it's a closed one.

Oh and contadors team in 2009 ( with armstrong ofcourse, was the worst)
So it can only get better. So phill who ever you are, don't take conclusions that fast.
 
May 5, 2009
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thehog said:
http://www.timeslive.co.za/sport/other/article203749.ece
Liggett... believes Contador can't win 2010...

Ligget mentions in the Times article that"he thinks "Alberto Contador might struggle next year. His team won't be as strong as it was this year."

I have to agree Contador, Armstrong and Sastre, the alst Tour winners, had strong teams, but I wonder if Landis's, Pereiro's, Riis's, Ullrich's and Pantani's teams' strength had much to do with their wins. I'm not sure I fully suport the notion that you have to have a strong team to win the Tour (unless there's a team time trial involved!). It certainly helps out to have someone help you close gaps in the mountains, but... Otherwise, it feels like you would use a team only to bring you back to the peloton if there's a fracture in the peloton or you're left behind after a mechanical or a crash...

thehog said:
ALMATY, Kazakhstan (AP) ... Kazakh Cycling Federation deputy president Nikolai Proskurin said Tuesday that the International Cycling Union is demanding a bank guarantee of Astana's annual budget before it will renew its ProTour license... Proskurin says the demand is unreasonable and that he is unsure whether Astana can meet Wednesday's deadline.

Out of curiosity, where'd you find this? You seemed to have put this up here before it got on CN... I wonder if this is a special requirement based on last year's issues or if they expect this from every team...
 
manolo said:
Out of curiosity, where'd you find this? You seemed to have put this up here before it got on CN... I wonder if this is a special requirement based on last year's issues or if they expect this from every team...

Fran sends me the press releases and I send them to Associated Press.
 
manolo said:
Ligget mentions in the Times article that"he thinks "Alberto Contador might struggle next year. His team won't be as strong as it was this year."
I have to agree Contador, Armstrong and Sastre, the alst Tour winners, had strong teams, but I wonder if Landis's, Pereiro's, Riis's, Ullrich's and Pantani's teams' strength had much to do with their wins. I'm not sure I fully suport the notion that you have to have a strong team to win the Tour (unless there's a team time trial involved!). It certainly helps out to have someone help you close gaps in the mountains, but... Otherwise, it feels like you would use a team only to bring you back to the peloton if there's a fracture in the peloton or you're left behind after a mechanical or a crash...



Out of curiosity, where'd you find this? You seemed to have put this up here before it got on CN... I wonder if this is a special requirement based on last year's issues or if they expect this from every team...

You should know that everything that comes out of Liggett's mouth as it relates to AC is colored by the fact that he has his head firmly planted up Lance's bum. His commentary during this year's TdF was ridiculous, as is this statement. But that's just my opinion. I think when the dust settles, we'll see a stronger AC with perhaps as not as strong a team, but a UNITED team--something he didn't have this year.
 
manolo said:
Out of curiosity, where'd you find this? You seemed to have put this up here before it got on CN... I wonder if this is a special requirement based on last year's issues or if they expect this from every team...

ALMATY, Kazakhstan - The future of Tour de France champion Alberto Contador's Astana team is again in doubt after cycling's ruling body made new demands for financial guarantees.

Kazakh Cycling Federation deputy president Nikolai Proskurin said Tuesday that the International Cycling Union is demanding a bank guarantee of Astana's annual budget before it will renew its ProTour licence.

Proskurin says the demand is unreasonable and that he is unsure whether Astana can meet Wednesday's deadline.

The team's inclusion in competition next season had appeared certain last week, when the oil-rich Kazakhstan government pledged US$22 million in financial support for next season.

UCI has given Astana until Wednesday to provide the guarantee, but Proskurin said it is unlikely the issue can be resolved by then. Failure to secure the ProTour licence will force Astana to release Contador - the world's top-ranked rider.

Proskurin said Astana, for which Lance Armstrong rode in the 2009 Tour, is the only team being subjected to such rigorous financial demands by UCI.

"It seems to me that they don't want an Asian team in the ProTour, and for it to beat European teams," he said.

The team's current racing licence is due to expire at the end of next year, but recurring delays in paying salaries to riders caused the UCI to demand guarantees on the team's financial viability by the end of last week.

Proskurin said Samruk-Kazyna provided UCI with a pledge worth $22 million per season for the next four years to back Astana. UCI has rejected assurances from Samruk-Kazyna, however, and demanded a financial guarantee from a bank, he said.

"But a guarantee from Samruk-Kazyna is much more important, because it has the stamp of approval of the government itself," Proskurin said.
 
Publicus said:
You should know that everything that comes out of Liggett's mouth as it relates to AC is colored by the fact that he has his head firmly planted up Lance's bum. His commentary during this year's TdF was ridiculous, as is this statement. But that's just my opinion. I think when the dust settles, we'll see a stronger AC with perhaps as not as strong a team, but a UNITED team--something he didn't have this year.

Surprisingly among the 4 announcers, Liggett was the only who supported Contador's attack on Andorra-Arcalis. The other 3 were outraged at his insolence.:D With Sherwin having worked as PR man for one of Armstrong's teams during his career and of course Roll being in Armstrong's pocket and showing no shame about his blind support, Liggett may be the closest to an impartial observer on that panel as we're likely to get.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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Angliru said:
Surprisingly among the 4 announcers, Liggett was the only who supported Contador's attack on Andorra-Arcalis. The other 3 were outraged at his insolence.:D With Sherwin having worked as PR man for one of Armstrong's teams during his career and of course Roll being in Armstrong's pocket and showing no shame about his blind support, Liggett may be the closest to an impartial observer on that panel as we're likely to get.

I was impressed when Liggett said that too. But is comments on the pre-race show of the final stage were over the top. He pointed to his head and said neither Contador nor Schleck are smart enough to put a team together to beat LA next year. First off, Schleck didn't have any team to put together and second I'm fairly certain any TDF winner is aware of what type of support riders he needs. Putting a cycling team together isn't rocket science.
 
Jun 24, 2009
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richwagmn said:
I was impressed when Liggett said that too. But is comments on the pre-race show of the final stage were over the top. He pointed to his head and said neither Contador nor Schleck are smart enough to put a team together to beat LA next year. First off, Schleck didn't have any team to put together and second I'm fairly certain any TDF winner is aware of what type of support riders he needs. Putting a cycling team together isn't rocket science.

Not only, is it not rocket science. If a rider is dominant, he doesn't even need that much of a team at all.This team thing was way overemphasized this past year. Mainly because Versus, and LA wanted to put it into a team follow the leader kind of context, hoping that LA could grab the lead and all would be obligated to follow him, through thick and thin, sort of the kind of retro journey Kloden subjected himself to. My contention is that, once the opening shots are fired, be it in a ITT, or the first mountain top stage. The stage will be set, the most important team to be on from that point on is the Contenders team. That team will be comprised of the riders who will be contending for the title, and are strong enough and in striking position to see it through into Paris.
If Radio Shack want to throw down a nasty tempo to drop all pretenders, that's fine, but if LA can keep up to that tempo,do you think A.Schleck will falter? Do you think a tempo that LA can hold onto, will shake AC?
In 2005 Popovych threw down a mean last surge of tempo for LA as Superman ran alongside. Remember that one? but as LA took up the lead A. Valverde stayed with him, and the first one across the finish line was Valverde. LA better have upped his ITTing skills to notches out of the past, if he's going to try that kind of trade off again, in 2010. I predict that LA will be just another domestique on the Contenders team in 2010. As valuable as a Chechu, or a Popovych, adding lots of color for the American TV audiences, but not a winner. AC will not be bound by a treacherous team as in 2010. And A. Schleck will be another year stronger and more mature. It's going to be very interesting this coming year, but I don't think TEAM will define the most exciting moments. Especially with the omission of the TTT at this years TdF......We'll see.......:cool:
 
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racerralph said:
Not only, is it not rocket science. If a rider is dominant, he doesn't even need that much of a team at all.This team thing was way overemphasized this past year. Mainly because Versus, and LA wanted to put it into a team follow the leader kind of context, hoping that LA could grab the lead and all would be obligated to follow him, through thick and thin, sort of the kind of retro journey Kloden subjected himself to. My contention is that, once the opening shots are fired, be it in a ITT, or the first mountain top stage. The stage will be set, the most important team to be on from that point on is the Contenders team. That team will be comprised of the riders who will be contending for the title, and are strong enough and in striking position to see it through into Paris.
If Radio Shack want to throw down a nasty tempo to drop all pretenders, that's fine, but if LA can keep up to that tempo,do you think A.Schleck will falter? Do you think a tempo that LA can hold onto, will shake AC?
In 2005 Popovych threw down a mean last surge of tempo for LA as Superman ran alongside. Remember that one? but as LA took up the lead A. Valverde stayed with him, and the first one across the finish line was Valverde. LA better have upped his ITTing skills to notches out of the past, if he's going to try that kind of trade off again, in 2010. I predict that LA will be just another domestique on the Contenders team in 2010. As valuable as a Chechu, or a Popovych, adding lots of color for the American TV audiences, but not a winner. AC will not be bound by a treacherous team as in 2010. And A. Schleck will be another year stronger and more mature. It's going to be very interesting this coming year, but I don't think TEAM will define the most exciting moments. Especially with the omission of the TTT at this years TdF......We'll see.......:cool:

I think a strong team does matter if the team isn't concerned about which one of them wins.

Saxo Bank with the Schlecks is in that boat. They can alternate attacks in hopes that the other leaders eventually can't pull one back. Astana this past year COULD have been that type of team (with 4 legitimate threats going into the tour). But two of the egos (both Lance and Contador) prevented that from being possible.

If Contador is isolated in the mountains and Levi, Kloden and Lance are all there... they COULD use their strength to force Contador to pull back a series of attacks... but I'm not sure how much benefit they'd get if Contador just kept attacking after pulling back the initial attack. They would have an advantage in that they could relay to slowly pull back a contador attack perhaps. And if it's "all for Lance" (as we all expect), they won't force his hand with a series of attacks anyway.

Perhaps some sort of bridge attack? Send someone like Paulinho or Popo in a morning break... if it stays away to the bottom of the critical long climb then send Levi at the very base of the climb before the favorites are ready to attack... then attack with Lance to bridge to Levi who kills himself to get Lance a little further away... then bridge to Paulinho who does the same?

I don't know how effective things like that would be, but it seems like a team with 3 very good climbers and 3-4 pretty good climbers like Radioshack will have with Armstrong/Kloden/Leipheimer/Brajkovik/Popovych/Paulinho/Zubeldia/Horner should be able to use the numbers to some sort of advantage to try to defeat an elite climber without as much help on the team. I'm not sure they WILL... but you'd think there are strategies that could work for them.
 
kurtinsc said:
I think a strong team does matter if the team isn't concerned about which one of them wins.

Saxo Bank with the Schlecks is in that boat. They can alternate attacks in hopes that the other leaders eventually can't pull one back. Astana this past year COULD have been that type of team (with 4 legitimate threats going into the tour). But two of the egos (both Lance and Contador) prevented that from being possible.

If Contador is isolated in the mountains and Levi, Kloden and Lance are all there... they COULD use their strength to force Contador to pull back a series of attacks... but I'm not sure how much benefit they'd get if Contador just kept attacking after pulling back the initial attack. They would have an advantage in that they could relay to slowly pull back a contador attack perhaps. And if it's "all for Lance" (as we all expect), they won't force his hand with a series of attacks anyway.

Perhaps some sort of bridge attack? Send someone like Paulinho or Popo in a morning break... if it stays away to the bottom of the critical long climb then send Levi at the very base of the climb before the favorites are ready to attack... then attack with Lance to bridge to Levi who kills himself to get Lance a little further away... then bridge to Paulinho who does the same?

I don't know how effective things like that would be, but it seems like a team with 3 very good climbers and 3-4 pretty good climbers like Radioshack will have with Armstrong/Kloden/Leipheimer/Brajkovik/Popovych/Paulinho/Zubeldia/Horner should be able to use the numbers to some sort of advantage to try to defeat an elite climber without as much help on the team. I'm not sure they WILL... but you'd think there are strategies that could work for them.

I just don't see this working. First of all, we've seen how AC handles attacks--he marks the first couple of moves, waits for a lull in the action and then goes--HARD and in 2009 that usually ended all of the attacks. Second, none of the guys on RadioShack can put in an attack (or multiple attacks) to dislodge AC or put him under pressure. He rode with them in July. Did you ever see AC tell them to slow down? Heck, in an interview he was suggesting that he wanted them to ride a HIGHER tempo. So I'm guessing that he's not that worried about RadioShack.

Moreover, folks seem to forget that this isn't a two-team race. Liquigas is going to have 3 guys that can win (Basso, Nibali and Kreuzinger (sp)). Saxo Bank will have the Schleck Brothers. Cervelo will have Carlos Sastre. CdE will (possibly) have LL Sanchez and Valverde. I say there are enough threats on the road that RadioShack will be the least of AC and Astana's worries. This may shape up to be a pretty good TdF (assuming all the favorites get through the cobbles without injury).
 
racerralph said:
Not only, is it not rocket science. If a rider is dominant, he doesn't even need that much of a team at all.This team thing was way overemphasized this past year. Mainly because Versus, and LA wanted to put it into a team follow the leader kind of context, hoping that LA could grab the lead and all would be obligated to follow him, through thick and thin, sort of the kind of retro journey Kloden subjected himself to. My contention is that, once the opening shots are fired, be it in a ITT, or the first mountain top stage. The stage will be set, the most important team to be on from that point on is the Contenders team. That team will be comprised of the riders who will be contending for the title, and are strong enough and in striking position to see it through into Paris.
If Radio Shack want to throw down a nasty tempo to drop all pretenders, that's fine, but if LA can keep up to that tempo,do you think A.Schleck will falter? Do you think a tempo that LA can hold onto, will shake AC?
In 2005 Popovych threw down a mean last surge of tempo for LA as Superman ran alongside. Remember that one? but as LA took up the lead A. Valverde stayed with him, and the first one across the finish line was Valverde. LA better have upped his ITTing skills to notches out of the past, if he's going to try that kind of trade off again, in 2010. I predict that LA will be just another domestique on the Contenders team in 2010. As valuable as a Chechu, or a Popovych, adding lots of color for the American TV audiences, but not a winner. AC will not be bound by a treacherous team as in 2010. And A. Schleck will be another year stronger and more mature. It's going to be very interesting this coming year, but I don't think TEAM will define the most exciting moments. Especially with the omission of the TTT at this years TdF......We'll see.......:cool:

This sounds about right to me (not that that matters).
 

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