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Contador's fframe of mind and his attacks in the mountain stages

Page 8 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.

What was Contador's frame of mind during the Tour?

  • Had Lance not taken time on me, I would have beeen ok with Lance and Klodi No. 2 and 3.

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Mountain Goat said:
WOW... Yet another contribution to cycling from Hugh to the professional road racing forum!! HAHAHA you're a cranky boy! I like ya!

Can't we just talk about cycling, it really is a great sport, a lot better than forum insults... Pretty please? ;)

Well here's the thing buddy. When talking about cycling it sometimes gets annoying when people bring up ridiculous arguments like this one that has been lurching along for some time now. This idea that it is somehow the team leader's obligation to wait for his domestique/s on the last climb of a stage suggests to me that the individuals championing it either don't have a very good understanding of PRO cycling or they are just saying something contrary to spark an argument (aka Trolling).
It is the number 1 duty of the team leader to deliver the win, everything else is secondary. In this case it has been clouded by the ultimate teabaggery of Lance fans who now seem to be Contador haters simply because he put their boy in his place. Actually Contador probably did a few things that helped LA to a higher place than he would otherwise have gotten, but that is beside the point.
I have said it before and I'll say it one last time. The blame for all that went on at the tour rests fully on Bruyneel's shoulders. Armstrong should not have been allowed on the team in the first place, but since he was he should have been controlled in both his words and actions to keep to the only team plan that made sense, helping Contador win the 4th straight GT that he entered.
Armstrong rode well for an old guy back from 2 years off but there is no way anymore he matches up to Contador as a GT leader.
 
Aug 1, 2009
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montagna lunga said:
Your child sulks when he pays the salary of a "team"-mate who then rides away, as if they were on dope?

Are you actually suggesting that Armstrong deserved to win because he payed for it?
 
Mar 12, 2009
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Hugh Januss said:
Well here's the thing buddy. When talking about cycling it sometimes gets annoying when people bring up ridiculous arguments like this one that has been lurching along for some time now. This idea that it is somehow the team leader's obligation to wait for his domestique/s on the last climb of a stage suggests to me that the individuals championing it either don't have a very good understanding of PRO cycling or they are just saying something contrary to spark an argument (aka Trolling).
It is the number 1 duty of the team leader to deliver the win, everything else is secondary. In this case it has been clouded by the ultimate teabaggery of Lance fans who now seem to be Contador haters simply because he put their boy in his place. Actually Contador probably did a few things that helped LA to a higher place than he would otherwise have gotten, but that is beside the point.
I have said it before and I'll say it one last time. The blame for all that went on at the tour rests fully on Bruyneel's shoulders. Armstrong should not have been allowed on the team in the first place, but since he was he should have been controlled in both his words and actions to keep to the only team plan that made sense, helping Contador win the 4th straight GT that he entered.
Armstrong rode well for an old guy back from 2 years off but there is no way anymore he matches up to Contador as a GT leader.

+1
well said
 
Aug 4, 2009
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HL2037 said:
Are you actually suggesting that Armstrong deserved to win because he payed for it?
Um, sure, wasn't that absolutely clear? :rolleyes: Actually, if the guy pouts thats his biz, but he did cover the payroll cost for the team. (i.e. paid AC's salary)

racerralph said:
What? have you got the hiccups?? choking might be nice.:eek: sorry, you make it irresistible.
Naw, just no such thing as an original thought, eh? But sauce for the goos s/b sauce for the gander too, eh?
 
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montagna lunga said:
Um, sure, wasn't that absolutely clear? :rolleyes: Actually, if the guy pouts thats his biz, but he did cover the payroll cost for the team. (i.e. paid AC's salary)

Are you aware that LA raced for Astana for free (whateverthatmeans)?
He didn't pay nothing to AC, but maybe he tried to... :D
 
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peloton said:
Are you aware that LA raced for Astana for free (whateverthatmeans)? He didn't pay nothing to AC, but maybe he tried to... :D
What you think you read was that LA did not collect a salary from the crooked team owners. What you're ignoring is that LA kicked out the coin to keep the team on the road (pay the riders) who had not received a salary since springtime. --shrug-- I am also aware that the average post-er here's kind of a dil. Thanks for maintaining the average ;-)
 
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montagna lunga said:
What you think you read was that LA did not collect a salary from the crooked team owners. What you're ignoring is that LA kicked out the coin to keep the team on the road (pay the riders) who had not received a salary since springtime. --shrug-- I am also aware that the average post-er here's kind of a dil. Thanks for maintaining the average ;-)

Thanks for the insult, I guess.

You have any proof Lance was paying the riders?
Since as far as I know, the money has come from the sponsor, hence the Team Faded during the Giro etc. to press the money, which they finally delivered. No Lance money here.
And I don't believe for a second LA would've paid anything to AC, except maybe trying to bribe AC to help him win the Tour. :D

It's ok to have a hero, but you might want to have a reality check, looking at your posts.
 
I recently read a great interview done by Pro Cycling magazine to the Schleck brothers where they're asked about AC's attack on stage 17 and they categorically said they saw it coming-since they were attacking constantly & pulling the pace all the time without any reaction from the Astana boys-which looked suspicious-but when it happened, their interpretation of it was more like an Intimidating move, rather than a decisive one-since he kept looking back searching for kloden-and hoping he was going to stay with the Schlecks-but they kept the pace high and is there when Kloden blew apart!!!

so basically-"the protagonists" of that moment saw that move as a "part" of the competition,nothing less-nothing more...

I just cannot believe why some people here are still debating this issue at all.
 
A

Anonymous

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Can't we all just get along

Hugh Januss said:
Well here's the thing buddy. When talking about cycling it sometimes gets annoying when people bring up ridiculous arguments like this one that has been lurching along for some time now. This idea that it is somehow the team leader's obligation to wait for his domestique/s on the last climb of a stage suggests to me that the individuals championing it either don't have a very good understanding of PRO cycling or they are just saying something contrary to spark an argument (aka Trolling).
It is the number 1 duty of the team leader to deliver the win, everything else is secondary. In this case it has been clouded by the ultimate teabaggery of Lance fans who now seem to be Contador haters simply because he put their boy in his place.

I agree with most of what you say here. But, fyi, i'm not making a ridiculous argument, as many people agree with me, and if that means to you that I don't have a good understanding of pro cycling, then that's fine.

What you wrote in the bold, is exactly what we've been discussing. Contador had already delivered the win (the 'primary' goal), and all i've been saying in this thread, is that it was possible to get 3 astanas on the podium (i.e. they could have acheived something 'secondary'). I have accepted that we don't agree on this

What you wrote in the underline, is not who I am. I've repeatedly stated in this forum that I am a huge fan of Contador, and I think he's one of the best riders to watch in recent years and I would love to see him stay at the top for the next 5 years.

The problem that I have with you, is that three times, i've contributed to this thread purely in relation to the topic, and on those three times, you either call me delusional, a re-tard, or that i have no understanding of pro cycling. Based on your definition of trolling, you are the one that is trolling, as you keep trying to spark a personal argument with these petty insults. I'm trying to keep it on topic!! I like discussing this topic with you, becoz i think we both have interesting perspectives about what happened at the tour - hence, this is a forum about cycling, and there is no need for your insults. If I annoy you, then ignore me!!

As for the thread itself, I don't know why people are coming in here saying its a 'dead' topic. Cycling analysts still to this day discuss the antics between Hinault and Lemond, so i think 3 months of discussing AC and LA is perfect reasonable.
 
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flogging-dead-horse.jpg
 
Mountain Goat said:
Hugh Januss said:
Well here's the thing buddy. When talking about cycling it sometimes gets annoying when people bring up ridiculous arguments like this one that has been lurching along for some time now. This idea that it is somehow the team leader's obligation to wait for his domestique/s on the last climb of a stage suggests to me that the individuals championing it either don't have a very good understanding of PRO cycling or they are just saying something contrary to spark an argument (aka Trolling).
It is the number 1 duty of the team leader to deliver the win, everything else is secondary. In this case it has been clouded by the ultimate teabaggery of Lance fans who now seem to be Contador haters simply because he put their boy in his place.

I agree with most of what you say here. But, fyi, i'm not making a ridiculous argument, as many people agree with me, and if that means to you that I don't have a good understanding of pro cycling, then that's fine.

What you wrote in the bold, is exactly what we've been discussing. Contador had already delivered the win (the 'primary' goal), and all i've been saying in this thread, is that it was possible to get 3 astanas on the podium (i.e. they could have acheived something 'secondary'). I have accepted that we don't agree on this

What you wrote in the underline, is not who I am. I've repeatedly stated in this forum that I am a huge fan of Contador, and I think he's one of the best riders to watch in recent years and I would love to see him stay at the top for the next 5 years.

The problem that I have with you, is that three times, i've contributed to this thread purely in relation to the topic, and on those three times, you either call me delusional, a re-tard, or that i have no understanding of pro cycling. Based on your definition of trolling, you are the one that is trolling, as you keep trying to spark a personal argument with these petty insults. I'm trying to keep it on topic!! I like discussing this topic with you, becoz i think we both have interesting perspectives about what happened at the tour - hence, this is a forum about cycling, and there is no need for your insults. If I annoy you, then ignore me!!

As for the thread itself, I don't know why people are coming in here saying its a 'dead' topic. Cycling analysts still to this day discuss the antics between Hinault and Lemond, so i think 3 months of discussing AC and LA is perfect reasonable.

At the risk of prolonging this agony let me just point out that the simple fact that a few people agree with your cockeyed point of view is no proof that you know what you are talking about.
BTW I looked back at a number of your posts and you seem to have the habit of ending with a dig of some sort at whomever you are responding to which is probably what causes me to respond in the vein that I do.
 
Apr 15, 2009
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Jeez 19 pages..... fantastic..

The whole shenanigans of the tour comes down to one word... CLASS; El Pistolero has it in buckets.

Berto won on the road, he won in the hotel and largely, he won in the hearts of many people who couldn't believe the Armstrong they were watching and reading about, the man is trash. Say what you like, only one man shone in France this year, his name wasn't Lance.
 
Aug 25, 2009
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To my mind the crazy thing is I don't see how any of us could know what could've happened. It got to the point armstrong was helping contador as a team-mate to ensure his victory. Contador was in turn helping armstrong to beat f Schleck and Wiggins to third, A Schleck was doing similar for his brother. Ended up pretty clear cut top 3 in the end, but sadly the three of them weren't really going hard at each other in the latter stages.
 
Jun 24, 2009
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Weatherman said:
Jeez 19 pages..... fantastic..

The whole shenanigans of the tour comes down to one word... CLASS; El Pistolero has it in buckets.

Berto won on the road, he won in the hotel and largely, he won in the hearts of many people who couldn't believe the Armstrong they were watching and reading about, the man is trash. Say what you like, only one man shone in France this year, his name wasn't Lance.

Let me hear an, AMEN!:D
 
L'Equipe, October 14, 2009

Alberto Contador regrets not knowing anything about his future but is not afraid of Armstrong or the Schleck brothers.

Invited by Amaury Sport Organisation (ASO), Alberto Contador and his brother Fran arrived very early yesterday morning from Madrid, 24 hours before the Tour 2010 presentation, which is taking place this morning in the Paris Palais des Congrès. The Tour 2009 winner then went round to the Senate (Palais du Luxembourg) where he had a lunch date with the senators, before granting us a relaxed interview in the Concorde Lafayette hotel lounge.

Two-and-a-half months after your Tour victory, your future is still not settled. Does this situation exasperate you?

I’ve learned to not lose my temper anymore. In spite of a situation which seems to be stuck in a rut and never moving in the right direction, I’m trying to handle that calmly. Having to rush all over the place recently to meet several obligations has kept me from having to think about the problem all the time. But obviously, we’re now arriving at a point in the season where I’d really like my situation to be settled. It doesn’t matter if it’s with Astana or with another team, but that should be clarified as soon as possible.

For the winner of the three big tours and of the last Tour de France to not know what his future holds is rather unusual, isn’t it?

The whole season has been unusual. Armstrong’s comeback this year upset lot of things on the team. Everything became very difficult to manage, whereas it could’ve been handled in a much simpler way. Then, there’ve been the departures of Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel to another team for next season. There again, that created waves which are still rocking the boat inside Astana today. In spite of this huge commotion, I’ve always managed to stay focused.

You’ve clearly shown your wish to leave Astana, whereas there is still one year of your contract to ride. Is that still what you want?

The problem is that I’m waiting for a serious plan from the people behind Astana. But we still don’t know, or no longer know, who’ll run the team next season or even if its future in cycling is in question or not. If tomorrow everything is settled, and I’m presented with a serious plan with a team capable of supporting me for the Tour, I’ll have no problem in honoring my remaining year of contract. But I’ll also have to analyze all the possibilities.

Have you contacted the Kazakhs to tell them your needs for who you want as team mates, or suggested a manager capable of running the team?

No, quite simply because the whole future of the team is not clear. Under these conditions, how can I go forward and express my requirements? Today, if I believe what I hear, even Johan Bruyneel is not certain that he can leave the team. It’s up to the Kazakhs to appoint a manager, a real one, and on a permanent basis, so that we can quickly get down to business. But they should stop putting forward a name one day, and then another name the next day. In the end, it’s not serious.

It is supposed that you have had contacts with Caisse d’Epargne, Garmin, or even Quick Step. Were these different approaches really serious?

I think that in each case there was a real desire on the part of the teams which contacted me. All the angles have been carefully examined. But there’s this one year of contract which still ties me to Astana, and I realized that there was no point in trying to force the issue. I don’t think I’d have won if there had been a fight.

Other riders still under contract with Astana nevertheless seem to have been allowed to leave.

It’s true for some of them, but there are others for whom nothing is finalized yet, in spite of what’s been written. In my case, I’ve been told that my departure was not negotiable once Astana had decided to carry on next year. And after all, it has to be said that the ones who’re leaving are not really indispensable for the team.

One thing is sure today: Armstrong will no longer be at your side. Are you relieved?

It suits me fine. Not being on the same team as Lance next year removes a thorn from my side. Now he’ll have a team totally committed to his cause. In all honesty, I could not see myself re-living another season like the one I have just experienced again, and above, all ride another Tour de France under the same conditions.

But he already has a team today, even if some things still remain to be settled, whereas you are still in the dark. Aren’t you starting with a real handicap?

I’d be lying if I said that the current situation concerning a competitive team for the next Tour doesn’t bother me. You can’t win the Tour on your own. There are always moments when you need your teammates to support you. That’s precisely the plan that Astana is still unable to establish for 2010 and which remains my biggest worry today.

Nothing was easy for you in 2009...

The whole season was complicated. The Tour was a daily hassle, but not on the road. And right now nothing is clear concerning the future of Astana. So, you’re right, lots of things have bothered me and are still bothering me.

Do you think that Armstrong will be your main rival for the next Tour?


He’ll certainly be there with the aim of winning, just as he came this year with that objective. But Andy Schleck is much more on my mind than Armstrong. Lance will nevertheless be in the group of favourites. I respect everybody but I’m afraid of no one.

You’ve certainly heard some things about the Tour 2010 circuit. One hears of tough stages in the Pyrenees, cobblestone sections, or a long ITT on the penultimate day. What do you think of that?


I’ve also heard that the departure will be from Rotterdam (laughs). Yes, I’ve also heard of an arrival on top of the Tourmalet, then of another stage with the Tourmalet again, and other high summits. As long as there are mountain, I’m in my element. I’ve heard of a 50-kilometer ITT near Bordeaux. It’s maybe 10 kilometers too much for me, but we’ll adapt. As for the cobblestones, it’s true that it’s not my cup of tea. For sure, it will be spectacular, but the important thing will be to stay focused that day and not to fall.

Do you think you will get the Velo d’Or (Golden Bike award) from Velo Magazine this year?

I hope so. It’s an award that I really appreciate and I’m proud of having won it last year. But everything depends on the votes, and there are riders like Cavendish, Cancellara or Evans who also had a great year.