Current top 5 (or 10) Cyclists from your country

[Libertine Seguros]

portugal

1- tiago machado ( a lot of potential and amazing rider to watch)
2- rui costa (even tho i hope he turns into a GT top guy i reckon he can prolly just be like luis leon shanches and get a lot of 1 week races and maybe some hilly classics)
3- sergio paulinho (manolo sainz killed his futured and bruynel buried it but he still is a very good rider and a very nice guy that gives all he has for his leader( ex: tour 2009 for conti)
4- manuel machado (hard pick here btw him nelson oliveira and andre cardoso but since he rides on a pro tour team and seems to be developing rather well i can see him getting some second class sprint wins)
5- nelson oliveira/andre cardoso( first has an amazing ITT potential(eighth in this year tour de l'avenir prologue) and some decent montain pontential, maybe a GT kind of rider second has a lot of montain potential prolly could be a very good domestique like he was in this year volta)

anyway since there aren't many portuguese people around, could you guys give a small opinion about them? i am sure you are getting tired of discussing gesink err i mean the amazing dutch riders <3

Manuel Cardoso will be on the Shack next year, which will probably destroy him since they have no interest in sprinting whatsoever. I don't think I can argue much with your top 5, especially now that Cândido Barbosa's on the wane. Sérgio Ribeiro has shown lots this year, and considering he raced the Volta less than 3 weeks after breaking his collarbone, and his results in Alentejo and elsewhere, José João Mendes deserves a bit of a mention (and what of Hernâni Broco, two years in the wilderness at Liberty Seguros, comes back to be the best-placed Portuguese at the Volta at LA). Mestre has also been very good as a domestique but I'd rank him below André Cardoso.

I will be very interested to see how Nelson Oliveira develops as a rider at Xacobeo; they've been pretty good with him so far, allowed him the time out to race the U23 races, allowed him to focus his season around the Volta, where they've given him some support (while having the main body of the team in Burgos with Mosquera of course). Part of me is rather happy that he's got out of the domestic calendar early - he'll have more chances to hone his craft internationally with Xacobeo; he did the Tour of Turkey and was 6th overall in the Bayern Rundfahrt - plus he isn't being hidden underneath Puerto exiles in a scene notorious for its doping problems... (actually he's racing for a Spanish continental team, maybe I should rethink that last bit).

 

[Sydney21]

My top 10 for Aus would be
1. Evans (WC, FW, Giro stage, 2 time tdf runner up, always competative)
2. Haussler (2nd in 2 monuments last yr (san remo + Flanders) + tour stage, hasnt had the chance this year)
3. Rogers (Andalucia, California)
4. Gerrans (stage in all 3 GT's + top tens in ardennes last yr)
5. O'Grady (Roubaix, would still win races if wasnt so loyal, might get his chance at roubaix next yr)
6. Porte (promising young gun 7th in Giro + romandie TT + top 10 in San Sebastian, should be riding worlds RR)
7. Goss (Giro, Plouay)
8. Renshaw (will get his chance when he finally leaves cav - sooner the better, 2nd in Tdf stage where cav choked)
9. Lloyd (best mountains domestique in aus)
10. McEwen (still got pace but wont be there for long + i wouldnt have picked him for WC either)

 

[tgsgirl]

You can't put women in the same ranking unless they did the same races. In which case they wouldn't make the top 5 or 105

Mark Cavendish and Taylor Phinney have never been in a race together. Which of the two are we allowed to include in our lists?

 

[Ferminal]

Matt Goss is a rider that should definetly be in the top 5. Maybe he can replace Mcewen. Get rid of lloyd as well. I hope you are joking about Graeme Brown!


What other results did he get other than the Giro opening tt?

National ITT Champion?

 

[simo1733]

Cav Phinney

Mark Cavendish and Taylor Phinney have never been in a race together. Which of the two are we allowed to include in our lists?

I would put Cav at the top of the GB list. I wouldn't put Taylor Phinney in the US list because as u point out, he doesn't have results at the very highest level as yet

 

[hrotha]

National ITT Champion?

3rd in Vuelta a Murcia, decent showing in the Giro (aside from the prologue) and not completely terrible Tour if you forget about 2009 for a minute. I only see Cav and Millar improving that, especially when this thread isn't supposed to be just about results, as we can all check CQ. It's also about potential.

 

[Anonymous]

Emma Pooley is a very fine cyclist no doubt, but she isn't better than any protour mens cyclist.If u want to just count up the wins why don't u include vets or juniors as well.Maybe Malcolm Elliot is the best British cyclist.Or have u got something against vets?

Malcolms had a poor season though. I seem to remember though when we did the all time best riders from our home nation I had malcolm 2nd to Robert Millar, a lot of people criticised my inclusion of the old man.

 

[LukeSchmid]

Mens Road in Australia:

1. Cadel Evans


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2. Michael Rogers
3. Heinrich Haussler
4. Richie Porte
5. Matthew Goss
6. Matthew Lloyd
7. Mark Renshaw
8. Robbie McEwen
9. Simon Gerrans
10. Stuart O'Grady

O'Grady 10th even though he has no recent results, but you would still pick him in your GT or Classics lineup. My Tour squad would be the above, with Robbie and probably Goss missing out.

I think this list is right. Better than mine because I forgot Haussler completely and I didn't really consider Lloyd enough.

 

[theyoungest]

Mark Cavendish and Taylor Phinney have never been in a race together. Which of the two are we allowed to include in our lists?

Come on, you know what he means. Comparing women to men is an unfair standard, and makes no sense whatsoever. Probably the best cyclist in women's racing right now is Dutch, but I wouldn't include her in the list of best Dutch riders, as I'd have no idea how to rate her.

 

[Anonymous]

Come on, you know what he means. Comparing women to men is an unfair standard, and makes no sense whatsoever. Probably the best cyclist in women's racing right now is Dutch, but I wouldn't include her in the list of best Dutch riders, as I'd have no idea how to rate her.

How do you rate the male riders, how many wins they have, how they perform in comparison to their peers, etc. When you look at Cav you look at his wins, how much promise he has, how he performs compared with other sprinters etc. Cav, Brad, Geraint etc are all different riders yet we manage to decide which is better, if you have a knowledge of the female riders applying the same criteria is not exactly difficult.

But as someone said, its subjective lists based on opinion.. Who cares..

 

[theyoungest]

How do you rate the male riders, how many wins they have, how they perform in comparison to their peers, etc. When you look at Cav you look at his wins, how much promise he has, how he performs compared with other sprinters etc. Cav, Brad, Geraint etc are all different riders yet we manage to decide which is better, if you have a knowledge of the female riders applying the same criteria is not exactly difficult.

But as someone said, its subjective lists based on opinion.. Who cares..

Oh well, in that case, the 5 best riders from The Netherlands:

1. Marianne Vos
2. Kirsten Wild
3. Robert Gesink
4. Bauke Mollema
5. Annemiek van Vleuten


Total nonsense, but as you say: who cares

 

[sublimit]

Best rider at the top reading downwards-

Cavendish

Thomas

Wiggans (rubbish year but a capable rider, rode OK at the Giro)

Hammond

Kennaugh

Best domestic rider - Simon Richardson.

I dont know enough about the girl riders so its difficult to comment, but Rebecca Romero is a decent rider. Looks to have a big engine and is class but I dont know what her plans are for the future. Track, road, rowing or whatever.

 

[simo1733]

How do you rate the male riders, how many wins they have, how they perform in comparison to their peers, etc. When you look at Cav you look at his wins, how much promise he has, how he performs compared with other sprinters etc. Cav, Brad, Geraint etc are all different riders yet we manage to decide which is better, if you have a knowledge of the female riders applying the same criteria is not exactly difficult.

But as someone said, its subjective lists based on opinion.. Who cares..

If u judge the women on that basis u will find they can't climb as well as Cav, they can't sprint as well as Wiggo and can't TT as well as Sean Yates

 

[tgsgirl]

Come on, you know what he means. Comparing women to men is an unfair standard, and makes no sense whatsoever. Probably the best cyclist in women's racing right now is Dutch, but I wouldn't include her in the list of best Dutch riders, as I'd have no idea how to rate her.

How do you rate the male riders, how many wins they have, how they perform in comparison to their peers, etc. When you look at Cav you look at his wins, how much promise he has, how he performs compared with other sprinters etc. Cav, Brad, Geraint etc are all different riders yet we manage to decide which is better, if you have a knowledge of the female riders applying the same criteria is not exactly difficult.

The best current Dutch cyclist is not Robert Gesink but Marianne Vos, 23 years old. She's still eligible for best young rider jerseys, and yet she's world champion cyclocross, world champion track, world champion on the road; twice winner of Flèche Wallonne, podium spots in RVV, multiple stage winner in the Tour de L'Aude, La Route de France and the Giro Femininile to name but a few stage races... A girl about whom her direct competition* says "everything is Vos' territory".

Fair game if you don't know how to rate the female cyclists, but others do. But saying we're not "allowed to" because they happen to be professional cyclists who have breasts, is idiotic and sexist. If you can compare Tom Boonen and Jurgen Vandenbroeck, or Oscar Freire and Alberto Contador - riders who don't have the same specialisations or fight for the same objectives - than you can compare Robert Gesink and Marianne Vos, or Mark Cavendish and Emma Pooley.

*Ina-Yoko Teutenberg, HTC Columbia

 

[Parrulo]

Manuel Cardoso will be on the Shack next year, which will probably destroy him since they have no interest in sprinting whatsoever. I don't think I can argue much with your top 5, especially now that Cândido Barbosa's on the wane. Sérgio Ribeiro has shown lots this year, and considering he raced the Volta less than 3 weeks after breaking his collarbone, and his results in Alentejo and elsewhere, José João Mendes deserves a bit of a mention (and what of Hernâni Broco, two years in the wilderness at Liberty Seguros, comes back to be the best-placed Portuguese at the Volta at LA). Mestre has also been very good as a domestique but I'd rank him below André Cardoso.

I will be very interested to see how Nelson Oliveira develops as a rider at Xacobeo; they've been pretty good with him so far, allowed him the time out to race the U23 races, allowed him to focus his season around the Volta, where they've given him some support (while having the main body of the team in Burgos with Mosquera of course). Part of me is rather happy that he's got out of the domestic calendar early - he'll have more chances to hone his craft internationally with Xacobeo; he did the Tour of Turkey and was 6th overall in the Bayern Rundfahrt - plus he isn't being hidden underneath Puerto exiles in a scene notorious for its doping problems... (actually he's racing for a Spanish continental team, maybe I should rethink that last bit).

as always your posts are great ^_^

sergio ribeiro, jose mendes, hernani broco, ricardo mestre and vitror rodrigues would be the rest of the top 10 but since i was posting at 5 am my time and was just doing a last look at the forums before bed i decided to stick with a top 5. i did enjoyed a lot hernani's volta performance but i want to see him doing it again so i can put it in the top 5.

and the reason why i am cheering for mosquera to get a great result this vuelta is mostly the way xacobeo is taking care of oliveira. wich seems to be the right way to turn him into a good rider. hopefully he will get a medal in this year worlds ITT competition.

btw am i the only one that thinks rui costa needs to lose a couple of kilos if he wants to turn into a GT rider?

 

[theyoungest]

The best current Dutch cyclist is not Robert Gesink but Marianne Vos, 23 years old. She's still eligible for best young rider jerseys, and yet she's world champion cyclocross, world champion track, world champion on the road; twice winner of Flèche Wallonne, podium spots in RVV, multiple stage winner in the Tour de L'Aude, La Route de France and the Giro Femininile to name but a few stage races... A girl about whom her direct competition* says "everything is Vos' territory".

Fair game if you don't know how to rate the female cyclists, but others do. But saying we're not "allowed to" because they happen to be professional cyclists who have breasts, is idiotic and sexist. If you can compare Tom Boonen and Jurgen Vandenbroeck, or Oscar Freire and Alberto Contador - riders who don't have the same specialisations or fight for the same objectives - than you can compare Robert Gesink and Marianne Vos, or Mark Cavendish and Emma Pooley.

*Ina-Yoko Teutenberg, HTC Columbia

Call me sexist, I think your reaction is condescending, and there's just a disagreement of principle here. But go ahead, what do I care.

 

[Anonymous]

If u judge the women on that basis u will find they can't climb as well as Cav, they can't sprint as well as Wiggo and can't TT as well as Sean Yates

At the last world champs, Kristin armstrongs time/kph would have put her inside the top 40 of the mens (based very loosely on kph as obviously the course length and route was different). On that basis I think Pooley would give Sean Yates a run for his money in a tt, and my gut is cav would struggle on a decent climb although his climbing has improved. The only one who would beat the girls in all disciplines is Brad.

 

[eljimberino]

Hmm When you look at a top 5 the aussies dont really stack up that well.

Is it safe to say Hausler is an aussie now?

If so:

Evans
Hausler
Porte
Lloyd
Renshaw

 

[elapid]

My top 10 for Aus would be
1. Evans (WC, FW, Giro stage, 2 time tdf runner up, always competative)
2. Haussler (2nd in 2 monuments last yr (san remo + Flanders) + tour stage, hasnt had the chance this year)
3. Rogers (Andalucia, California)
4. Gerrans (stage in all 3 GT's + top tens in ardennes last yr)
5. O'Grady (Roubaix, would still win races if wasnt so loyal, might get his chance at roubaix next yr)
6. Porte (promising young gun 7th in Giro + romandie TT + top 10 in San Sebastian, should be riding worlds RR)
7. Goss (Giro, Plouay)
8. Renshaw (will get his chance when he finally leaves cav - sooner the better, 2nd in Tdf stage where cav choked)
9. Lloyd (best mountains domestique in aus)
10. McEwen (still got pace but wont be there for long + i wouldnt have picked him for WC either)

I like this list, especially if you take the last two seasons into account and assume Haussler is now an Aussie. I personally would have a different order and drop O'Grady and Gerrans lower on the list, but that is neither here or there really.

 

[tgsgirl]

Call me sexist, I think your reaction is condescending, and there's just a disagreement of principle here. But go ahead, what do I care.

I don't mean to be condescending (though I may come across as such when I'm irritated), and do I understand if people simply don't know the female cyclists. I've only started following it recently and damnit, it isn't easy with the lack of results. And I don't care if people don't include them in their lists, it's a subjective list after all, but I just think it's stupid if others are told off for including them.

For the record, my list:

1. Philippe Gilbert
2. Tom Boonen
. Grace Verbeke (RVV, Amstel and Belgian ITT champ; all in 2010)
4. Jurgen Vandenbroeck
5. Bjorn Leukemans

Choosing between Leukemans or Devolder isn't easy, and only putting the guy who was fifth in the Tour in fourth place wasn't easy either.

 

[theyoungest]

I don't mean to be condescending (though I may come across as such when I'm irritated), and do I understand if people simply don't know the female cyclists. I've only started following it recently and damnit, it isn't easy with the lack of results. And I don't care if people don't include them in their lists, it's a subjective list after all, but I just think it's stupid if others are told off for including them.

I'm actually a (moderate) follower of women's cycling, and of course I know that Marianne Vos is just amazing on road, track, and mud, and has been from a very young age (she's young now, but her hegemony started when she was reeeeeeally young). But how that compares to Gesink, no idea. She's certainly way more versatile, but Gesink puts out astronomous Watts which he's slowly learning to apply to the road I do have a feeling I can compare, say, Gesink and Boom, which may be just as nonsensical, but at least there's a rating system which I consider to be fair to judge them by (CQ-ranking).

 

[tgsgirl]

Marianne is crazy, let's agree on that

 

[eljimberino]

Gerrans

gerrans better win a stage soon. he hasnt done anything of note this year: not worthy of top 5.

 

[Anonymous]

gerrans better win a stage soon. he hasnt done anything of note this year: not worthy of top 5.

Hes not even in the top 10 guys at sky, let alone australia

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Vos is def. the best dutch cyclist, if not the best dutch athlete (whom is better?). Still young and has some resume. I am probably more (not really... but yeah) excited to watch the women wc this year, because we might actually win there

My top 5 (excluding women... sorry). I just wanna note that I have taken age into consideration, so maybe I've excluded some, but that is because the guys I have picked are very young and already impressing. Thus koos has been excluded also.

1. Gesink
2. Mollema
3. Boom
4/5ish. Kruiswijk (I dunno, i'm just really impressed with this guy and it's only his first season in the pt) / LTD / Langeveld / Tepstra

i think wout poels is a big alent also. I expect him to be one of the better dutch riders.