Danny Pate dig at Tom Danielson's doping?

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R

RHRH19861986

Mar 17, 2012
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When I see cyclists like Danielson, Leipheimer, Hincapie, and others who said they doped with EPO and stopped it at some time, and continued to ride as pro racers, I am quite surprised that many people either

a) believe them they stopped taking EPO or
b) believe they go on with EPO, but

everyone just tries to make himself a picture of the whole thing under ethical aspects: "Are there serious regrets by the rider, has he found back to a honest attitude towards cycling and therefore became clean again?".

Then, there are people with opinion

c) who think haven taken EPO in 2005 just helps you to ride faster in 2013.

I, from personal experience with PEDs/hormones years ago (see my posts in hypothyreodism thread), miss a much more important question, which is hardly ever raised; I´ll mention it as a claim, and I would not write it down if I wasn´t serious and really sure about it:

d) A healthy person who once in his life injects hormones (being healthy!), and stops taking this hormones, isn´t that healthy afterwards as he was before, and will never be again!
He gets from 0 to 5 during the period of misuse, and after finishing this period, slowly gets down to 0 again, then falls to -3, then the body reacts, tries to reach the starting level again, and reaches -1, with which the person now has to go on living.

The more hormones this healthy person injected/misused, and the longer the periods of misuse were, the bigger is the damage to the endocrinologic system concerning the special hormone. There is a thyroid system, a testosterone system, a cortisol system, a GH system, a "blood cell producing" system, to name some important and doping relevant endocrine hormone system within the body. Damaging one of these systems can ONLY be treated by life long continued injecting of the hormone that was misused, if you want to regain the "0" level I mentioned before.

So, finally, every Danielson or whoever has (he admitted it) damaged one (here: red blood cell) system, and has a (more or less seriously) damaged system now, for the rest of his life.

The results to expect from someone like that are weaker or (at the maximum) (almost) equal to the results he showed before the first hormone injection.
 
Dear Wiggo

Dear Wiggo

Sep 29, 2012
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RHRH19861986 said:
I´m also certain that JV1973 wouldn´t (because couldn´t) contradict here.
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And after being the rider to smash other riders, going back to 0 enhancement would be psychologically damaging too, I would guess.

Can you comment on the mental aspect of when you stopped PEDs and resumed to your normal (or even sub normal) self? Was that difficult to take at first?
 
R

RHRH19861986

Mar 17, 2012
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Dear Wiggo said:
Can you comment on the mental aspect of when you stopped PEDs and resumed to your normal (or even sub normal) self? Was that difficult to take at first?
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I first have to say that I doped just to improve optical shape and having the physique for photo shoots and appearances, just like bodybuilders do. I didn´t have a 100.000 EUR per year paycheck motivation.

But, yes, it´s mostly mentally disturbing afterwards, for different reasons:

- You feel sh*t, caused by the pure lack of hormone (weak, tired, powerless)
- You feel sh*t because you loved the shape you had when being on high hormone levels, and had to say goodbye to this shape
- You feel sh*t because you can never know exactly how your endocrine systems will recover, and how the mid- and long term endocrine levels will look like
- You feel sh*t because from now on, you need replacement therapy just to get to your natural base level, you have to be honest about the issue towards your treating doctor, have to admit having misused hormones, and know that hormone replacement will be part of all your future life, you´ll dependent on prescriptions several times a year, blood checks and all this stuff
- You feel sh*t because you´re not willing to consider yourself as suffering now from a chronic hormone desease, but officialy, you are

Nevertheless, no regrets. I would regret it if I had taken heroine or other illegal drugs once in my life.
Taking thyroid hormone, which isn´t illegal in Germany, I don´t regret, though I made the experience above.
It´s hardcore, but no reason to become hypocrite and say "It´s all great, there are no dark sides about it."

BTW: Jan Ullrich also used T3 and T4, which I learned later. Ulle knew what works ;-) And certainly also his his replacement therapy now, every morning, for several hormones. But be sure, he´ll never speak about that...
 
Z

zigmeister

Apr 13, 2011
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pedaling squares said:
Take it up with TD or take it up with the governing bodies, but don't tweet your discontent like the last girl to get cut from the cheerleading squad. #coward
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This makes no sense.

So he is supposed to sit and wait for the lat 7 months for Danielson to show up at Catalunya, then find his way to him and say hey, Danielson, WTF?!?!

Don't think so. Pate is welcome to do what he pleases regarding the topic of Danielson and the others basically getting a pass for being involved in the Armstrong affair. Vaughters is right there ensuring he is getting a pass and no real ramifications for his actions.

The second aspect of this, Pate said himself, isn't about the UCI/USAC enforcement of rule 1.2.019. Although, that brings up yet another point of how Danielson was getting a pass on other fronts.
 
pedaling squares

pedaling squares

Jul 23, 2009
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zigmeister said:
This makes no sense.

So he is supposed to sit and wait for the lat 7 months for Danielson to show up at Catalunya, then find his way to him and say hey, Danielson, WTF?!?!
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zig, you're a bright guy. You know that Pate has access to Danielson without having to wait until they meet and without having to broadcast his message to the rest of the world. Pate's been on the US domestic scene for over a decade, he's been on the Pro Tour scene for about 3 years. You think he can't find out Danielson's contact info? You're writing your post by accessing the web, maybe on a phone. Could Pate not have emailed him, called him, texted him? Or if he didn't want to take it up with directly with Danielson, could he not have used those methods to report it to the governing bodies? Of course he could have, but twitter is easier and you get to take a public dig at a guy.

I stand by my point. Not a bad message, terrible delivery.
 
Dear Wiggo

Dear Wiggo

Sep 29, 2012
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pedaling squares said:
zig, you're a bright guy. You know that Pate has access to Danielson without having to wait until they meet and without having to broadcast his message to the rest of the world. Pate's been on the US domestic scene for over a decade, he's been on the Pro Tour scene for about 3 years. You think he can't find out Danielson's contact info? You're writing your post by accessing the web, maybe on a phone. Could Pate not have emailed him, called him, texted him? Or if he didn't want to take it up with directly with Danielson, could he not have used those methods to report it to the governing bodies? Of course he could have, but twitter is easier and you get to take a public dig at a guy.

I stand by my point. Not a bad message, terrible delivery.
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Chatting to him in private is not going to do a thing. You think JV condones TD racing WHILE suspended? Even in an unsanctioned race? Danielson doesn't care. He is going to do whatever he wants. Makes the training camp story more believable. It's possible they did chat in private too - we don't know.

There's nothing you can say to someone like this privately - you may as well tell a doper to not dope because it's cheating. They would laugh in your face.

Doing this publicly is far more effective. Get the weight of public opinion focused onto an individual. Reveal what he's doing.

Governing bodies? USAC and UCI, right? Those governing bodies? TD rode for Weisel's team.

I completely disagree with you.
 
Dr. Maserati

Dr. Maserati

BANNED
Jun 19, 2009
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Race Radio

Race Radio

Aug 13, 2009
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currentpro said:
Tom is up to cheating again. A little different but then again not that different.
Read this: http://thedirty.com/2014/02/kourtney-compton-couldnt-stay-straight-for-too-long/

It is a gossip site but it's true and a little bird told me she is not the only one. At least one more girl who is a triathlete who lived in Tucson but now Boulder.
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Who knew training camps were so much fun. Trying to relive the USPS/Yellow Rose days?

And I thought this was going to be about Rick Crawford
 
mewmewmew13

mewmewmew13

Aug 9, 2010
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JRanton said:
Does anyone know what Pate is referring to?
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I don't know but I always assumed that D Pate was a gentleman and a good guy..from what I have heard from a few around here he treated his gf like s*** and acted not so magnanimously himself..

so in my mind they can both have at it..I've no time for either TommyD and his extramarital ethics or Pate
 
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