Dispatches: The Truth About Drugs In Football

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Paco_P

Jul 19, 2010
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hrotha said:
The boost of doping is lower than in cycling, but the risk of being caught is much, much smaller. Blood tests aren't really done. They look for steroids and recreational drugs. It's basically a free boost with no risk of being caught, so even if it only gave you a 1% advantage it would be worth it.

Think of Ronaldinho. How useless was he when he got fat?
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I don't buy the first claim. The typical midfielder (think Xavi) runs 8-10 km during a 90 minute game. It matters a lot how "fresh" he is in the 80th minute. For a team like Barca this is an integral part of its attack - control the ball and wear the other side down - since you have the ball they can't score - and when they get tired, you can. The marginal benefits to doping seem clearly quite substantial, particulaly when one considers that a single goal can decide a match.

Ronaldinho is probably not the best example. He was never renowned for spending time in the gym (except to avoid practicing), and he is naturally a tremendous athlete.
 
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Paco_P

Jul 19, 2010
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hrotha said:
As much as I believe Messi and Barça are doping right now, most likely taking HGH too, there's a difference between using HGH for medical reasons and using it as a PED. It's still shady because it was Barça doctors who prescribed the treatment, if I'm not mistaken, which makes you wonder how necessary it was from a medical point of view.
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Seems a false distinction (medical vs. performace). Think in cycling - something that helps recover from one day to the next during a grand tour - is that medical or performance?
 
hrotha

hrotha

Jun 10, 2010
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Paco_P said:
I don't buy the first claim. The typical midfielder (think Xavi) runs 8-10 km during a 90 minute game. It matters a lot how "fresh" he is in the 80th minute. For a team like Barca this is an integral part of its attack - control the ball and wear the other side down - since you have the ball they can't score - and when they get tired, you can. The marginal benefits to doping seem clearly quite substantial, particulaly when one considers that a single goal can decide a match.

Ronaldinho is probably not the best example. He was never renowned for spending time in the gym (except to avoid practicing), and he is naturally a tremendous athlete.
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Ronaldinho is the most extreme example I could think of. Extreme examples help in logical discussions.

As for my first claim, you misunderstand. I'm not saying the boost of doping in football is small. I'm saying it's smaller than in sports where your physical fitness is even more of a factor. You can be a pretty good cyclist with poor bike-handling skills because it's more of a physical sport than football, but that doesn't imply football or other sports aren't physical too.
Paco_P said:
Seems a false distinction (medical vs. performace). Think in cycling - something that helps recover from one day to the next during a grand tour - is that medical or performance?
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It's a perfectly fine distinction to make. Imagine an elite athlete is bleeding to death and he gets a transfusion - that's clearly medical. And that's my point, taken to the extreme. If Messi would have got the same treatment if he wasn't playing football, then it's alright in my eyes (he was a kid, not a pro), but as I said that's a big 'if'.
 
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sniper

Oct 16, 2010
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hrotha said:
Ronaldinho is the most extreme example I could think of. Extreme examples help in logical discussions.

As for my first claim, you misunderstand. I'm not saying the boost of doping in football is small. I'm saying it's smaller than in sports where your physical fitness is even more of a factor. You can be a pretty good cyclist with poor bike-handling skills because it's more of a physical sport than football, but that doesn't imply football or other sports aren't physical too.

It's a perfectly fine distinction to make. Imagine an elite athlete is bleeding to death and he gets a transfusion - that's clearly medical. And that's my point, taken to the extreme. If Messi would have got the same treatment if he wasn't playing football, then it's alright in my eyes (he was a kid, not a pro), but as I said that's a big 'if'.
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It'll be interesting to see whether monday's documentary addresses the case of Messi, or perhaps even the general case of Barca and Puerto.
 
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gillan1969

Aug 12, 2009
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euanli said:
Then you would see more of it. Comparatively how many 40 year olds do you see playing in League 1 or the Championship?
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remember you are talking about a team that had such talented defenders at dave mcpherson and marvelous marvin

scottish cycling is similarly decked out with old timers who are still some of the fastest...doesn't mean they are doping...just that everyone's crap:)
 
The Hitch

The Hitch

Jun 14, 2010
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euanli said:
I think you mean Rio, and it was an 8 month ban
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There was an link posted here about 4 months ago to an article where a "journalist":rolleyes: who knew nothing of doping and said he believed Rio was clean (why would he dope):rolleyes: challenged some of what Rio had said since the dope test.

The comment section was obviously filled with posts, very similar to what referees who make mistakes during England games get to read and then hand over to the police.
 
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Tyler'sTwin

Mar 4, 2010
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The Hitch said:
Especially if your playing 60 matches a year. Or like Barcas 170cm stars doing it running non stop without getting substituted for 80 matches a year, then playing for the national team.

Emmanuel Petit warned 10 years ago that with more games, players would be more inclined to use drugs. He said he already knew some players who used drugs (and of course played in a WC squad captained by a known doper).

He was told to shut his trap.
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Why do you emphasize their height (or lack there of)? The fact they are tiny makes them more believable, not less.
 
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sniper

Oct 16, 2010
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Tyler'sTwin said:
Why do you emphasize their height (or lack there of)? The fact they are tiny makes them more believable, not less.
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if your team is so small, you have to make up for a lack of natural muscle weight compared to teams like, say, chelsea.
now how do you effectively make up for a lack of muscle weight?
I guess in camp Barca they know how.
 
Mrs John Murphy

Mrs John Murphy

May 3, 2010
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Chelsea were well known for 'blood spinning' as a 'treatment' method.

Also, I remember a report on Essien, which claimed that 'he had so much energy that after the game he had to go out for run to burn some of it off'. Sounds a lot like those riders who had so much energy they had to ride their bikes in the middle of the night.
 
blackcat

blackcat

Mar 13, 2009
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Mrs John Murphy said:
Chelsea were well known for 'blood spinning' as a 'treatment' method.

Also, I remember a report on Essien, which claimed that 'he had so much energy that after the game he had to go out for run to burn some of it off'. Sounds a lot like those riders who had so much energy they had to ride their bikes in the middle of the night.
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in the bodybuilding subculture "ride a bicycle" is code for steroids, seems they know Uncle Paddy and the UCI better than the public think.

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=z...&ei=SIRpTqHWIMSsiAf5pJ29BA&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=
...guy did a Kim Kirchen, but did not wake up.
 
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greatking88

Feb 22, 2011
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hrotha said:
As much as I believe Messi and Barça are doping right now, most likely taking HGH too, there's a difference between using HGH for medical reasons and using it as a PED. It's still shady because it was Barça doctors who prescribed the treatment, if I'm not mistaken, which makes you wonder how necessary it was from a medical point of view.
Click to expand...

Just a point on Messi, I´m pretty sure it was the argentinian doctors that prescribed the treatment. His club in Argentina couldnt afford it.
 
Winterfold

Winterfold

Jul 30, 2009
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In the Sunday Times there is mention of cover ups of failed test for steroids by big name players. Id link to it buut paywall etc

The testing regime is as we expected a joke - hardly any tests done, and then it seems you can miss them without too much aggro
 
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sherer

Mar 10, 2009
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Winterfold said:
In the Sunday Times there is mention of cover ups of failed test for steroids by big name players. Id link to it buut paywall etc

The testing regime is as we expected a joke - hardly any tests done, and then it seems you can miss them without too much aggro
Click to expand...

wonder who this missed tests are for ? Rio missed one and got banned for 8 months. have the FA now done a UCi and worked out positive and missed tests can be a nice little earner :D
 
MartinGT

MartinGT

Jul 4, 2010
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Rumblings on twitter and a few forums that a PL star has tested positive for cocaine, here are a few snippets from twitter I assume:

ManUnitedTalk ManUnitedTalk
Apparently a top Footballer will be named as a cocaine addict tonight

He tested positive then He was later sold by his club in a multimillion pound deal but his new team were not told of the drug test

PLEASE be Andy Carroll :D
 
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sherer

Mar 10, 2009
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if it's just a PL star taking cocaine or other drugs then surely the news would be finding one who is clean :D
 
H

hatcher

Jul 24, 2010
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Weakest Dispatches ever.

If I didn't know better I'd be getting the impression that drugs are a pretty minor issue. Their decision to over-dramatise (and over-sell the status of players caught) is doing the issue a big disservice.

Hope second half improves.
 
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