Do Professional Racers Know Their Team Mates are Doping?

[Eva Maria]

actually, he was going to ceccho til it became public. Then there was a stink, and Brailsford wanted him off the Ceccho spell.

Miller has a different take

His revelation that he is in contact - albeit secondhand - with the Italian trainer Luigi Cecchini is one example of the difficulty he faces. Millar told The Observer that the 1996 Atlanta bronze medallist Max Sciandri, now helping out with the GB team's academy in Italy, had 'worked loads with Cecchini, he's got lots of programmes and stuff, still knows him so he [Max] has been giving him calls and helping me out a bit'. It sounds innocuous enough and there is no reason to assume it is not.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/jul/09/tourdefrance2006.tourdefrance3

Of course he could be lying

 

[craig1985]

Actually Bro, have a look at Fumi's tt in Langkawi in... (thinking) '06. There was a chrono in 06 in Langkawi. Fumi is damn high in the classification for a very mediocre rider who would not be on a roster if he was not Japanese.

They obviously charged the Postal bus in Solvang at the pre-season training camp. Wonder who was providing them with the gear.

2005 Tour actually. Beppu would have been 22. I think. Memory folks.

1 Nathan O'Neill (Aus) Navigators Insurance 24.42.76 (49.29 km/h)
2 Ryan Cox (RSA) Barloworld 0.04.82
3 Jose Rujano (Ven) Colombia Selle Italia 0.15.25
4 Tiaan Kannemeyer (RSA) Barloworld 0.20.94
5 Michael Barry (Can) Discovery Channel 0.24.19
6 Marlon Perez Arango (Col) Colombia Selle Italia 0.27.36
7 Bogdan Bondariew (Ukr) Action 0.36.54
8 David Plaza Romero (Spa) Barloworld 0.37.81
9 Tom Danielson (USA) Discovery Channel 0.41.97
10 Fumiyuki Beppu (Jpn) Discovery Channel 0.43.50
11 Russell Van Hout (Aus) Colombia Selle Italia 0.51.96
12 Jurgen Van De Walle (Bel) Landbouwkrediet-Colnago 0.53.93
13 Tom Southam (GBr) Barloworld 0.53.98
14 Sergio Ghisalberti (Ita) Domina Vacanze 0.55.02
15 Benjamin John Day (Aus) Mr Bookmaker.Com-Sports Tech 0.55.07
16 Alireza Haghi (IRI) Iran 0.56.94
17 David McCann (Irl) Ireland 0.59.22
18 Michael Creed (USA) Discovery Channel 1.02.72
19 Antonio Cruz (USA) Discovery Channel 1.09.26
20 Brett Lancaster (Aus) Ceramica Panaria - Navigare 1.10.19
21 Piotr Chmielewski (Pol) Action 1.13.62
22 Jorg Jaksche (Ger) Liberty Seguros 1.14.18


ok, from the bottom, who he beat, Jaksche, no 'xplanation.
Lancaster, very strong prologue rider, can ride a decent chrono.
Day, by memory, 11th in 2004 Worlds tt.
who beat him: Plaza, who beat him, brother of Ruben assume, think David can ride a chrono too.
Cox, decent chrono rider, but always GC in Langkawi, so motivated.
Kannemeyer, a second in a tt at Tour de l'Avenir.
Russ Van Hout has a third place, or even second place, in the Dutch national chrono champs, circa 2003/4. Also a 5th or a 6th in the Giro chrono of about 2005.
Nathan ONeil has won about 4 Aus tt champs. And come top 15 twice in the worlds, and in 2001, think he was 3rd or 4th on two occasions, may be 2000, when Leipheimer was second.

Anyone think Fumi did not get magic injections in Solvang?

Fumi has been clean at Skil I assume. Did come out of VC La Pomme Marseille, dont think they are clean.

Is it me or do I find it slightly odd that Jose Rujano would finish 3rd in a ITT?

 

[blackcat]

Miller has a different take

His revelation that he is in contact - albeit secondhand - with the Italian trainer Luigi Cecchini is one example of the difficulty he faces. Millar told The Observer that the 1996 Atlanta bronze medallist Max Sciandri, now helping out with the GB team's academy in Italy, had 'worked loads with Cecchini, he's got lots of programmes and stuff, still knows him so he [Max] has been giving him calls and helping me out a bit'. It sounds innocuous enough and there is no reason to assume it is not.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2006/jul/09/tourdefrance2006.tourdefrance3

Of course he could be lying

Millar would not have been lying would he? He said he only doped twice. This is reminiscent of Basso's only intended to dope and had second thoughts. I reckon Millar lost credibility long before that denial, so I would not put much stock in it. Sounds like when Dekker tells he is only going to visit Ceccho for "training plans".

There is an admission implicit when one says "only going for" because it acknowledges the missing component.

And if you wanted to ride clean, well, Max Scandri was popped with EPO, Ceccho had a notorious reputation, you would think you would be more vigilant and seek out a different trainer, even if you had to pay for the service. Appearances are important, and Millar flouted that principal of perception. The sport will not clean up if it does not pay heed to such multipliers, it really sends a coded message.

 

[blackcat]

Is it me or do I find it slightly odd that Jose Rujano would finish 3rd in a ITT?

actually Jose Rujano was a trackie and pursuiter, albeit at 5'4" and 106lbs.

It is no secret Gianni Savio's mob always came charged to Langkawi and flew up Genting Highlands on rocket fuel. So, no, not with the elixir of Savio, it was not surprising. Have a look at his competitive years in the Giro, he was pretty fast.... charged, but fast.

 

[Digger]

actually, don't try and correct me on an error of the year, when the actual reporting was correct.

There was an interview, on verus, or some station had covered it, Kimmage asked the question. And Millar answered it. You fricken find it, but dont tell me what happened, because I was correct.

You find the footage Digger, issue a retraction.

You don't even know what station it was on, and you want me to find it, yet you're the one who made the original claim, then you finish it off with 'I was correct'!!! Brilliant...According to your 'logic', I could come on here and say I saw a report saying aliens landed on earth, you would then correctly dispute this claim, but my reply to you would be 'I saw it, I'm not sure what channel', but I saw it, I was correct'. Good luck with that.

You read through this report and telll me where Paul Kimmage's name is mentioned...

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/?id=/features/2007/tour_millar_vino_reaction07

Do you read Paul Kimmage's work every Sunday? Or have you ever read it? Because you're quoting, so the onus is on you not me to prove it correct, a piece from Television, when the irony is that Paul wrote a piece on the incident the following Sunday in the Times anyway.

Hint: David Millar was even at a fundraising, charity press conference that day for planting trees in conjunction with his team SD. That was why the press were with him in the first place, when tHe news broke.

Issue a retraction....LOL

 

[BroDeal]

Actually Bro, have a look at Fumi's tt in Langkawi in... (thinking) '06. There was a chrono in 06 in Langkawi. Fumi is damn high in the classification for a very mediocre rider who would not be on a roster if he was not Japanese.

They obviously charged the Postal bus in Solvang at the pre-season training camp. Wonder who was providing them with the gear.

2005 Tour actually. Beppu would have been 22. I think. Memory folks.

1 Nathan O'Neill (Aus) Navigators Insurance 24.42.76 (49.29 km/h)
2 Ryan Cox (RSA) Barloworld 0.04.82
3 Jose Rujano (Ven) Colombia Selle Italia 0.15.25
4 Tiaan Kannemeyer (RSA) Barloworld 0.20.94
5 Michael Barry (Can) Discovery Channel 0.24.19
6 Marlon Perez Arango (Col) Colombia Selle Italia 0.27.36
7 Bogdan Bondariew (Ukr) Action 0.36.54
8 David Plaza Romero (Spa) Barloworld 0.37.81
9 Tom Danielson (USA) Discovery Channel 0.41.97
10 Fumiyuki Beppu (Jpn) Discovery Channel 0.43.50

I really don't feel a lot can concluded about riders doping from one performance in the early season in a very minor race.

 

[blackcat]

I disagree. "Form" has become but a euphemism for medical program. All the teams like ONCE, and CSC, all brought their form to the boil for TDU, Med, and Paris Nice.

 

[blackcat]

You don't even know what station it was on, and you want me to find it, yet you're the one who made the original claim, then you finish it off with 'I was correct'!!! Brilliant...According to your 'logic', I could come on here and say I saw a report saying aliens landed on earth, you would then correctly dispute this claim, but my reply to you would be 'I saw it, I'm not sure what channel', but I saw it, I was correct'. Good luck with that.

You read through this report and telll me where Paul Kimmage's name is mentioned...

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/?id=/features/2007/tour_millar_vino_reaction07

Do you read Paul Kimmage's work every Sunday? Or have you ever read it? Because you're quoting, so the onus is on you not me to prove it correct, a piece from Television, when the irony is that Paul wrote a piece on the incident the following Sunday in the Times anyway.

Hint: David Millar was even at a fundraising, charity press conference that day for planting trees in conjunction with his team SD. That was why the press were with him in the first place, when tHe news broke.

Issue a retraction....LOL

I saw it on either the Versus internet vid captions, or my home broadcast. It was one or the other. It was obviously the Vino expose. You just denied my memory accusing me being faulty.

It would have been one of two options. The tv broadcast, or the internet vids on versus. And you are holding that to account. Strawman!