Teams & Riders Everybody needs a little bit of Roglstomp in their lives

[Berniece]

I don't think riding a 3 week stage race is an optimal preparation for WC, specific training is much better. Remco won despite that, not because of it
He's a big outlier. My thoughts

He also won OG thanks to it. He responds well to it, super compensation. Could be that this doesn't work like that for others. Pogacar for example I've never seen ride well after a hard GT

 

[YavorD]

He also won OG thanks to it. He responds well to it, super compensation. Could be that this doesn't work like that for others. Pogacar for example I've never seen ride well after a hard GT

His Olympics in 2021 were good, okay bad by his 2024 and 2025 standards, but still a bronze.
His Worlds in 2023 was very good as well, considering the route.

 

[vappaxbipmv]

Is Valverde also an outlier?

Also, when the Olympics were in Tokyo, 5 days after the Tour, with a big (and not beneficial) time difference, all of top 10 were riding the Tour. Same goes to the Glasgow Worlds IIRC.
Cadel Evans also won his Worlds after going to the Vuelta.

Based on that, I don't think a 3 week race is a bad preparation for the Worlds.

Maybe you didn't read well but I at no point said that GT is a bad preparation. I said it's less than optimal. How could a GT be a better preparation than a route specific preparation that lasts for a few weeks?

 

[Berniece]

His Olympics in 2021 were good, okay bad by his 2024 and 2025 standards, but still a bronze.
His Worlds in 2023 was very good as well, considering the route.

And how well has he been doing Classica San Sebastian?

 

[YavorD]

Maybe you didn't read well but I at no point said that GT is a bad preparation. I said it's less than optimal. How could a GT be a better preparation than a route specific preparation that lasts for a few weeks?

Yes, apologies about that.
My main point was that Evenepoel isn't the big outlier you claimed he is and we have plenty of examples that do well in a one day race after a GT, so "specific training" is overrated.

Whether Del Toro is capable of doing it, we don't know of course.

 

[YavorD]

And how well has he been doing Classica San Sebastian?

Well, if Classica San Remco is your idea of "never", then I agree with you.
However, I think the worlds and Olympics are somewhat big races and he has performed well in both straight after a GT, but hey, if you don't count them, never it is.

 

[James M]

It depends more on the dates and timing of the WC in relation to the GT than anything else. If the dates align too late or too early, it’s detrimental, but that fine balance in between, you can get good results by doing GT in some cases.

Mostly, it depends on the number of days in between rather than anything rider-specific.

 

[Berniece]

Well, if Classica San Remco is your idea of "never", then I agree with you.
However, I think the worlds and Olympics are somewhat big races and he has performed well in both straight after a GT, but hey, if you don't count them, never it is.

That's true, it probably depends on how hard the GT was for him.

 

[Cycling111]

It's a calendar for a veteran, just one GT that will be the Vuelta.

It seems like a smart decision because is expected a verul easy Vuelta due to rivals. Barring accidents, he won't have any of the Tour de France contenders due to World Championships, or due to the Giro in Vingeggaard's case.

There's speculation that Almeida and Del Toro will go to the Giro, so, in principle, not even the best secondary rivals will be in the Vuelta. The others secondary GT riders are on his team.

 

[YavorD]

That's true, it probably depends on how hard the GT was for him.

I have no reason to believe that 2023 wasn't very hard for him and he still performed good. I can possibly agree on Tokyo though.
Probably depends on how big of a goal the race is for him.

 

[hayneplane]

We need to cyber bully Red Bull into a lesser-seen Roglic cobbled classics campaign like Valverde did towards the end.

In his 2019-2022 peak it would have been a lot of fun seeing if he could Roglstomp the Koppenberg.

 

[Cycling111]

If Roglic has had several accidents in France, I don't even want to imagine on the roads of Flanders.

 

[vappaxbipmv]

Yes, apologies about that.
My main point was that Evenepoel isn't the big outlier you claimed he is and we have plenty of examples that do well in a one day race after a GT, so "specific training" is overrated.

Whether Del Toro is capable of doing it, we don't know of course.

But the examples that you mentioned were competing against other riders that were doing the same GT, not against the riders that were suited for that specific course and skipped the closest previous GT

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Bummed about his schedule. They should have sent him to two GTs. He's not a classics rider at this point in his career. He is a GC rider. Give him a shot at the Giro + Vuelta if nothing else. Protected in Giro and leader in Vuelta if it's gotta be like that. Or Tour + Vuelta with Tour just as protected, not leader. 100% conjecture, but I wouldn't be surprised if Remco established an understanding when he transferred that Roglic wouldn't race any of the races he wanted to target, and that he got first choice. Somewhat understandable, but frustrating to see one of the greats of the modern era get pushed to the side like this for the second time.

Let's see if Remco, Lipowitz, Pellizari, or Hindley can deliver on a GT win for RBH or if Roglic will still be the only one who delivered for them.

 

[AmRacer]

Bummed about his schedule. They should have sent him to two GTs. He's not a classics rider at this point in his career. He is a GC rider. Give him a shot at the Giro + Vuelta if nothing else. Protected in Giro and leader in Vuelta if it's gotta be like that. Or Tour + Vuelta with Tour just as protected, not leader. 100% conjecture, but I wouldn't be surprised if Remco established an understanding when he transferred that Roglic wouldn't race any of the races he wanted to target, and that he got first choice. Somewhat understandable, but frustrating to see one of the greats of the modern era get pushed to the side like this for the second time.

Let's see if Remco, Lipowitz, Pellizari, or Hindley can deliver on a GT win for RBH or if Roglic will still be the only one who delivered for them.

Jonas wins the Giro and the Tour, or Pogi wins the Tour. Only Vuelta left for the rest.

 

[acm]

Bummed about his schedule. They should have sent him to two GTs. He's not a classics rider at this point in his career. He is a GC rider. Give him a shot at the Giro + Vuelta if nothing else. Protected in Giro and leader in Vuelta if it's gotta be like that. Or Tour + Vuelta with Tour just as protected, not leader. 100% conjecture, but I wouldn't be surprised if Remco established an understanding when he transferred that Roglic wouldn't race any of the races he wanted to target, and that he got first choice. Somewhat understandable, but frustrating to see one of the greats of the modern era get pushed to the side like this for the second time.

Let's see if Remco, Lipowitz, Pellizari, or Hindley can deliver on a GT win for RBH or if Roglic will still be the only one who delivered for them.

It is most likely that Roglič will deliver a GT win again. I can't see Jai/Pellizzari winning Giro or Remco/Lipowitz winning TdF.
All in all I'm pretty happy with his schedule, it's not that bad. He really wants another Vuelta win, so going to TdF is not an optimal preparation.
Btw he wants to do TdS, but his program has not been yet finalized. Only Tirreno and Itzulia are 100% confirmed, then they'll see what's next.

 

[Cycling111]

Bummed about his schedule. They should have sent him to two GTs. He's not a classics rider at this point in his career. He is a GC rider. Give him a shot at the Giro + Vuelta if nothing else. Protected in Giro and leader in Vuelta if it's gotta be like that. Or Tour + Vuelta with Tour just as protected, not leader. 100% conjecture, but I wouldn't be surprised if Remco established an understanding when he transferred that Roglic wouldn't race any of the races he wanted to target, and that he got first choice. Somewhat understandable, but frustrating to see one of the greats of the modern era get pushed to the side like this for the second time.

Let's see if Remco, Lipowitz, Pellizari, or Hindley can deliver on a GT win for RBH or if Roglic will still be the only one who delivered for them.

Hindley won the Giro.

 

[YavorD]

But the examples that you mentioned were competing against other riders that were doing the same GT, not against the riders that were suited for that specific course and skipped the closest previous GT

Well, maybe if everyone in top 10 has done the GT beforehand, it means that you don't need specific preparation?
I honestly don't know what you base your argument on.

Even in Classica San Sebastian there was a statistic (okay, before Remco 's time) that usually the riders that came out of the Tour are generally winning the race.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Roglic has spent much of the winter watching Francisco Mancebo clips from Japanese 2.1 races

Roglic rejects retirement talk - 'I want to race for 10 more years'

Four-time Vuelta a España champion and decorated winner Primoz Roglic has dismissed speculation about stepping down to a smaller team, insisting he still…

www.domestiquecycling.com

 

[Red Rick]

Absolutely *** schedule

 

[vappaxbipmv]

Well, maybe if everyone in top 10 has done the GT beforehand, it means that you don't need specific preparation?
I honestly don't know what you base your argument on.

Even in Classica San Sebastian there was a statistic (okay, before Remco 's time) that usually the riders that came out of the Tour are generally winning the race.

No, it means that everyone was on equal footing. We're talking about GT vs race specific preparation

 

[Berniece]

Let's see if Remco, Lipowitz, Pellizari, or Hindley can deliver on a GT win for RBH or if Roglic will still be the only one who delivered for them.

Different opponents. Roglic v. Almeida or Pellizarri v. Vingegaard or Lipowitz/Evenepoel v. Pogacar/Vingegaard…

I do agree that he could’ve joined Giro or TDF team though

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Hindley won the Giro.

Shoot. I couldn't remember if that was before or after he joined the team. AI told me only Roglic had won for the team. So the trend is that elite outside hires win a GT with their new team in their first season, so Remco will win the Tour?

Different opponents. Roglic v. Almeida or Pellizarri v. Vingegaard or Lipowitz/Evenepoel v. Pogacar/Vingegaard…

I do agree that he could’ve joined Giro or TDF team though

Yeah of course it's wildly different competition.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Let's be honest it's an awful schedule and Roglic is probably annoyed. Bora proving that they hate cycling fans

Send this boy to Sanremo, Roubaix, Amstel, Fleche, Le Suisse. Have some fun lads he's won all those races like tirreno romandie etc.

Give him a second GT aswell. He doesn't need to be the leader.

 

[Rackham]

I find it difficult to truly appraise his schedule since I don't know what his condition will be. As Rog said himself a couple of months ago (I'll paraphrase) "to be a leader you need the legs to win otherwise there's no point".

The fact is everything after Catalunya last March was downhill form wise (except his ITT on stage 2 of the Giro which was good and normal by his standards). Without rediscovering his usual form, it's all a moot point.

But impossible is nothing regarding this rider, i.e. just when people think he's done for he has a habit of showing some form out of nowhere so "wait and see". The Vuelta is a nice objective but I'm curious to know his thoughts on the Tour absence.