Floyd to be charged with fraud

[mewmewmew13]

There is no report that said that Birotte never looked at the evidence--none that I could find. I think the report exists only in your mind.

Along those lines there is no report on anything that Birotte did except can the investigation suddenly.

 

[palmerq]

I think this thread is about floyd and not that other guys case lets keep this one about floyd getting investigated or charged or whatever..

 

[ChrisE]

To prosecute a case against Floyd Landis will have a huge chilling effect on those within sport who want to come clean about sport. It will chill, as well, all those who think about taking on powerful people in general, and Lance Armstrong in particular. A prosecution of Landis would take place within the shadow of the immense fraud said to have been perpetrated by Team USPS, its owners, its star rider, but not prosecuted: it will take place within the shadow of a federal investigation of Armstrong, et al., that was suddenly, arbitrarily shut down with no accounting, leaving the appearance at least of endemic corruption inside our own Justice Department.

I don't think they have a strong case against Landis, or a strong reason for pursuing one.

FL provided info about doping within USPS from 2000-04. Why he should get a get-out-of-jail free card about what he did in 2006/07, soliciting funds for defense of an AAF on Phonak, is beyond me in a theoretical sense. IF he didn't get protection in exchange for his confessions, then it sux for him. IF he felt compelled to spill the beans on things after 2004 with no protection, then that also sux for him.

He could have told all about USPS and then clammed up, but now he is either in a bind that his mealy mouth non-admission of testosterone use in that tour cannot save him from, or there were misapproprations of funds. This has nothing to do with his evidence about USPS, so why (again, in a black and white sense) should the two be linked in terms of what he is held accountable for, if he didn't take the necessary precautions to protect himself?

Is the mindset here if we help an investigation then we should not be held accountable in the future for unrelated crimes we commit? I don't agree, as I say in a black and white sense. Let me explain.

I understand your point in the bigger sense and I don't really disagree with it from a political POV in this instance, but that doesn't wipe the history. No matter if the USPS investigation took place 20 years ago or never took place, that is not an if/then trigger on whether or not FL committed unrelated fraud.

I think he should be left alone, and regardless of what I think of him in terms of what he has done I do believe he has suffered enough. I cannot imagine his life, to be honest. The govt. does look petty here, and if you read any of the political threads in here you know that the politicians in the US are not high on my respect list.

Digger - please don't extrapolate my words, as you did upthread. I said I agreed with you that in my opinion he should not be prosecuted for fraud if he used the funds for his defense. My opinion is not based upon law, and if maxitron etal are correct then our opinions are not. I made this clear to you earlier.

 

[Digger]

Come on! Even Floyd has said that he was wrong in taking the money and that he intends to pay it back. You must be a super-fan if you want to argue that Floyd hasn't done anything wrong. You're making a case that Floyd himself hasn't even made.

What is your source on Birotte? Is it Race Radio? Is it the leaky federal investigation (that wasn't leaky when everybody thought Lance was going to be indicted)? You are just making stuff up about Birotte.

Lance should renounce all of his Tour wins and should give all of his money back. Are you begging me to say something nice about Lance so that you or others can attack my post? That tired juvenile tactic gets old. Agenda . . . Intern . . . whatever.

When Floyd starts paying back his victims . . . like he said he would . . ..

The Lance Armstrong investigation brought me to this forum and now it is over.

My time here has enabled me to learn a lot about a very small subculture of people who gather to spend a lot of their time and energy discussing all the negative aspects of Lance Armstrong. I've spent a lot of time (way too much) with you all. Thank you all very much for sharing with me.

I'm going to try to put Lance Armstrong way in the back of some mental closet, forever I hope. Any publicity is good for him, and I don't think I want to contribute any more.

For those of you that remain, I sincerely hope that something useful comes out of your time spent participating here.

Goodbye!
Mark

What is it about Floyd Landis that has made you not just come back, but actually up your posting dramatically?

 

[MarkvW]

What is it about Floyd Landis that has made you not just come back, but actually up your posting dramatically?

Can't resist the personal dig, eh?

What makes you such a Floyd fanboy?

 

[Digger]

Can't resist the personal dig, eh?

Absolutely not. I am not insulting you. I am curious as to what's your obsession and hatred of the guy. i find it ironic that you continuously refer to many of us as haters, when your tone of language about Landis is nothing better.

 

[MarkvW]

Absolutely not. I am not insulting you. I am curious as to what's your obsession and hatred of the guy. i find it ironic that you continuously refer to many of us as haters, when your tone of language about Landis is nothing better.

"Obsession and hatred?" You are making stuff up again.

 

[thehog]

Can't resist the personal dig, eh?

What makes you such a Floyd fanboy?

I think you've been shown up there my frozen gloved buddy. A quiet retreat for a little might be in order!

 

[MarkvW]

I think you've been shown up there my frozen gloved buddy. A quiet retreat for a little might be in order!

I'll retreat when Floyd starts paying back his victims!

Sadly, I don't think Floyd ever will. Unless somebody makes him.

 

[thehog]

I'll retreat when Floyd starts paying back his victims!

Sadly, I don't think Floyd ever will. Unless somebody makes him.

Cool!




.....

 

[BroDeal]

I'll retreat when Floyd starts paying back his victims!

Sadly, I don't think Floyd ever will. Unless somebody makes him.

Why don't you wait until Armstrong starts paying back his victims. That way you will have more time to study for the Google Lawyer's Bar exam.

 

[Digger]

"Obsession and hatred?" You are making stuff up again.

The Lance Armstrong investigation brought me to this forum and now it is over.

My time here has enabled me to learn a lot about a very small subculture of people who gather to spend a lot of their time and energy discussing all the negative aspects of Lance Armstrong. I've spent a lot of time (way too much) with you all. Thank you all very much for sharing with me.

I'm going to try to put Lance Armstrong way in the back of some mental closet, forever I hope. Any publicity is good for him, and I don't think I want to contribute any more.

For those of you that remain, I sincerely hope that something useful comes out of your time spent participating here.

Goodbye!
Mark

I would say three quarters of your posts since you said you were leaving two months ago, have been in relation to Floyd landis.

You can't stop attacking the guy, yet don't seem bothered about the others.

So again, what is it about Floyd Landis which made you stay and post at this rate? Unrequitted love maybe?

 

[Digger]

Why don't you wait until Armstrong starts paying back his victims. That way you will have more time to study for the Google Lawyer's Bar exam.

For some reason he doesn't have an issue with Lance paying people back...strange that.

 

[Benotti69]

I would say three quarters of your posts since you said you were leaving two months ago, have been in relation to Floyd landis.

You can't stop attacking the guy, yet don't seem bothered about the others.

So again, what is it about Floyd Landis which made you stay and post at this rate? Unrequitted love maybe?

Not just M VW, who is still here even though Armstrong is off to IronMan and no longer has the Feds on his case, but a whole bunch of his minions still feel the need to enter to every Yella thread with their trolling, while ignoring the rest of the forum.

Why? Is Old Yella still worried about how the Clinic cut right to his bones and he wont give up the fight in here no matter what as it is very personal as is all the fights he gets into and there are a lot?

Maybe now it is Floyd and until Floyd has reduced to truly nothing he will always have a 'presence' in here trying to chip away with his little vendetta's all assisted by his Yella munchkins.

Who knows.

 

[thehog]

Not just M VW, who is still here even though Armstrong is off to IronMan and no longer has the Feds on his case, but a whole bunch of his minions still feel the need to enter to every Yella thread with their trolling, while ignoring the rest of the forum.

Why? Is Old Yella still worried about how the Clinic cut right to his bones and he wont give up the fight in here no matter what as it is very personal as is all the fights he gets into and there are a lot?

Maybe now it is Floyd and until Floyd has reduced to truly nothing he will always have a 'presence' in here trying to chip away with his little vendetta's all assisted by his Yella munchkins.

Who knows.

Certainly brings new meaning to the statement “we have nothing to hide”.

Seems to be an awful lot of effort to stop people from talking.

These guys should just sue Landis and Hamilton for slander and be done with it.

 

[MarkvW]

For some reason he doesn't have an issue with Lance paying people back...strange that.

Actually, you are making stuff up again! I said the exact opposite. I explicitly said Lance should give all the money back. Anything to make an argument, eh?

And what about the French conviction? Is that just because the French are prejudiced against poor American Floyd?

I'm still having trouble coming up with a reason why the Feds go after Floyd after all this time. The Floyd fanboys are suggesting that Floyd is being hounded by prosecutors corrupted by Lance Armstrong. I'd suggest that is a little farfetched. A better theory (but by no means the only one) is that the fed caught Floyd in a post-May, 2010 lie and that they decided to investigate him after that.

 

[thehog]

I think my mileage is about the same as yours. And it was all going so well ... (except, of course, when Cal Joe started prattling on about tweets being slighted)

Everyone, MarkVW is saying that he does not think the story about Floyd on the CN website is credible. End of.

RR, you decided to name this thread "Floyd to be charged with fraud" yet when we click on the link the title on CN is "Could Floyd Landis face fraud charges??". Leaving it open as to whether Floyd is actually being investigated or whether the story is based solely on rumor. You seem to feel this story is true. Why do you feel that way? Can you share with us any more info (insider or not) or perhaps some links?

I think everyone here agrees that the details surrounding this story are "odd", leading to speculation as to why that might be the case. However, is the "oddness" indicative of dark forces lying beneath or is it that CN simply got it wrong?

Carry on.

I think in this case Floyds words ring true. Once he receive the opportunity to detail out how the fund came about and how it was set up then actual charges will not follow. Unfortunately it’s not as simple as “give me your money sign here”. There are several extremities and complexities to the situation. He’ll be fine. I’m confident of that.

 

[MarkvW]

Why don't you wait until Armstrong starts paying back his victims. That way you will have more time to study for the Google Lawyer's Bar exam.

Brodeal, if we judged everybody by Lance Armstrong's standards, then lying and cheating would be acceptable. Is that what you really want?

We shouldn't forget that Lance would never have gotten away with his very bad behavior without the support and lies provided by lieutenants like Floyd Landis.

Do you really think it is RIGHT for Floyd to walk away without making restitution to his victims? Do you REALLY think Floyd would do right by his victims if nobody made him?

 

[Digger]

Actually, you are making stuff up again! I said the exact opposite. I explicitly said Lance should give all the money back. Anything to make an argument, eh?

And what about the French conviction? Is that just because the French are prejudiced against poor American Floyd?

I'm still having trouble coming up with a reason why the Feds go after Floyd after all this time. The Floyd fanboys are suggesting that Floyd is being hounded by prosecutors corrupted by Lance Armstrong. I'd suggest that is a little farfetched. A better theory (but by no means the only one) is that the fed caught Floyd in a post-May, 2010 lie and that they decided to investigate him after that.

Yeah that's plausible alright...couldn't have anything to do with Fabiani...

 

[thehog]

Digger:
"Still think if Floyd pleads the fifth it will throw the cat amongst the pigeons for Lance and others. He actually holds an awful lot more power than people give him credit for...and is also an awful lot more intelligent and sane than people give him credit for."

This is why I am interested to see what might develop from this episode.

Could this actually occur?

 

[Digger]

Brodeal, if we judged everybody by Lance Armstrong's standards, then lying and cheating would be acceptable. Is that what you really want?

We shouldn't forget that Lance would never have gotten away with his very bad behavior without the support and lies provided by lieutenants like Floyd Landis.

Do you really think it is RIGHT for Floyd to walk away without making restitution to his victims? Do you REALLY think Floyd would do right by his victims if nobody made him?

Look clearly you've assumed yet again that he won't. Like the way you assume most things about Floyd Landis. You don't like the guy, we get it. You think he's 'a jerk'. We get that also. We also get that for some reason you thought Tyler was genuine and Floyd wasn't, based on what I don't know, but anyways...
You will continue to assume the worst as regards Floyd. If he paid everyone back tomorrow you still would not be happy. You would pick up on something else, because you don't like him. And that's fine. I understand that. But what grates me is that you seem to build your 'argument's around this dislike. You have an end result of disliking him, and you have to work backwards.

 

[MarkvW]

Look clearly you've assumed yet again that he won't. Like the way you assume most things about Floyd Landis. You don't like the guy, we get it. You think he's 'a jerk'. We get that also. We also get that for some reason you thought Tyler was genuine and Floyd wasn't, based on what I don't know, but anyways...
You will continue to assume the worst as regards Floyd. If he paid everyone back tomorrow you still would not be happy. You would pick up on something else, because you don't like him. And that's fine. I understand that. But what grates me is that you seem to build your 'argument's around this dislike. You have an end result of disliking him, and you have to work backwards.

You are making stuff up even yet again! I have already said that I would be satisfied if Floyd got a real job and started making effort to pay back his victims.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

You are making stuff up even yet again! I have already said that I would be satisfied if Floyd got a real job and started making effort to pay back his victims.

Hi Mark,
I see you have said that the Lance should pay people back, that only took you 10 pages or so.
What job could a former pro like Floyd get? Usually they get jobs within the industry - however I think you would even agree that Armstrong would not allow that.

So for now Floyd is not in a position to pay back people - which is very different than your Mr Armstrong, where is your outrage that a man who has millions has made no effort to pay back us victims.

 

[Digger]

Hi Mark,
I see you have said that the Lance should pay people back, that only took you 10 pages or so.
What job could a former pro like Floyd get? Usually they get jobs within the industry - however I think you would even agree that Armstrong would not allow that.

So for now Floyd is not in a position to pay back people - which is very different than your Mr Armstrong, where is your outrage that a man who has millions has made no effort to pay back us victims.

Yeah he has suggested Floyd get a job in MacDonalds. He really is the brains of the operation.

 

[Digger]

You are making stuff up even yet again! I have already said that I would be satisfied if Floyd got a real job and started making effort to pay back his victims.

No you wouldn't. You have stated you don't believe him to be genuine. Floyd;s actions would never placate you. You will never concede this of course....