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frank interview by david millar

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Mar 19, 2010
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That was brutally honest. And it rang true. I would imagine most young cyclists are aware of drug, but may think it's only top pros or a few bad eggs.

However they'd always think they're better, that they can do it without drugs.

Then the haunting of the doping boogie man begins: They begin to wonder "what if", or "I'm fed up of being cheated", "they're all doing it and seem okay"

The torment of the boogie man is only briefly relieved with good performances and wins. When form is gone he comes back: "Why are they going faster than me when I could ride circles round them before", "I really need a win, your only as good as your last result"

Boogie man would also strike in the young cyclists spare time: "I need to get a better contract next year to be able to afford the mortgage payments", "I have a kid but have no financial guarantees beyond the end of season"

That is what I imagine is the torment of the clean rider.
 
May 26, 2010
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Fester said:
That was brutally honest. And it rang true. I would imagine most young cyclists are aware of drug, but may think it's only top pros or a few bad eggs.

However they'd always think they're better, that they can do it without drugs.

Then the haunting of the doping boogie man begins: They begin to wonder "what if", or "I'm fed up of being cheated", "they're all doing it and seem okay"

The torment of the boogie man is only briefly relieved with good performances and wins. When form is gone he comes back: "Why are they going faster than me when I could ride circles round them before", "I really need a win, your only as good as your last result"

Boogie man would also strike in the young cyclists spare time: "I need to get a better contract next year to be able to afford the mortgage payments", "I have a kid but have no financial guarantees beyond the end of season"

That is what I imagine is the torment of the clean rider.

and the torment of the doping rider is

"what if get caught? i wont be able to pay the mortgage and my baby and wife, what will i do"

and if not it should be.....

Millar is a smart guy, he was going to university when cofodis gave him a contract. he isn't from some small farm/town/village like a lot of cyclists were who if never successful were going back to the small farm/town/village. If Millar wasn't happy about the doping in the sport he should have packed his bags and headed off to university.
 
Mar 19, 2010
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Benotti69 said:
and the torment of the doping rider is

"what if get caught? i wont be able to pay the mortgage and my baby and wife, what will i do"

and if not it should be.....

Millar is a smart guy, he was going to university when cofodis gave him a contract. he isn't from some small farm/town/village like a lot of cyclists were who if never successful were going back to the small farm/town/village. If Millar wasn't happy about the doping in the sport he should have packed his bags and headed off to university.

That's true. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. The curse of the doper. Although Millar in the above interview says it's only a curse when you are caught. he said "it's easy to dope yourself"... Makes you wonder. Just as we've seen people cheat so brazenly and be successfully and apparently worry free, while the story of the non-doper somewhere down the field is never heard, or at least never taken seriously, they always be "just" an also ran, no one cares about their personal moral whims.

It's not going to University or nor. I take your point it's rather selfish, but sport, acting, art, science, these vocational careers are things people pursue with pure passion, they sacrifice themselves for them. The lucky ones are the one's cold enough to build up a life with it as well...
 
May 26, 2010
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Fester said:
That's true. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. The curse of the doper. Although Millar in the above interview says it's only a curse when you are caught. he said "it's easy to dope yourself"... Makes you wonder. Just as we've seen people cheat so brazenly and be successfully and apparently worry free, while the story of the non-doper somewhere down the field is never heard, or at least never taken seriously, they always be "just" an also ran, no one cares about their personal moral whims.

It's not going to University or nor. I take your point it's rather selfish, but sport, acting, art, science, these vocational careers are things people pursue with pure passion, they sacrifice themselves for them. The lucky ones are the one's cold enough to build up a life with it as well...

I suppose the passion can always account somewhat towards why they dope! but i believe they all know it's wrong and accept it's wrong, but as with human nature feel cheated that they have been singled out when caught and the rest ride on as per usual and it does take a very strong will to stand up and say it is wrong and this is against what i was brought up to believe and reject it. To date there have not been many, well publicly anyway.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Well, It's Millar's version of the truth. If he keeps saying it loud enough and long enough, it "feels" more believable. To the cheat, anyway.


It p!sses me off when people do not accept responsibility for their actions. It doesn't matter if he's got a "likeable" personality. He doped. If Millar (or any other cheat) cannot admit the truth to themselves, there is no hope for the sport.

Why isn't there a fabulously famous current pro coming forward and naming names and telling the public about his/her ongoing refusals to dope? Probably because there isn't one :(
 
May 26, 2010
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tifosa said:
Well, It's Millar's version of the truth. If he keeps saying it loud enough and long enough, it "feels" more believable. To the cheat, anyway.


It p!sses me off when people do not accept responsibility for their actions. It doesn't matter if he's got a "likeable" personality. He doped. If Millar (or any other cheat) cannot admit the truth to themselves, there is no hope for the sport.

Why isn't there a fabulously famous current pro coming forward and naming names and telling the public about his/her ongoing refusals to dope? Probably because there isn't one :(

if there was one who came forward, although Wiggins was vocal without naming, they would be kicked, punched, spat at treated like sh!t by the rest of the peloton á la Simeoni

it aint gonna happen as the powers that be in cycling like the omerta. Kohl's name is still on ASO's TdF website as 3rd place and winner of the KOM for chissakes
 
Jul 27, 2010
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Benotti69 said:
if there was one who came forward, although Wiggins was vocal without naming, they would be kicked, punched, spat at treated like sh!t by the rest of the peloton á la Simeoni

it aint gonna happen as the powers that be in cycling like the omerta. Kohl's name is still on ASO's TdF website as 3rd place and winner of the KOM for chissakes

except simeoni did dope too....

And if you want an example of how popular vocally clean cyclists are...then have a see what the rest of the italians say about cunego....

This thread has seemed pretty balanced actually....there is another interview David Millar did on the Garmin Site....worth watching in context with this one.

I like David Millar....I really do....but he would be the first to admit that when he was in his early twenties he was an arrogant, super ambitious, selfish and jumped up d*ck....think Cav....but taller and better looking.

I know most interviews he does, he has to talk about what he did, and that must be hard. And I know there was peer pressure, that was the overiding culture then, but to never even countenance saying that you did something because you chose to, because you were trying to be quicker and faster, and win more, smacks as a bit of self denial.

David was team leader at Cofidis when he says he started doping, not a stagiare. He was earning very good money. As an amateur in France he had seen what people were up to. It wasn't in the closet. They weren't even tested.

When he was busted I felt very sorry for him. And i think he took a well needed look at himself. And i do believe he has been clean since and has tried to promote clean racing. And that is admirable.

But he didn't name names, he didn't tear anything down so it could be built back up. And he didn't because some of the other guys who had done it were his friends and would find themselves penniless and out of a job like David had. And actually, I understand that. It's called being human.

Did the culture corrupt David? Yes. Did his own understandable ambition? Yes. Is he trying to help change the culture now? Yes. Does he think that can be achieved by a purge, or by dragging the "cheats" and former "cheats" to the smoky flames? I don't think so. And I think he is right.
 
Jul 30, 2009
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I agree he could publicly accept more responsibility for his own actions. But it does seem doping was systematic/institutional so I can also see why he might still be in denial about it.

I wonder what the turning point was for him - I wonder if it was when he realised that even though he was a thoroughbred, he was still going to get beaten by donkeys who doped.

I'm not sure that fact that he is clever makes much of a difference. In your late teens/early twenties you think you know it all becasue you are a walking erection, but really you are so naive/there to be taken advantage of.
 
Jul 27, 2010
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Winterfold said:
I agree he could publicly accept more responsibility for his own actions. But it does seem doping was systematic/institutional so I can also see why he might still be in denial about it.

I wonder what the turning point was for him - I wonder if it was when he realised that even though he was a thoroughbred, he was still going to get beaten by donkeys who doped.

I'm not sure that fact that he is clever makes much of a difference. In your late teens/early twenties you think you know it all becasue you are a walking erection, but really you are so naive/there to be taken advantage of.

I wonder what the turning point was for him - I wonder if it was when he realised that even though he was a thoroughbred, he was still going to get beaten by donkeys who doped.


In the Garmin interview he talks about very specifically about his turning point....and at what point in his career and after what success he had already had.

I actually hadn't read through all of this thread when I posted....I had skimmed....and hadn't seen Joe P's comments....worth taking a look at too
 

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Aug 17, 2009
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RhodriM said:
His reaction to Landis' allegations left a bad taste too... I seem to remember Millar being very chummy with a certain other American rider.

"He's reached the end of the road and I just find it disgusting," said Millar from his home training base in Girona, Spain. "He's a liar and a cheat and he has nothing left in cycling so he just wants to burn the house down.

"If he had stood up and manned up four years ago, he'd be racing the Tour de France now," Millar said. "He'd have a different book out. He'd have not lost a penny. He'd be admired by young people. He would have a different life ahead of him. He'd be in a decent mental state. He'd be sober.

"And he'd be married."


The last bit seems particularly harsh to me. I know little of Landis' marriage, but given that his ex father-in-law was one of his strongest supporters, who later killed himself, it's a subject I wouldn't use as an insult if I were a pro rider.
David is spot on. Nothing harsh about his comments, clear and to the point.
Flandis had his chance. LeMond was honest with him. At that point Floyd could have turned his life around and begun to put his life back together. Floyd is an intelligent man but his own beligerence has lost him everything. It seems Floyd continues to dig himself further into a hole. I hope for his own sake he finds some 12 step program, Floyd.
 
May 17, 2010
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awesome interview, i do agree he was trying to waylay the blame. I do have sympathy for him, he was young and far from home. Think the whole going off to college thing and feeling that supposed "freedom." Alot of people fall off, be it weak character or false sense of family and trusting without thinking it through. I imagine he was a hot shot amateur used to destroying people even when he was hung over. Getting dropped by guys who had no business being a pro anyway would be maddening. That frustration would be overwhelming, ya he was smart enough for college that might have even been an excuse for him; "these guys get away with it i can too."
 
Nov 2, 2009
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gillan1969 said:
yup...good interview

i think that whilst it was rather deflecting in the blame game...he does have a point

probably 100% of the the peleton if asked when 16 if they would dope would say no...and i would probably believe them

and yet

a figure close to that probably ends up doping, or at least did end up doping during the epo years.

Something happens to them...its what they do

call it culture/pressure/self interetsed monetary gain...something systemic happens and that needs to be addressed

i.e. if you were a pro...you would probably dope....despite your denials at the moment

Good post. Systemic influences are insidious. Millar does a good job of depicting the kinds of pressures faced by young cyclists.

I have sympathy. I'm not at all sure I wouldn't have done the same thing at his age in those circumstances, despite my tendency to idealism. And if I had worked hard to make my dream of becoming a professional cyclist come true, and was starting to have some success, I'm pretty sure I'd be extremely reluctant to chuck it in and go back to Mum or university.
 
May 14, 2010
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Spare Tyre said:
Good post. Systemic influences are insidious. Millar does a good job of depicting the kinds of pressures faced by young cyclists.

I have sympathy. I'm not at all sure I wouldn't have done the same thing at his age in those circumstances, despite my tendency to idealism. And if I had worked hard to make my dream of becoming a professional cyclist come true, and was starting to have some success, I'm pretty sure I'd be extremely reluctant to chuck it in and go back to Mum or university.

Right. The activity and the path he took to get there are all understandable, and most of us, maybe, would have done the same in similar circumstances.

What most people in this thread are reacting to, though, is the insufferable and weak-assed way in which Miller has acquitted himself since being born again, specifically in this interview.
 
He knows how to speak to the audience for sure. He made some mistakes and covered his *** well. Thats why we see him riding like he does now and not winning much. He is riding on talent vs talent and drugs.

I remember seeing Millar crash in front me on the bend in the 01 prologue and then seeing him just hope back on and smash it out. I thought, this dude will get busted soon enough. Looks like he is riding the clean route now and passing on his experience to his team mates. Great to see. Garmins seems like the team that is using other ways to perform well. Still, with their good will, they wont perform consistently like the other teams will. 5 years ago nobody cared about Allen Lims' rice cake recipie, ice baths or CVV's gluten free diet..but now you can run a team and give your sponsors coverage not via stage victories but by rider personalities, recipies, training camp vids, big moustaches and funny harmless antics. Thats good to see. More and more people understand that the big time winners are on the gear and they want to see more real life stuff than the fake BS. Will be great to see in 5 years how things are. I see them becoming even better. Team Garmin sponsoring planting vege gardens in local communities each day of the TDF n stuff.. With blogs, forums, youtube etc the whole racing scene is becoming more personal and fans are demanding more real life drama and action and less bleached teeth and perfect height socks.


a real race horse isnt just genetics..you aint winning on gear and then coming back 'clean' and riding at the same level. No way. Good to see Millar making himself a more of a public figure than just a palmare's list.
 
Aug 1, 2010
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I kept expecting him at some point to say that he recognized that he was responsible for his actions.

I think he did, when referring to doping for the 2nd time. It was mumbled, head down and not repeated but I think it was there.

True, he was more vocal about blaming others but I do cut him some slack for that. To be fair to him, it's very difficult for us to know what that environment was like and how the pressures might have been felt by him. I think he did feel a weight of responsibility and I can imagine that could be manipulated. He was a young man, a long way from home in an environment that he considered family. I'm prepared to forgive him for it as a foolishness of youth, and accept his explanation now at face value.

He is, as someone else pointed out, good to watch on a bike. And, for anyone who hasn't read his writings (Millar Diaries etc) a very entertaining read!

Sorry to jump in with a first post like this. I've been reading a few threads just to get the feel of the place but had to respond since nobody else seemed to hear Millar's admission! :)
 
May 26, 2009
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durianrider said:
but now you can run a team and give your sponsors coverage not via stage victories but by rider personalities, recipies, training camp vids, big moustaches and funny harmless antics. Thats good to see.

I'm extremely sceptic about Garmin. Not only is their anti-doping very superficial considering their inside knowledge and how quite a few of them were part of a huge cycling fraud.

And sorry, but getting top ten TdF riders on gluten free diets etc.? Can we please get rid of Quack science? Once again; I think it's a huge ruse and that for all purposes it's a normal team with their own shady dealings.

And towards David: the recreational drugs were spoonfed by your colleagues as well?

David+Garmin: Pssshhh
 

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