Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

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SpinToWin said:
Well pretty much everyone in Kenya who has been outside Nairobi or the highlands around Mt. Kenya has had bilharzia. Indeed Froome's whole family have had it and are still trying to shake it - it's not an easy parasite to kill. For an athlete, as Froome points out, it's your worst nightmare as it attacks your red blood cells.

As for the cynics out there, ask Nairobi's "Centre for Tropical and Travel Medicine", Dr Chunge, if he treated Froome for bilharzia.
I'm not necessarily thinking the bilharzia is a falsehood.

I'm thinking that it's hilarious that he was simply just about ProTour domestique level, then it was discovered just in time for him to hit perfect form for a GT where nobody else (except somebody equally suspicious) was on form, just in time for him to go from "possibly losing his ProTour contract and being maybe taken on as a domestique at Lampre or Garmin if he was lucky" to "GT podium on a much more lucrative contract"...

Then his first port of call was to contract the same illness again! This time it was cured just in time for him to destroy the field at the Tour de France, after achieving a grand total of nothing all year until the Dauphiné.

He may well have had bilharzia... but the characteristics of bilharzia (which would validly affect a pro cyclist of course) seem to be being used as a convenient justification for preposterous superpeaking.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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Libertine Seguros said:
He may well have had bilharzia... but the characteristics of bilharzia (which would validly affect a pro cyclist of course) seem to be being used as a convenient justification for preposterous superpeaking.
What I find interesting is the fact the Kenian distance runners seem not to get sick of this bacteria. Is the bilharzia bacteria a rich mens disease in Kenya?

Let us all pray for Chris he won't get infected again this winter!
 
SpinToWin said:
Well pretty much everyone in Kenya who has been outside Nairobi or the highlands around Mt. Kenya has had bilharzia. Indeed Froome's whole family have had it and are still trying to shake it - it's not an easy parasite to kill. For an athlete, as Froome points out, it's your worst nightmare as it attacks your red blood cells.
but that's essentially the fact for everyone to distrust him: How come an endurance athlete can have this sudden jump in performance while suffering from a parasite that feeds of the main carrier of oxygen??? how come his "illness" conveniently appears during "the training" season and miraculously disappears when the big races come up????

SpinToWin said:
As for the cynics out there, ask Nairobi's "Centre for Tropical and Travel Medicine", Dr Chunge, if he treated Froome for bilharzia.
Do you know if Froome does have a TUE? If so- how the illness is treated? because if is red cell deficit-we all know that EPO or any other "red cells booster" must be used to counter & treat it.....
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Libertine Seguros said:
I'm not necessarily thinking the bilharzia is a falsehood.

I'm thinking that it's hilarious that he was simply just about ProTour domestique level, then it was discovered just in time for him to hit perfect form for a GT where nobody else (except somebody equally suspicious) was on form, just in time for him to go from "possibly losing his ProTour contract and being maybe taken on as a domestique at Lampre or Garmin if he was lucky" to "GT podium on a much more lucrative contract"...

Then his first port of call was to contract the same illness again! This time it was cured just in time for him to destroy the field at the Tour de France, after achieving a grand total of nothing all year until the Dauphiné.

He may well have had bilharzia... but the characteristics of bilharzia (which would validly affect a pro cyclist of course) seem to be being used as a convenient justification for preposterous superpeaking.
but he was tested by Brailsford around the time he chenged nationality, 3 or 4 od years back.

Brailsford liked the numbers
 
blackcat said:
but he was tested by Brailsford around the time he chenged nationality, 3 or 4 od years back.

Brailsford liked the numbers
Brailsford placed Vroome at barely suitable for a Pro Contiental domestique. He was ranked as having the worst capability of everyone on the team.
 

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BroDeal said:
Brailsford placed Vroome at barely suitable for a Pro Contiental domestique. He was ranked as having the worst capability of everyone on the team.
His Vuelta TT was touted as 5.8W/kg, then he only went 1:16 seconds slower over 53km vs Brad Wiggins (ie 2% ~= 6% less power) who is pumping out at LEAST 6.56W/kg (giving us 6.1W/kg minimum for Froome).

Looks like lots of marginal gains...
 
Mar 13, 2009
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BroDeal said:
Brailsford placed Vroome at barely suitable for a Pro Contiental domestique. He was ranked as having the worst capability of everyone on the team.
no no Bro, you are misinterpreting Brailfords study of CQranking, and the UCI points under the old system. And we know why some riders score, and some do not score. Besides Vuelta and Dauphine, Floyd was basically anonymous til he won the Tour.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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blackcat said:
no no Bro, you are misinterpreting Brailfords study of CQranking, and the UCI points under the old system. And we know why some riders score, and some do not score. Besides Vuelta and Dauphine, Floyd was basically anonymous til he won the Tour.
Dunno if this picture is the real deal but if it is, you could say Brailsford has very little analitic power of pro cycling.

Jumping from continental podium to two GT podiums is a hell of a leap, even Floyd couldn't do that.

But, lets wait and see if Alex Dowsett will repeat/follow Froomey's remarkable carreerpath.
 
Dec 27, 2010
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blackcat said:
but he was tested by Brailsford around the time he chenged nationality, 3 or 4 od years back.

Brailsford liked the numbers
He liked the numbers so much that at the start of Froome's infamous Vuelta, Froome had no contract renewal offer on the table.
 
blackcat said:
no no Bro, you are misinterpreting Brailfords study of CQranking, and the UCI points under the old system. And we know why some riders score, and some do not score. Besides Vuelta and Dauphine, Floyd was basically anonymous til he won the Tour.
Floyd also doped. :rolleyes:
 
Aug 29, 2010
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
Dunno if this picture is the real deal but if it is, you could say Brailsford has very little analitic power of pro cycling.
The people on that graph were not put there by Brailsford, but the journalist. They even print "Our approximation" on it for the people who take it out of context.
 
May 1, 2012
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One of my good friends is friends with Chris Froome and his brother, it might not count for much but he is known as a totally straight-up and genuine guy. I would be completely shocked if he doped.

Figures aside, yes he was very good this tour but nobody challenged Sky, so can you really say he was unbelievably good?

How would he have fared in GC against Contador, or in the mountains against Andy?

A lot of factors aligned to flatter Sky, give them until at least next years Vuelta before concluding that they were un-naturally impressive. I think a well organised RSNT team with Canc, Andy and Frank on form would have made them look good, but not US Postal good, as they might have seemed.
 

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johnnycash said:
One of my good friends is friends with Chris Froome and his brother, it might not count for much but he is known as a totally straight-up and genuine guy. I would be completely shocked if he doped.

Figures aside, yes he was very good this tour but nobody challenged Sky, so can you really say he was unbelievably good?

How would he have fared in GC against Contador, or in the mountains against Andy?

A lot of factors aligned to flatter Sky, give them until at least next years Vuelta before concluding that they were un-naturally impressive. I think a well organised RSNT team with Canc, Andy and Frank on form would have made them look good, but not US Postal good, as they might have seemed.
He challenged Wiggins at last year's Vuelta, smacking him in the TT. It's only a few days and we get to see just how good he is against Contador.
 
Dec 27, 2010
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johnnycash said:
One of my good friends is friends with Chris Froome and his brother, it might not count for much but he is known as a totally straight-up and genuine guy. I would be completely shocked if he doped.

Figures aside, yes he was very good this tour but nobody challenged Sky, so can you really say he was unbelievably good?

How would he have fared in GC against Contador, or in the mountains against Andy?

A lot of factors aligned to flatter Sky, give them until at least next years Vuelta before concluding that they were un-naturally impressive. I think a well organised RSNT team with Canc, Andy and Frank on form would have made them look good, but not US Postal good, as they might have seemed.
There weren't many days even in the Postal era where a team of 8, of which two were non-climbers (Eisel and Cav), dominated every single mountain stage.
 
May 1, 2012
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will10 said:
There weren't many days even in the Postal era where a team of 8, of which two were non-climbers (Eisel and Cav), dominated every single mountain stage.
Yes but there weren't many big mountain stages this year, and I believe the other main GC teams (liquigas and BMC primarily) were particularly weak. If someone had made Sky hurt on the climbs they may have struggled the next day cracks would have opened up. Without any concerted pressure, they were allowed to ride within themselves for too much of the time. Cav's shifts on the front did show how he had improved that area of his riding but maybe also underlined the lack of potency in this years peloton.
 
johnnycash said:
One of my good friends is friends with Chris Froome and his brother, it might not count for much but he is known as a totally straight-up and genuine guy. I would be completely shocked if he doped.

Figures aside, yes he was very good this tour but nobody challenged Sky, so can you really say he was unbelievably good?

How would he have fared in GC against Contador, or in the mountains against Andy?

A lot of factors aligned to flatter Sky, give them until at least next years Vuelta before concluding that they were un-naturally impressive. I think a well organised RSNT team with Canc, Andy and Frank on form would have made them look good, but not US Postal good, as they might have seemed.
Two words for the bolded part - Tyler Hamilton. Even folks with nice guy, genuine type reps can dope.

As for the rest, it is not just le Tour. It's been every stage race Sky's raced this season. The one's they were not 'peaking' for were not dominated as much, but still ;)
 

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johnnycash said:
Yes but there weren't many big mountain stages this year, and I believe the other main GC teams (liquigas and BMC primarily) were particularly weak. If someone had made Sky hurt on the climbs they may have struggled the next day cracks would have opened up. Without any concerted pressure, they were allowed to ride within themselves for too much of the time. Cav's shifts on the front did show how he had improved that area of his riding but maybe also underlined the lack of potency in this years peloton.
No offense, but name one year when BMC - other than Cadel - were any good on mountain stages. This year they had TJ up there going better than Cadel, so this year BMC were better in the mountains than any other year bar Cadel's win last year - and that was not BMC being strong in the mountains, that was Cadel clawing back time.

Mick Rogers and Wiggins have already pointed out why Sky weren't hurt on the mountain stages - they were already going 450W. Basso was sitting on the wheel and doing 420W just to hang there. It is not physiologically possible to inflict pain (ie prolonged bursts of higher power output) when the front rider is going that hard.
 
May 1, 2012
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the big ring said:
No offense, but name one year when BMC - other than Cadel - were any good on mountain stages. This year they had TJ up there going better than Cadel, so this year BMC were better in the mountains than any other year bar Cadel's win last year - and that was not BMC being strong in the mountains, that was Cadel clawing back time.

Mick Rogers and Wiggins have already pointed out why Sky weren't hurt on the mountain stages - they were already going 450W. Basso was sitting on the wheel and doing 420W just to hang there. It is not physiologically possible to inflict pain (ie prolonged bursts of higher power output) when the front rider is going that hard.
Fair point, I don't know much about wattages. I don't think it was lack of effort from the other teams, especially in Cadels case, more that the other teams were less prepared and conditioned than Sky. Some of Sky's riders are not that good (or haven't been in the past) which I can see invites doping talk but they definitely got the past out of them and had their approach down pat in PN, let alone Romandie and the Dauphine. When did BMC or Liqugas have a proper go at a stage race, with their tour leader, before the it started? did Cadel want the Dauphine GC?

Also knowing your man (Wiggo) will do the business in the ITTs must make it much easier for the domestiques to push that bit harder in the mountains, I would think.
 

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johnnycash said:
Also knowing your man (Wiggo) will do the business in the ITTs must make it much easier for the domestiques to push that bit harder in the mountains, I would think.
I don't think this is true - even at the amateur (no offense) level - I race at that level - but at the professional level, the tour can make your career. Not a single rider is there for a holiday. That your GC guy can smack the crap out of everyone in the TT does not give you any marginal gains for riding on the front - it's purely your physiology and preparation. If anything, I would think confidence in Brad putting minutes into people in the TT would allow them to slacken off.

Most riders prepare well for the Tour and ride their guts out. Like I said, it can make your career.

Frank Schleck is an exception this year, but there's extenuating circumstances eh...
 
the big ring said:
Mick Rogers and Wiggins have already pointed out why Sky weren't hurt on the mountain stages - they were already going 450W. Basso was sitting on the wheel and doing 420W just to hang there. It is not physiologically possible to inflict pain (ie prolonged bursts of higher power output) when the front rider is going that hard.
I think people make a mistake when they point to wattages of entire climbs. The argument has been made that the power levels are down, so the Tour must be clean. They point to times on climbs and power derived from those times. But road racing is not a time trial. Rogers and Porte do not have to ride a 450W tempo for an entire climb. They only need to discourage people from attacking. That can be done by riding a stiff pace and easily reeling in anyone who attacks. It only takes a few times to convince the other teams that attacking is useless. The best they can do is stay with the group and hope the situation changes during another stage.

I don't agree with the assertion that Sky was not very good, everyone else sucked.
 
johnnycash said:
Also knowing your man (Wiggo) will do the business in the ITTs must make it much easier for the domestiques to push that bit harder in the mountains, I would think.
How were they supposed to know that a rider who even as a tt specialist had not managed to podium a long tour de france tt, was now as a in his own words, climber who can tt a bit, going to smash everyone by minutes.

The only way they could know that is if they knew what he was taking.
 
Aug 11, 2012
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Do more people think he looks awful on his bicycle ? That man is no cyclist, I'm sorry.

Not a fan of him at all.
 

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