Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[Benotti69]

And for those saying that based on Chris' performances must be from someone with a VO2 max over 90. Fred Grappe disagrees based on Chris' actual power data. Here it is in English for you :

"To date, the nature of performance, there is no evidence that they can be made ​​with a VO2max greater than 90 ml / min / kg."

Chris' estimated VO2 max based on his performances over the last two years is consistent with Theze's measurement back in 2007.

Why has Froome not been in the lab every 6 months like Wiggins was?

Why do Sky keep telling lies?

Why is his Vo2max an 'estimate'?

Why not get it measured exactly?

Do Sky not leave every stone unturned?

Why doesn't Froome release all his data if he wants people to believe he is clean?

Have you forgotten what doping has done to this sport? Time for riders to be honest if they want to be believed!

Do you know how many riders who have won the TdF are believed to be clean when they won? LeMond!

 

[Benotti69]

Okay, I'll do my best to spell it out for you.

All the controversy about Chris' VO2 max came about because Fred Grappe estimated that Chris' VO2 max had to be between 85 - 90.
http://www.fredericgrappe.com/?p=1322

Grappe said Armstrong's numbers did not add up to doping in 2002. Grappe has no credibility.

 

[Granville57]

So I'm failing to see what exactly people are struggling with?!?!

A few things.

1) Your tone (because believe it or not, it doesn't help your case).


2)...

Why is his Vo2max an 'estimate'?

3)...

Michel Theze has been talking about it for the last two years

Thats not exactly a compliment for sir dave

Why is that every "explanation" only brings more questions than answers?
Every attempt by "Michelle" to clear the air only makes things seem murkier.

I'm still curious to know why the UCI informed Chris of something "called bilharzia" if he had supposedly asked them to screen for bilharzia due to his brother's condition.

Why wasn't his response something more like, "Well, yeah, no kidding you found bilharzia in my system. That's what I asked you to screen for it! It's quite common where I come from, and my brother has already suffered from it. THAT'S WHY I ASKED YOU TO SCREEN FOR IT!"

But no, Chris' response, on camera, was that they found something "called bilharzia."

Sorry if I'm not gullible enough for the internet.

 

[The Hitch]

You're so determined to believe that Chris is doping that you will constantly disregard the facts.

Bit rich from someone who offered almost winning a stage at the giro de whogivesa****, that no one who isn't heavily into u23 racing has even heard of, as a sign that this nobody was going to be the greatest talent to touch a bicycle.

I'd say its also a bit rich for someone, who has such a big stake in people believing froome could feasibly be clean, to lecture others about the disregarding of facts. You, unlike anyone else here, stand to gain a lot financially from the lie being believed and lose a lot, financially and otherwise, if the lie is exposed. By definition you are placed in a position where you are forced to disregard facts.

As if that wasn't enough, you have very little experience and knowledge of cycling, and even less on anti doping, as opposed to many (not all) here who have been watching cycling for decades, paying attention to anti doping for just as long, who have seen through far more complex lies and explanations, made in favour of people with far more believable performances, than the nonsensical often contradictory ones that come from Christopher's mouth.

Hey, if you want to play the facts game be my guest. I suspect you'll be out of here soon enough though.

 

[sniper]

...

when grappe,s analysis came out, there was a clear window of opportunjty to present chris vo2 max to grappe and to the wider audience and thus to silence alot of critics then and there. That window was missed

 

[Mish_C]

That's a huge number of questions for Sky and I suggest you ask them about it.

Sky don't test VO2 - and if they did and they gave the results you probably wouldn't believe them anyway.

The data is for Sky to release. It is not Chris' property.

To target Chris for Sky's PR failings is a little stupid don't you think?

 

[Mish_C]

Bit rich from someone who offered almost winning a stage at the giro de whogivesa****, that no one who isn't heavily into u23 racing has even heard of, as a sign that this nobody was going to be the greatest talent to touch a bicycle.

I'd say its also a bit rich for someone, who has such a big stake in people believing froome could feasibly be clean, to lecture others about the disregarding of facts. You, unlike anyone else here, stand to gain a lot financially from the lie being believed and lose a lot, financially and otherwise, if the lie is exposed. By definition you are placed in a position where you are forced to disregard facts.

As if that wasn't enough, you have very little experience and knowledge of cycling, and even less on anti doping, as opposed to many (not all) here who have been watching cycling for decades, paying attention to anti doping for just as long, who have seen through far more complex lies and explanations, made in favour of people with far more believable performances, than the nonsensical often contradictory ones that come from Christopher's mouth.

Hey, if you want to play the facts game be my guest. I suspect you'll be out of here soon enough though.

Clearly you don't know me or understand my involvement. I have not gained financially in any way. The only thing at stake is my own reputation. I gave up my career, my life, my family and my friends to support someone that I believe in. If I had any doubts what so ever I would not be here.

 

[Granville57]

That's a huge number of questions for Sky and I suggest you ask them about it.

Ummm, that's exactly what people have been trying to do for some time now.

But if you read closely, there were a number of questions directed at you, based on points that you, yourself raised.

So...?

 

[Mish_C]

Why is his Vo2max an 'estimate'?

Why not get it measured exactly?

Do Sky not leave every stone unturned?

Why doesn't Froome release all his data if he wants people to believe he is clean?

Have you forgotten what doping has done to this sport? Time for riders to be honest if they want to be believed!

Do you know how many riders who have won the TdF are believed to be clean when they won? LeMond!

Again this is for Sky - they don't 'do VO2 max testing, they have explained why but it seems to fall on deaf ears.

Power data belongs to Sky

I don't give a **** what the riders of the past did. Chris and I certainly had nothing to do with that. Sorry, but that doesn't give you reason to treat us with disrespect.

LeMond is the one that believes a consistent VO2 max is indicative of a clean performance, no?

 

[Mish_C]

Ummm, that's exactly what people have been trying to do for some time now.

But if you read closely, there were a number of questions directed at you, based on points that you, yourself raised.

So...?

Are YOU happy?

 

[Granville57]

I don't give a **** what the riders of the past did.

Well, perhaps you should. It is precisely because of "what the riders of the past did" (and they did do it, there is no question of that) that many people today have very little faith in the sport, especially when it comes to those who stand atop the podium.

 

[Afrank]

Clearly you don't know me or understand my involvement. I have not gained financially in any way. The only thing at stake is my own reputation. I gave up my career, my life, my family and my friends to support someone that I believe in. If I had any doubts what so ever I would not be here.

You haven't gained financially? I would have thought being married to someone that went going from zero to hero (more then just hero, strongest in the world) would come with a little extra money. Or am I wrong that the Tour de France awards prize money...

 

[Mish_C]

A few things.

1) Your tone (because believe it or not, it doesn't help your case).


2)...

3)...




Why is that every "explanation" only brings more questions than answers?
Every attempt by "Michelle" to clear the air only makes things seem murkier.

I'm still curious to know why the UCI informed Chris of something "called bilharzia" if he had supposedly asked them to screen for bilharzia due to his brother's condition.

Why wasn't his response something more like, "Well, yeah, no kidding you found bilharzia in my system. That's what I asked you to screen for it! It's quite common where I come from, and my brother has already suffered from it. THAT'S WHY I ASKED YOU TO SCREEN FOR IT!"

But no, Chris' response, on camera, was that they found something "called bilharzia."

Sorry if I'm not gullible enough for the internet.

I couldn't care less what you think about my tone.

The UCI did not inform Chris about bilharzia.. not sure where you get that from. If it does happen to be in some random article, one of the reasons why Chris is putting out a book is because there has been so much information that has been misreported in the past, there is plenty to be clarified.

 

[roundabout]

at the giro de whogivesa****, that no one who isn't heavily into u23 racing has even heard of

UCI gave a **** to make it part of the U23 Nations Cup.

 

[veganrob]

I couldn't care less what you think about my tone.

The UCI did not inform Chris about bilharzia.. not sure where you get that from. If it does happen to be in some random article, one of the reasons why Chris is putting out a book is because there has been so much information that has been misreported in the past, there is plenty to be clarified.

Why would anyone believe what it says in a book from Chris when he already has given out contradictory statements

 

[Netserk]

I hope for Chris' sake that it's a fake account, but it really wouldn't surprise if it was the real one

But then again, she wasn't exactly elegant with miss Wiggo either.

 

[Mish_C]

You haven't gained financially? I would have thought being married to someone that went going from zero to hero (more then just hero, strongest in the world) would come with a little extra money. Or am I wrong that the Tour de France awards prize money...

1) We are not married.
2) He was never a zero. I was at the Giro del Capo in 2007 when he won the best young riders jersey, this was where I first photographed him. He was always a level above the rest.
3)The TDF awards prize money and the winner divides it between the staff and his team mates. It is not customary for the winner to receive any of it.

 

[Mish_C]

I hope for Chris' sake that it's a fake account, but it really wouldn't surprise if it was the real one

But then again, she wasn't exactly elegant with miss Wiggo either.

Why? Because I pointed out a rather rude & unnecessary tweet that she had made? I've never made any other comments about her.

 

[Mish_C]

Why would anyone believe what it says in a book from Chris when he already has given out contradictory statements

Because he didn't give contradictory statements, the journalists transcribed it incorrectly. I can't tell you how many times we've read an article and Chris has said "I never said that"... but what you can you do. All we can try and do now is get the facts out there.

 

[veganrob]

Because he didn't give contradictory statements, the journalists transcribed it incorrectly. I can't tell you how many times we've read an article and Chris has said "I never said that"... but what you can you do. All we can try and do now is get the facts out there.

Ok then, but at this point what's the use. The lines are formed and nobody is changing their mind. It appears disengenuous and more PR bull**** from the Sky camp.
I am not throwing stones at Chris now, just saying how it appears.

Sky on the other hand deserve way more abuse than they get.

 

[Afrank]

1) We are not married.
2) He was never a zero. I was at the Giro del Capo in 2007 when he won the best young riders jersey, this was where I first photographed him. He was always a level above the rest.
3)The TDF awards prize money and the winner divides it between the staff and his team mates. It is not customary for the winner to receive any of it.

1. Your together, that's my point there.

2. 2010- http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/rider_palm.asp?riderid=5789&year=2010&all=1&current=0
2009- http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/rider_palm.asp?riderid=5789&year=2009&all=1&current=0
2008- http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/rider_palm.asp?riderid=5789&year=2008&all=1&current=0
Yest, those are definitely the results of someone that would go onto becoming the greatest cyclist in the world in the span of a few months (from Vuelta onward).

3. So he's still making the money he was making back when he was doing pretty much nothing of note. Now that he's podiumed the Vuelta, placed 2nd in the Tour, won the Tour, and pretty much become the greatest cyclist in the world he's not making any more money? Then he needs to fire his agent and get a new one to negotiate his contract.

 

[ChrisE]

I suggest you guys take a step back and give Mish some latitude. I just did a GIS on her and she's pretty hot. Give her a break.

 

[sniper]

All we can try and do now is get the facts out there.

Walsh did a pretty poor job at getting the facts out there for team sky.
ITS was an insult to anybody with half a brain.
Hope he,s done a better job this time.

 

[BYOP88]

I couldn't care less what you think about my tone.

The UCI did not inform Chris about bilharzia.. not sure where you get that from. If it does happen to be in some random article, one of the reasons why Chris is putting out a book is because there has been so much information that has been misreported in the past, there is plenty to be clarified.

http://youtu.be/1bKuqFBrE9o?t=10m44s Seems it was due to the UCI passport that he found out he had it. I thought is brother had it and told him to get checked out?

I'm aware that Sky probably wont release Chris' data prior the 2011 Vuelta. Couldn't he ask the UCI to release the stuff they have from when he was at the UCI school?

 

[The Hitch]

2) He was never a zero. I was at the Giro del Capo in 2007 when he won the best young riders jersey, this was where I first photographed him. He was always a level above the rest.

lol, the giro del what now? Was there even a world top 200 rider in that race?

Btw if he didn't win the overall he wasn't a level above the rest was he?