Future cobbles challengers.

[Anderis]

The obvious Van Baarle's future success is obvious.

 

[GenericBoonenFan]

Two guys, Tim Merlier and Wout van Aert

 

[Sykes]

Not mentioned on this post yet (i think): Oliver Naesen (IAM), Gijs Van Hoecke (Topsport), Petit (Direct Energie), Laporte (Cofidis), van Poppel (Sky), Gougeard (AG2R), Vliegen (BMC), Pedersen (Stolting), David Per (Adria Mobil)

 

[TMP402]

To go with Thwaites I add some more Brits: Doull (Sky), McLay (Fortuneo), Jonathan Dibben (WIGGINS/Cannondale), Chris Latham (WIGGINS) and James Shaw, currently a stagiaire with Lotto Soudal.

 

[Brullnux]

McLay is more of a sprinter, no? Thwaites and Doull I can definitely see. Dibben is a pursuiter so probably

 

[TMP402]

Re:

McLay is more of a sprinter, no? Thwaites and Doull I can definitely see. Dibben is a pursuiter so probably

Yes McLay is a sprinter but he has said he's not sure if his future is sprinting or the cobbles, so he must like them. He is a former 'cross rider at junior level and came second to Stuyven at the U23 Paris-Roubaix in 2010, and was at Lotto Soudal's U23 team after all. Admittedly the only evidence of cobbled talent I've actually watched was Le Samyn this year where he was competitive with Terpstra and Thwaites and the rest until the final few kms when he blew up pretty badly and finished 12th.

 

[BalearicBeats]

I'm probably a bit biased but do you guys expect Claeys and Planckaert to do well on the cobbles next year, when they're in better teams for those?

 

[TMP402]

Re:

I'm probably a bit biased but do you guys expect Claeys and Planckaert to do well on the cobbles next year, when they're in better teams for those?

I can't say I'm massively optimistic. I think one or both of them will turn out to be Marko Kumps, great at getting top 10s in 1.1 races no-one cares about, but anonymous at WT level. And neither of them are youngsters; their predecessors from last season - Naesen and Theuns - were both born in the 90s, as was 2014's equivalent, van Asbroeck.

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

Based on this year's PR I'm hopeful of a good result from Durbridge.

Not out of the question. He had a very solid ride despite a lot of bad luck. Hopefully Durbridge is starting to improve again, he's been a little stagnant until this year.

 

[RedheadDane]

Re:

Not mentioned on this post yet (i think): Oliver Naesen (IAM), Gijs Van Hoecke (Topsport), Petit (Direct Energie), Laporte (Cofidis), van Poppel (Sky), Gougeard (AG2R), Vliegen (BMC), Pedersen (Stolting), David Per (Adria Mobil)

Trek next year. At least according to Danish media he's "replacing Cancellara", but let's be realistic, nobody is gonna go directly onto the WT scene and replace Cancellara. Danish media just tend to hype our riders a bit.

 

[Billie]

Re: Re:

I'm probably a bit biased but do you guys expect Claeys and Planckaert to do well on the cobbles next year, when they're in better teams for those?

I can't say I'm massively optimistic. I think one or both of them will turn out to be Marko Kumps, great at getting top 10s in 1.1 races no-one cares about, but anonymous at WT level. And neither of them are youngsters; their predecessors from last season - Naesen and Theuns - were both born in the 90s, as was 2014's equivalent, van Asbroeck.

Claeys already top 10'd de Ronde

 

[Sykes]

Re: Re:

Not mentioned on this post yet (i think): Oliver Naesen (IAM), Gijs Van Hoecke (Topsport), Petit (Direct Energie), Laporte (Cofidis), van Poppel (Sky), Gougeard (AG2R), Vliegen (BMC), Pedersen (Stolting), David Per (Adria Mobil)

Trek next year. At least according to Danish media he's "replacing Cancellara", but let's be realistic, nobody is gonna go directly onto the WT scene and replace Cancellara. Danish media just tend to hype our riders a bit.

Thanks for the correction! Yeah, he's only 20, too young to put his mark in the WT classics, but a win in Gent-Wevelgem/Kattekoers-Ieper this year is a good sign

 

[RedheadDane]

It wasn't really a correction, though, since Stölting is in fact the team he's on now. I just wanted to point out that he'll be on a WT team next year.

Naesen won't be on IAM next year either. Obviously...

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

I'm probably a bit biased but do you guys expect Claeys and Planckaert to do well on the cobbles next year, when they're in better teams for those?

I can't say I'm massively optimistic. I think one or both of them will turn out to be Marko Kumps, great at getting top 10s in 1.1 races no-one cares about, but anonymous at WT level. And neither of them are youngsters; their predecessors from last season - Naesen and Theuns - were both born in the 90s, as was 2014's equivalent, van Asbroeck.

Claeys already top 10'd de Ronde

Okay. Let me change my opinion. He's the new Erviti.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

So what has 2017 taught us?

There are some very obvious big talents (only speaking of U25 riders here) like Benoot (5th RVV, 6th and 7th DDV, 7th E3, 4th KBK), Moscon (5th PR) and Van Baarle (8th and 3rd DDV, 9th E3, 4th and 6th RVV)

Senechal (no top 10's) and Stuyven (4th PR, 1st and 2nd KBK, 8th OHN, 5th E3) have been mentioned as bright stars for several years now, but who else should we turn our attention to?

Bettiol (10th E3)? Lutsenko (3rd DDV)? Perhaps even Valgren (11th in his first RVV)? Or what about Allegaert (17th in his first PR as a 22-year-old)?

 

[SafeBet]

I like Bettiol chances in Flanders a couple of years from now. He's one of those guys who knows when to hit peak shape, very solid rider.

Lutsenko is a massive talent obviously, but rather inconsistent. I could see him winning a big race even next year or never be in a top10 again.

I don't know why but I expect Soren Kragh Andersen to become a very good cobble rider.

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

So what has 2017 taught us?

There are some very obvious big talents (only speaking of U25 riders here) like Benoot (5th RVV, 6th and 7th DDV, 7th E3, 4th KBK), Moscon (5th PR) and Van Baarle (8th and 3rd DDV, 9th E3, 4th and 6th RVV)

Senechal (no top 10's) and Stuyven (4th PR, 1st and 2nd KBK, 8th OHN, 5th E3) have been mentioned as bright stars for several years now, but who else should we turn our attention to?

Bettiol (10th E3)? Lutsenko (3rd DDV)? Perhaps even Valgren (11th in his first RVV)? Or what about Allegaert (17th in his first PR as a 22-year-old)?

There's something to like about all these names, good to see Lutsenko starting to show his talent, I was getting worried.

I noticed Miles Scotson had a solid ride for a first year pro and Alex Edmondson is showing that he has potential on the stones as well. I'm finding it very hard not to see Stuyven, Van Baarle and Moscon dominating the hard man races for a long time though.

 

[Brullnux]

^and Benoot too.

Durbridge has massively impressed me this year. There were also a few cobbled rookies like Felline and Colbrelli who have been solid.

 

[tobydawq]

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

 

[frisenfruitig]

Re:

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

Do you see Gaviria challenging for monuments like De Ronde and PR though? He's a sprinter that can hold on for a long time but I don't really see him being able to follow guys like Sagan when they go full gas in tough classics. I can sort of picture him winning GW if the best guys don't race too hard but that's about it tbh.

I don't really believe in Matthews either for the same reasons. I don't think he has what it takes to win tough classics.

I am pretty excited for Poels and Van Aert though, I get the impression they are even more talented than Stybar and he managed to become a pretty solid rider so yeah. I hope they won't wait too much longer to change to the road.

 

[Oliver]

Expected more from Benoot.

Naesen is better. Sad to see all the bad luck @ Ronde and Roubaix.

 

[tobydawq]

Re: Re:

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

Do you see Gaviria challenging for monuments like De Ronde and PR though? He's a sprinter that can hold on for a long time but I don't really see him being able to follow guys like Sagan when they go full gas in tough classics. I can sort of picture him winning GW if the best guys don't race too hard but that's about it tbh.

I don't really believe in Matthews either for the same reasons. I don't think he has what it takes to win tough classics.

I am pretty excited for Poels and Van Aert though, I get the impression they are even more talented than Stybar and he managed to become a pretty solid rider so yeah. I hope they won't wait too much longer to change to the road.

Yes, absolutely. Last year, he was already sixth in GW, so that is already within striking distance for him. And in Dwars door Vlaanderen this year, he looked so so smooth on the hellingen but didn't make the group that rode away on the flat. And the distance doesn't seem to be the problem with his showings in MSR so far (although I don't think that MSR actually tells you that much, as it is pretty easy the first five hours).

And Brian Holm - his DS - always speaks about how he is the biggest talent he has ever seen and that Sagan couldn't even compare to him. Of course that is the purest of nonsense, but you don't have to be as monstrously talented at such a young age as Sagan was to be able to compete in the monuments (obviously - no one is that).

So yes, I think he will be a contender all right, and I hope he will get the chance to gain experience in those races next year even though I know it's a difficult team to get a spot but with Boonen out it shouldn't be impossible. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the Giro - that could, in a way, give us a better picture of what we can expect from him.

 

[frisenfruitig]

Re: Re:

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

Do you see Gaviria challenging for monuments like De Ronde and PR though? He's a sprinter that can hold on for a long time but I don't really see him being able to follow guys like Sagan when they go full gas in tough classics. I can sort of picture him winning GW if the best guys don't race too hard but that's about it tbh.

I don't really believe in Matthews either for the same reasons. I don't think he has what it takes to win tough classics.

I am pretty excited for Poels and Van Aert though, I get the impression they are even more talented than Stybar and he managed to become a pretty solid rider so yeah. I hope they won't wait too much longer to change to the road.

Yes, absolutely. Last year, he was already sixth in GW, so that is already within striking distance for him. And in Dwars door Vlaanderen this year, he looked so so smooth on the hellingen but didn't make the group that rode away on the flat. And the distance doesn't seem to be the problem with his showings in MSR so far (although I don't think that MSR actually tells you that much, as it is pretty easy the first five hours).

And Brian Holm - his DS - always speaks about how he is the biggest talent he has ever seen and that Sagan couldn't even compare to him. Of course that is the purest of nonsense, but you don't have to be as monstrously talented at such a young age as Sagan was to be able to compete in the monuments (obviously - no one is that).

So yes, I think he will be a contender all right, and I hope he will get the chance to gain experience in those races next year even though I know it's a difficult team to get a spot but with Boonen out it shouldn't be impossible. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the Giro - that could, in a way, give us a better picture of what we can expect from him.

There is still a big difference between GW/MSR and De Ronde/PR though. But yeah, he's still only 22 years old so who knows, still a lot of room for improvement. I thought he was already 24 years old for some reason.

I don't see Matthews ever winning De Ronde or PR though.

 

[tobydawq]

Re: Re:

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

Do you see Gaviria challenging for monuments like De Ronde and PR though? He's a sprinter that can hold on for a long time but I don't really see him being able to follow guys like Sagan when they go full gas in tough classics. I can sort of picture him winning GW if the best guys don't race too hard but that's about it tbh.

I don't really believe in Matthews either for the same reasons. I don't think he has what it takes to win tough classics.

I am pretty excited for Poels and Van Aert though, I get the impression they are even more talented than Stybar and he managed to become a pretty solid rider so yeah. I hope they won't wait too much longer to change to the road.

Yes, absolutely. Last year, he was already sixth in GW, so that is already within striking distance for him. And in Dwars door Vlaanderen this year, he looked so so smooth on the hellingen but didn't make the group that rode away on the flat. And the distance doesn't seem to be the problem with his showings in MSR so far (although I don't think that MSR actually tells you that much, as it is pretty easy the first five hours).

And Brian Holm - his DS - always speaks about how he is the biggest talent he has ever seen and that Sagan couldn't even compare to him. Of course that is the purest of nonsense, but you don't have to be as monstrously talented at such a young age as Sagan was to be able to compete in the monuments (obviously - no one is that).

So yes, I think he will be a contender all right, and I hope he will get the chance to gain experience in those races next year even though I know it's a difficult team to get a spot but with Boonen out it shouldn't be impossible. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the Giro - that could, in a way, give us a better picture of what we can expect from him.

There is still a big difference between GW/MSR and De Ronde/PR though. But yeah, he's still only 22 years old so who knows, still a lot of room for improvement. I thought he was already 24 years old for some reason.

I don't see Matthews ever winning De Ronde or PR though.

Well, but he has never really disappointed, Gaviria, has he? He has maybe had quite a soft programme so far in his career but each time he has gotten the chance in a long race, he has done splendidly (MSR, G-W, Paris-Tours). So I haven't really seen anything that suggests that he can't become good in the hardest classics.

Regarding Matthews, I think he needs to realise that it is necessary to ride differently and more aggressively in the cobbled races, and I think he is more of a hard man than how he is generally assessed in here. It is unfortunate that he hasn't yet tried to race the biggest classics but if he sets his mind to it, I believe they will be good for him. But yeah, it is a bit of a wild card, and we haven't seen him in those races yet, so it could go both ways.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Re: Re:

Don't forget Gaviria. He has them as his dream races and I would be suprised if he doesn't end up as a top tier classics rider.

Matthews seems to be turning his attention to the Flemish classics as well, so that could be interesting.

And then I would suspect that in a few years' time, the cross guys (van der Poel and van Aert) will turn their attention towards the road and they are both so massively talented that I think they will be up there as well.

But okay, that is of course four names that didn't participate these past two Sundays, so we weren't really taught anything about them.

Do you see Gaviria challenging for monuments like De Ronde and PR though? He's a sprinter that can hold on for a long time but I don't really see him being able to follow guys like Sagan when they go full gas in tough classics. I can sort of picture him winning GW if the best guys don't race too hard but that's about it tbh.

I don't really believe in Matthews either for the same reasons. I don't think he has what it takes to win tough classics.

I am pretty excited for Poels and Van Aert though, I get the impression they are even more talented than Stybar and he managed to become a pretty solid rider so yeah. I hope they won't wait too much longer to change to the road.

Yes, absolutely. Last year, he was already sixth in GW, so that is already within striking distance for him. And in Dwars door Vlaanderen this year, he looked so so smooth on the hellingen but didn't make the group that rode away on the flat. And the distance doesn't seem to be the problem with his showings in MSR so far (although I don't think that MSR actually tells you that much, as it is pretty easy the first five hours).

And Brian Holm - his DS - always speaks about how he is the biggest talent he has ever seen and that Sagan couldn't even compare to him. Of course that is the purest of nonsense, but you don't have to be as monstrously talented at such a young age as Sagan was to be able to compete in the monuments (obviously - no one is that).

So yes, I think he will be a contender all right, and I hope he will get the chance to gain experience in those races next year even though I know it's a difficult team to get a spot but with Boonen out it shouldn't be impossible. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the Giro - that could, in a way, give us a better picture of what we can expect from him.

There is still a big difference between GW/MSR and De Ronde/PR though. But yeah, he's still only 22 years old so who knows, still a lot of room for improvement. I thought he was already 24 years old for some reason.

I don't see Matthews ever winning De Ronde or PR though.

Well, but he has never really disappointed, Gaviria, has he? He has maybe had quite a soft programme so far in his career but each time he has gotten the chance in a long race, he has done splendidly (MSR, G-W, Paris-Tours). So I haven't really seen anything that suggests that he can't become good in the hardest classics.

Regarding Matthews, I think he needs to realise that it is necessary to ride differently and more aggressively in the cobbled races, and I think he is more of a hard man than how he is generally assessed in here. It is unfortunate that he hasn't yet tried to race the biggest classics but if he sets his mind to it, I believe they will be good for him. But yeah, it is a bit of a wild card, and we haven't seen him in those races yet, so it could go both ways.

Agree on Matthews, and I've even said it before, I think that Vlaanderen is very well suited to him.