Giro 2011 Review

[The Hitch]

181 is Contador's number and 11million are the fans along the road.

11 million fans. I thought thats what you meant but would like to see a source.

 

[El Pistolero]

11 million fans. I thought thats what you meant but would like to see a source.

Cyclingnews?

 

[dancing on pedals]

not read all the thread but i voted 8 - mainly on the grandeur of the event and also on the the performance of Garzelli and his team, not to mention the beautiful bianchi of Ruanjo.
I hoped Nibali would win, but to be fair Contador was not only a class above the rest but his team seeemed to control the event by letting others do the work.
Liquigas played the strong arm tactic far too long and hard, rather like Saiz and jalabert on a number of occasions in the past.
Credit to Contador, credit to Scarponi, but Nibali lost second place in this race by poor tactics.
A shame they worked hard.
thanks

 

[The Hitch]

Cyclingnews?

Could have posted a link, but the clue was good enough.

Oh, more brilliance from Zomegnan.

This is going as my signature

Why can people think the Giro was too hard? In the last week, we had two young riders who won ─ Ulissi and Capecchi ─ and they did the first two hours at 50kph. Maybe the Giro's not hard enough….”

 

[Galic Ho]

I think it was more the actual footage itself - very patchy with the feeds from the bikes to the chopper failing continously. Don't know if you saw the final stage, but almost no coverage of Nibali from the [motor]bike was clear. Dunno if this is the terrain or maybe faulty transmitters on the motorbikes. It did detract.
As for the "best deal", I beg to differ - on a week day I'm at work with no chance of seeing it at all...

Good point. If you work you can't watch unless your boss lets you have a tv running. But if you do get the chance to watch it, it is at least not interrupting your sleeping patterns. When SBS showed footage on tv (they show the Tour) they only started after 11pm. Unless you do shift work, I live in a mining town, then you are not going to be able to keep it up in the long run. Somethings gotta give and for me by the last stage it did.

Footage quality from some of the LiveStreams I did note wasn't up to scratch at times, but I thought that was simply topography related with the weather adding further interruptions, things outside the control of the organisers and broadcasters. But anything is better than nothing. I was going to watch the last stage, but alas after 3 weeks and the timing, I was far too tired. I need my beauty sleep.

 

[Galic Ho]

great race. I prefer it over the tour even more so. I prefer the mountains coming sooner rather than later. The narrow climbs, the snow capped mountains, and gravel roads really give the Giro its "unique-ness." I think Italy is much more picturesque and beautiful than France in my opinion. This year, the organizers did an amazing job despite a death. What bothered me was the likes of Cavendish and possibly other sprinters, abandoning because of no more flat stages ? That's not right.

Big +1. IMO they are stage hunting, nothing more. Out for their own glory. I'm sick and tired of HTC riders pulling for Cav and Renshaw all the time, then those two leaving or getting booted from a race, only to have to ride through the rest of the race themselves. If the course has climbs and you can't climb, don't race. They are simply too lazy to change their training and riding style. Makes for really boring riding. I still remember what happened to Rogers at last year Tour de Romandie. Leaders jersey, entire team was either booted or left except 1 rider. Naturally, Rogers went from 1st to 4th overall. HTC are a horrible team in terms of their attitude and viewing enjoyment.

 

[Jukebox]

Moment of the giro?
Unfortunetly the most lasting moment is WW's death.

Best win of the Giro?
Anton on the Zoncolan.

Best Stage of the Giro?
I missed 15, so the best one I witnessed was the Zoncolan.

Quote of the Giro...
Dunno.

Disappointment of the Giro?
Duarte having to pull out, he looked to be in great form.

Surprise of the Giro?
It wasn't that surprising, but Id have to say Rujano's return to form.

What are you looking forward to in the 2012 Giro?
Everything that makes the Giro special. So, everything.

Who did you expect more of?
Menchov.

Which riders performed beyond expectations?
Nieve, Rujano, Dupont.

Should there have been more pan flat stages?
Is this a trick question? No.

Was the tragedy handled correctly?
I think so.

Should Crostis have been included?
I would have loved to see it, but if the riders were scared for their safety, they should get the last word.

Overall, did the organizers do a good job?
Always.

Do you expect the other grand tours of 2011 to be better?
I'm hopeful, but this really was a good giro.

Did the awesomness of the 2010 Giro dampen this one a bit?
Maybe a little...

I gave it a 7, mostly because of the fact that after Etna we all really knew what the end result would be. However, the battle for 2nd, Anton's beautiful stage and watching Rujano climb were all huge plusses. So it certainly scores above average for me.

 

[craig1985]

Good point. If you work you can't watch unless your boss lets you have a tv running. But if you do get the chance to watch it, it is at least not interrupting your sleeping patterns. When SBS showed footage on tv (they show the Tour) they only started after 11pm. Unless you do shift work, I live in a mining town, then you are not going to be able to keep it up in the long run. Somethings gotta give and for me by the last stage it did.

Footage quality from some of the LiveStreams I did note wasn't up to scratch at times, but I thought that was simply topography related with the weather adding further interruptions, things outside the control of the organisers and broadcasters. But anything is better than nothing. I was going to watch the last stage, but alas after 3 weeks and the timing, I was far too tired. I need my beauty sleep.

The only perk of being off work with a broken collarbone is that I've been able to stay up and watch the Giro on Eurosport, or the next day I can watch a replay of therace. I do think ASO is the best at filming races, and IIRC last year at the TDU they hired some of the cameramen that are employed by ASO during the Tour to shoot the images for the TDU. Failing that,and if your internet plan is pretty good, then you could always download the stage from cyclingtorrents.

Big +1. IMO they are stage hunting, nothing more. Out for their own glory. I'm sick and tired of HTC riders pulling for Cav and Renshaw all the time, then those two leaving or getting booted from a race, only to have to ride through the rest of the race themselves. If the course has climbs and you can't climb, don't race. They are simply too lazy to change their training and riding style. Makes for really boring riding. I still remember what happened to Rogers at last year Tour de Romandie. Leaders jersey, entire team was either booted or left except 1 rider. Naturally, Rogers went from 1st to 4th overall. HTC are a horrible team in terms of their attitude and viewing enjoyment.

I always think how much better Tony Martin would do if he wasn't made to do lead-out, and whilst I don't hate Cav that much, it's annoying at last year's Vuelta how he goes on how much of a team player Peter Velits is because he's 3rd and still doing lead-out, no, it's because you ****ing made him do it. Any other year aside from 2009 where they finished in Aubenas, it would be a day for the breakaway, knowing that a climber would win on Mont Ventoux, and the final stage would go to the sprinters, but no, HTC had to be killjoys and chase the break down for Cav to win. Get ****ed.

Rants aside:

Moment of the giro? - Unfortunately the death of Wouter Weylandt, I do forgive them for showing the image of Weylandt, I think if had they knew that he was deceased then they obviously would never have shown it. And TBF they cut away very quickly.

Best win of the Giro? - Bart de Clercq aka 'Bartacus', who is this guy? He's been a professional for all of five minutes and comes from nowhere to take a stage win on a tough stage in the Giro, and holding off Scarponi and co. Not bad for a guy who started cycling 3 or 4 years ago, and is in his 3rd year of bike racing at all levels.

Best Stage of the Giro? - Stages 14 and 15, ouch

Quote of the Giro... - Cav threatening Ventoso, AC's Giro is won in the hotel, and Sean Kelly's Eye-talian moments.

Disappointment of the Giro? - BMC, ok I know nobody expected much, but this is what is wrong with making the GT organisers invite all 18 WT teams, ideally BMC would not get an invite. Denis Menchov didn't have the best of races either. If there were more TT and less hard mountains, then maybe he would of done better.

Surprise of the Giro? John Gadret and Hubert Dupont. Steven Kruijswijk gets a special mention, I really don't think more could of been expected from him, he hung in there very well. I also didn't expect Mikel Nieve to finish so high as well.

What are you looking forward to in the 2012 Giro? - Bring back the Kronplatz, Alpe d'Huez at the Giro, and hopefully that since they are starting in Denmark, they include that ultra steep hill used every year at the Tour of Denmark (my apologies to the Danish on here, the name escapes me right now).

Who did you expect more of? - Fabio Durate, although he had to drop out. José Serpa, although I think he was sick during the race.

Which riders performed beyond expectations? The aforementioned Gadret, Dupont, and Nieve. Also Pieter Weening and Oscar Gatto did a lot better then what I thought they would.

Should there have been more pan flat stages? Anyone of stages 17-19 would of been replaced by a flat stage, maybe not dead flat, but something to give the sprinters an incentive to stay in the race. I didn't think stages 17-19 were that exciting anyway.

Was the tragedy handled correctly? Yeah I would say so. AZ left it up to the riders as to whether they wanted to race to honour Weylandt, or as a memorial stage.

Should Crostis have been included? Yes, after all the extra effort they went to put safety barriers up on the corners, and plus teams would need to have been organised, and needed a mechanic or two be up there at strategic locations, or do as they do on the Zoncolan and make a DS/mechanic get on the back of a motorbike.

Overall, did the organizers do a good job? Yes and no. I think the Milan TT is a waste of time and the last minute course arrangements, and from I've been told Milan is a **** place to have a finish of a Giro. Last year's finish in Verona looked pretty awesome. But yes in how they handled the Weylandt incident, and encouraging aggressive riding but putting in a hard course.

Do you expect the other grand tours of 2011 to be better? No not really, but I won't the Tour so much as long as Andy and Alberto don't soft pedal in the mountains and ride alongside each as if they are boyfriend and girlfriend. Get a room and be done with it, FFS (not that there is anything wrong with it).

Did the awesomness of the 2010 Giro dampen this one a bit? Yes, but if it wasn't for the crash of WW, stage 4 looked interested, and stage 3 would of been a great stage as well.

 

[lancaster]

one of the more depressing HTC moments was seeing Kim Kirchen in yellow working in the sprint train, then the next day (could've been 2 it was a couple of years i i haven't checked) isolated on a very small climb (possibly with a mech) and losing the jersey.

EDIT: He lost it on hautacam so maybe a bit harsh, it might've been the day before where i felt he should've got a little support

 

[Archibald]

Good point. If you work you can't watch unless your boss lets you have a tv running. But if you do get the chance to watch it, it is at least not interrupting your sleeping patterns. When SBS showed footage on tv (they show the Tour) they only started after 11pm. Unless you do shift work, I live in a mining town, then you are not going to be able to keep it up in the long run. Somethings gotta give and for me by the last stage it did.

Footage quality from some of the LiveStreams I did note wasn't up to scratch at times, but I thought that was simply topography related with the weather adding further interruptions, things outside the control of the organisers and broadcasters. But anything is better than nothing. I was going to watch the last stage, but alas after 3 weeks and the timing, I was far too tired. I need my beauty sleep.

I have the CN ticker going all afternoon and then hope I'm not caught up in an "excessive internet usage" charge by the company. If I could confidently get away with the gazzetta feed, I would.
I then try to get home as early as possible for the eurosport highlights, which can be on from anywhere from 7pm through to midnight .

Back in Aus was easier - get home, sleep, get up for 11/11.30pm, dinner watching giro/tour/whatever race shown, then bed, then get up. When doing this for a 3 week gt, the "rest days" are godsends!

anyway, back to the reviews...

 

[Bye Bye Bicycle]

What are you looking forward to in the 2012 Giro? - Bring back the Kronplatz, Alpe d'Huez at the Giro, and hopefully that since they are starting in Denmark, they include that ultra steep hill used every year at the Tour of Denmark (my apologies to the Danish on here, the name escapes me right now).

Kiddesvej.

It's fun for the Tour of Denmark with its pretty mediocre line-ups. But a GT peloton will just rush over this without noticing that there's a hill.

 

[craig1985]

Kiddesvej.

It's fun for the Tour of Denmark with its pretty mediocre line-ups. But a GT peloton will just rush over this without noticing that there's a hill.

Not if they finish on it.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Not if they finish on it.

They won't. Kiddesvej is in the city of Vejle and stage 1 and 2 finishes in Herning while stage 3 finishes in Horsens.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

one of the more depressing HTC moments was seeing Kim Kirchen in yellow working in the sprint train, then the next day (could've been 2 it was a couple of years i i haven't checked) isolated on a very small climb (possibly with a mech) and losing the jersey.

EDIT: He lost it on hautacam so maybe a bit harsh, it might've been the day before where i felt he should've got a little support

Kirchen was 3rd leadout (maybe 2nd?) whilst in the yellow jersey on stage 8 to Toulouse (Ciolek was last man). He then held the yellow jersey on the Aspin stage won by Riccò before being dropped relatively early on Hautacam. Think he was 3rd leadout, then Hincapie 2nd.

He also sprinted for green jersey points behind Luís León Sánchez on stage 7, as he held that jersey too.

 

[craig1985]

They won't. Kiddesvej is in the city of Vejle and stage 1 and 2 finishes in Herning while stage 3 finishes in Horsens.

That sucks. You would of thought the Giro of all races would include it.

 

[Bennyl]

Big +1. IMO they are stage hunting, nothing more. Out for their own glory. I'm sick and tired of HTC riders pulling for Cav and Renshaw all the time, then those two leaving or getting booted from a race, only to have to ride through the rest of the race themselves. If the course has climbs and you can't climb, don't race. They are simply too lazy to change their training and riding style. Makes for really boring riding. I still remember what happened to Rogers at last year Tour de Romandie. Leaders jersey, entire team was either booted or left except 1 rider. Naturally, Rogers went from 1st to 4th overall. HTC are a horrible team in terms of their attitude and viewing enjoyment.

Although generally I agree, you can hardly blame the sprinters for packing their bags and going home. They were given less than an handful of opportunities and after that a 3 week race that would destroy them. I would've gone home too if I was them. They are not paid to ride in the Gruppeto, their paid to win races.

 

[greenedge]

Best wins of the Giro were for me : Capecchi and Ullisi for beating the older established guys BDQ, Gatto's and probably Ventoso's just rolling Petacchi and also Gadret's. The too many mountains are what they signed up for and replaces too many long itt's in Paris Nice. Surprises were Sistov, Anton not riding to win near the end and SK.

 

[auscyclefan94]

I am not happy

Disappointment of the Giro? - BMC, ok I know nobody expected much, but this is what is wrong with making the GT organisers invite all 18 WT teams, ideally BMC would not get an invite. Denis Menchov didn't have the best of races either. If there were more TT and less hard mountains, then maybe he would of done better.

See this post gives me the ****s big time. Craig, please tell me how the UCI and GT policy is relevant to reviewing the Giro? BMC weren't expected to do much and were described as the "worst team" in the giro yet you still mention them just to crap on about UCI policy. What a joke! You are generally a very good poster but this is an example of a blatant cheap shot. There were some other teams who did **** all.

 

[luckyboy]

Looking back on the Giro there were other teams who didn't really do anything, but BMC were the team people expected least out of beforehand.

 

[Abdel Halim]

Moment of the giro?
Regardless of the sad knews on stage 3, this would be the attack of Contador on Etna, where everybody understood they were running for second.
Best win of the Giro?
Kiryenka's one. Epic and well deserved.
Best Stage of the Giro?
From Conegliano to Gardeccia. Brutal and intense with a great win in the end.
Quote of the Giro...
Mab'araf. I don't pay attention to this.
Disappointment of the Giro?
The competition was over too soon.
Surprise of the Giro?
I wasn't expecting Contador at that level, crushing everyone everywhere. The GT leaders used to wait the last kilometers of the last clim to move and I thought it would be the same in Italy this year.
What are you looking forward to in the 2012 Giro?
A more balanced course. The number of TT kms was ridiculous. A 3 weeks race should never have less than 80km TT. Less MTFs also. It is common that too many of them bring the cyclists to have more conservative strategy and tend to reduce the show to the last climb.
Just an exemple : we all saw how Nibali made a good race on Zoncolan, holding to Contador wheel. If the finish was after the downhill of the other side of Monte Zoncolan, this stage would have been at the same level of Gardeccia, whit battle uphill AND downhill.
Who did you expect more of?
I was expecting more from Menchov, being away of the Tour this year. I was waiting to see how Duarte is doing in a GT, but it will be in september on Vuelta.
Which riders performed beyond expectations?
Kruyswik and Rujano to me.
Should there have been more pan flat stages?
Not more but better placed. It's not normal that after a 12th stage of a GT there's nothing left for sprinters.
Was the tragedy handled correctly?
I think so, yes.
Should Crostis have been included?
In absolute, yes. But giving the context of the race and the accident of Weylandt, it was better to report the climb another year.
Overall, did the organizers do a good job?
With all due respect to them, no. It been very common in last giros that between the presentation and the race the course changes. I can understand when there is a snow storm on Stelvio or a mudslide on a small road of Apennino, but it's not allways the case. The changes ont the Mercogliano stages are unexplainables. So a bit more professionalism form the organisation would be nice for the coming years.
Do you expect the other grand tours of 2011 to be better?
Depend on the riders, does it ?
Did the awesomness of the 2010 Giro dampen this one a bit?
Not for me. I wasn't expecting such a race as last year.

 

[Archibald]

See this post gives me the ****s big time. Craig, please tell me how the UCI and GT policy is relevant to reviewing the Giro? BMC weren't expected to do much and were described as the "worst team" in the giro yet you still mention them just to crap on about UCI policy. What a joke! You are generally a very good poster but this is an example of a blatant cheap shot. There were some other teams who did **** all.

why is it you completely overreact to any mention of BMC (and/or the usual suspect)??
why can't he express his opinion with out you getting into a koniption fit because he mentions BMC??

Perfectly valid point by Craig to highlight the PT policy in reviewing the Giro. It would have been far better to have a couple of ProConti teams that would have had a red-hot go than a team like BMC and others doing "star"-all... How often did we see the likes of Colnago and Farnese-Vini liven things up compared to some of the other teams?

 

[Chef_Vodnik]

This brings me to an interesting (at least to me) discussion which we could have, if we could be civil for a second.

This Giro was intense and interesting, yes. Still, I feel it would have been even better without Contador being there at all. This makes for quite the conundrum.

Contador has an exciting style and temperament which in and by itself makes it so that races sporting his presence are often exciting. He is an exciting rider who does phenomenal performances, regardless of the fact that you like him or not (same goes, to a lesser extent and in different races altogether for Cancellara, I suppose). One could therefor argue that the races in which Alberto takes part are, by definition, good and exciting to watch. I certainly had much fun watching him destroy the competition and savored every second of it.

In contrast to this, picture this years Giro without his presence. There would have been no clear dominant rider in the mountains which all the others were absolutely unable to follow on any given day unless he holds back. The duel between Scarponi and Nibali might possibly have been even more epic, as their capabilities were pretty similar and there would not have been that ONE major threat in the mountains that everyone had to keep an eye on regardless of position. The hard days in the mountains might possibly have been even harder and more epic, if that's even remotely possible.

All I'm saying is that last years Giro was slightly better in this regard as there was not a single super dominant rider. Sure, there were dominant teams (Liquigas, I'm looking at you) but all of the riders had strong points and weaknesses. Which is also why I don't think that this years tour would be "dull" in absence of Contador, also proclaimed to be a Schleck-show. The fact of the matter is that Schleck has a weakness, something Contador does not appear to have, somehow.

So, thoughts?

 

[The Hitch]

This brings me to an interesting (at least to me) discussion which we could have, if we could be civil for a second.

This Giro was intense and interesting, yes. Still, I feel it would have been even better without Contador being there at all. This makes for quite the conundrum.

Contador has an exciting style and temperament which in and by itself makes it so that races sporting his presence are often exciting. He is an exciting rider who does phenomenal performances, regardless of the fact that you like him or not (same goes, to a lesser extent and in different races altogether for Cancellara, I suppose). One could therefor argue that the races in which Alberto takes part are, by definition, good and exciting to watch. I certainly had much fun watching him destroy the competition and savored every second of it.

In contrast to this, picture this years Giro without his presence. There would have been no clear dominant rider in the mountains which all the others were absolutely unable to follow on any given day unless he holds back. The duel between Scarponi and Nibali might possibly have been even more epic, as their capabilities were pretty similar and there would not have been that ONE major threat in the mountains that everyone had to keep an eye on regardless of position. The hard days in the mountains might possibly have been even harder and more epic, if that's even remotely possible.

All I'm saying is that last years Giro was slightly better in this regard as there was not a single super dominant rider. Sure, there were dominant teams (Liquigas, I'm looking at you) but all of the riders had strong points and weaknesses. Which is also why I don't think that this years tour would be "dull" in absence of Contador, also proclaimed to be a Schleck-show. The fact of the matter is that Schleck has a weakness, something Contador does not appear to have, somehow.

So, thoughts?

The"Giro would have been better with Contador" idea is one that has been promoted by many of us before during and after the Giro.

From the moment the route was announced, I was salivating at the idea of Anton vs Ricco vs Scarponi vs Nibali vs Rujano. Of those riders most are equally matched, and they have only 1 grand tour between them and no Giros.

The idea that they would fight it out for a Giro title on that course was fascinating.

Moreover, there would be no favourite. In a poll, people were undecided as to who would win ( I passionately argued Scarponi would beat Nibali)

The Giro stage was perfectly set for that battle.

Of course it wasnt just Contador that ruined it. Firstly one of the protagonists was withdrawn not just from the Giro but likely from cycling. Then Menchov was forced in by the Tour invites meaning that the field would have a former winner, while the previously expected battle had guaranteed a maiden victor.

Finally Contador joined and, imo neutralised the brilliance of the course.

He brought with him other advantages. Cyclings biggest name at what is for many fans their favourite race.
Pride at the fact that the face of cycling cares so much and gives so much respect to the Giro which had been so pathetically lacking during the Armstrong years.
A better TDF perhaps, with questions as to whether he can recover.
The sight of Contador fighting the brutal mountains and of course riding away from some of the best GT riders around.

But personally I would have preferred the every man for himself battle. People going for riskier attacks as they would be fighting for an overall not for second. The intrigue as to who would win. Nibali actually able to use descents as a weapon rather than a way of getting Contador angry. Constant looking forward to the Milan tt wondering who would gain time and how much.

All on one of the most difficult courses ever designed. Unfortunately, Zoncolan, Etna, Grossglockner, the 5 muscuteers of stage 15 and Finestre didnt get to host a gt showdown and it will be a while before we see such a course again.

 

[DISTRICT 9]

It was a great race in a great country with a very unmatched, poor field.
I would say due to the difficulty of the Giro, many stayed away, a death sentence to Tour ambitions.
I would say, if the race were only Contador and Saxo and Astana it would have been more competitive.

 

[The Hitch]

It was a great race in a great country with a very unmatched, poor field.
I would say due to the difficulty of the Giro, many stayed away, a death sentence to Tour ambitions.
I would say, if the race were only Contador and Saxo and Astana it would have been more competitive.

I dont see who stayed away from the Giro because of its difficulty. everyone knows full well by now that if all you care about is the Tour, you dont ride the Giro.

All those big contenders that did stay away would have done so regardless of how hard the Giro was. And even if they had come, they wouldnt have competed anyway, so unless what you want is purely big names, and feel that Cav, Contador, Farrar, Menchov, Sastre, Nibali, Petacchi etc is not enough, it wouldnt really make much of a difference.

The race had a top field and its a shame to see so many people acting like Contador beat Chris Horner and Ryder Hejsdal. Nibali and Scarponi beat an on form Evans last year. In the Tour they would be challenging everyone else for that final podium spot, together with Menchov of course.