Giro d'Italia Giro D'Italia 2025 Stage 9: Gubbio – Siena (181km)

[Unchained]

I disagree. If you're a real champion, you don't sit for 15km on some youngsters wheel, just to out sprint him at the end.

Wise Wout watched others wilt from Del Toro jumping multiple times, he burned off everyone except for Van Aert, radio giving him gap information, Wout didn't need to look back over his shoulder once, clearly established that it was 2 up and if Del Toro allowed him to sprint he would beat the skinny 21 year old. The mistake was made, just like all Del Toro mistakes this week was sprinting and not jumping from further out. He says so!!

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=in13TbcSIIY&pp=ygUVaXNhYWMgZGVsIHRvcm8gZmluaXNo

 

[HashRouge]

whose Brandon ? that Brian Smith translated that Bernal said was the strongest

Rivera. He was the one pushing in the break with Bernal.

 

[Boehmand]

Because he was never off the front for 15 kms which is frankly even worse

That's not quite true, he took several wins in reduced groups/breaks.

But to claim he was not a master wheelsucker (and fair play to him) is insane

 

[Blanco]

Because he was never off the front for 15 kms which is frankly even worse

No ***, he never was? Go watch Strade in 2015 on these same roads. And 2014, 2018, 2022.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Besides stage racing history is rich with cases of one rider sacrificing his stage win chances in order to go full gas to the line to gain time on rivals that have been distanced. Del Toro could have soft pedaled a while and tried to save enough to drop Van Aert on the final climb, he probably still would have Pink by about a half minute or so.

 

[Cycling111]

If you blame WVA for wheelsucking in this scenario, you simply do not understand cycling. And I know you do. Its laughable to critisize Wout for that. Was a great win, especially after the injury and other setbacks and all his 2nds this year.

But we know that criticism is often based on the jersey or the rider's name.
If today Wout is Del Toro and Del Toro is Wout, they would be saying nice things to Del Toro .
A UAE beating Van Aert like this sets social media on fire.

There's a lot of hypocrisy. I agree with what you're saying, but depending on the name of the wheel-sucker, and the name of the person who lost because of the wheel-sucker, they don't usually take anything into consideration (injuries...).

 

[Mayomaniac]

Btw, I was the first one to mention Del Toro on this forum (during and after the 2023 Tour of Sibiu), so where is my contract as a talent scout for a WT team? If LR can get payed by a big WT team the bar seems to be low enough...

 

[Netserk]

One would think that resting Moscon or Tratnik yesterday by having them ride grupetto instead of doing the donkey work would be common sense, but nope...

One thing you have to handle to Ineos is that the whole team rested up yesterday with today in mind.

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

Find me one, and I will take back everything I said.

Dauphiné Libéré Final: Valverde wins to give UCI a headache

Controversial Spaniard now tops UCI world rankings

road.cc

If you blame WVA for wheelsucking in this scenario, you simply do not understand cycling. And I know you do. Its laughable to critisize Wout for that. Was a great win, especially after the injury and other setbacks and all his 2nds this year.

His entire premise is that Wout is the first major rider to ever sit on a wheel and then come around at the end to win. It's a bizarre premise, to say the least.

 

[Unchained]

WTF?

I'm disagreeing with the poster who is complaining that van Aert didn't ride like a champion because he didn't collaborate with del Toro.

I'm saying that van Aert would have been an idiot if he had rode like the poster is demanding him to, because he would both increase his chances of winning and his team's by riding like he did today in order to win the stage.

Both Del Toro and Van Aert both said the same thing, Del Toro told him to pull through, Wout said no ,I can't use any horsepower to pull you further into the lead, further in front of my teammate.. Del Toro completely cool with the situation, understanding totally that Wout couldn't help at the cost of Visma teammate. And information that Wout used was spot on , Simon Yates ended up rolling through with a great ride, 5th place on the day. Maybe people have not been paying attention to all these Van Aert F- up videos, not listening to Wout about Wout!!

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-TQ4iMyjA2s&pp=ygUNV291dCBWYW4gQWVydA%3D%3D

I think I have heard Van Aert say the word " mistake " to describe his racing over a dozen times this year... Not today!!

 

[HashRouge]

I think if anyone will be really disappointed after today it'll be Ineos.

Bernal was so so close to an incredible time gain and coup but it all went backwards at the end.

I'm really gutted for Bernal. Ineos had great tactics but luck really wasn't on their side. Had Arensman not had that mechanical and stayed with the front group, or had they had two different riders in the break who were willing to work a bit, things might have gone much better for them.

 

[HashRouge]

Both Del Toro and Van Aert both said the same thing, Del Toro told him to pull through, Wout said no ,I can't use any horsepower to pull you further into the lead, further in front of my teammate.. Del Toro completely cool with the situation, understanding totally that Wout couldn't help at the cost of Visma teammate. And information that Wout used was spot on , Simon Yates ended up rolling through with a great ride, 5th place on the day. Maybe people have not been paying attention to all these Van Aert F- up videos, not listening to Wout about Wout!!

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-TQ4iMyjA2s&pp=ygUNV291dCBWYW4gQWVydA%3D%3D

I think I have heard Van Aert say the word " mistake " to describe his racing over a dozen times this year... Not today!!

I also think it's a bit rich for people to complain about WvA sitting on when del Toro also benefitted from being able to sit on the Ineos pair for ages (and yes, I am salty because Ineos's plan didn't quite come off).

 

[Blanco]

Dauphiné Libéré Final: Valverde wins to give UCI a headache

Controversial Spaniard now tops UCI world rankings

road.cc

His entire premise is that Wout is the first major rider to ever sit on a wheel and then come around at the end to win. It's a bizarre premise, to say the least.

Yes, first to sit for that long on only one riders wheel. But then again, Wout is not really such major rider, so I maybe shouldn't be that surprised.
And what example did you find, Valverde marking Evans in Dauphine? That should be the same like this one today?! Try again.

 

[Andre]

Yes, absolutely, 100%.

You wouldn't have been happy if he'd won under any scenario, so why pretend your take has anything to do with anything else but hatred of a rider.

excellent post

 

[Oldman]

Deserved how? Didn't put his nose in the wind once till last 300m, Del Toro dragged him for 15km's. I thought I'd be happy when he wins, after all misfortune he had, but I'm not. This is not the way the great riders win.

It can be the way a Pro rider has to win. In retrospect a win is a win however diabolical.

 

[Andre]

Well, I can't remember any of the greats winning like this...

...but now you will remember today

 

[TastyGroceries]

I'm really gutted for Bernal. Ineos had great tactics but luck really wasn't on their side. Had Arensman not had that mechanical and stayed with the front group, or had they had two different riders in the break who were willing to work a bit, things might have gone much better for them.

I wouldn't say luck wasn't on their side. Sure it was unfortunate that they did so much work for no results at all, but they first got into this position thanks to a crash behind and the misfortune of others (+ Del Toro pushing like crazy not realizing at first only Ineos + Van Aert are following). In the end they were neither particularly lucky nor unlucky

 

[Blanco]

...but now you will remember today

On the contrary...

 

[Unchained]

But we know that criticism is often based on the jersey or the rider's name.
If today Wout is Del Toro and Del Toro is Wout, they would be saying nice things to Del Toro .
A UAE beating Van Aert like this sets social media on fire.

There's a lot of hypocrisy. I agree with what you're saying, but depending on the name of the wheel-sucker, and the name of the person who lost because of the wheel-sucker, they don't usually take anything into consideration (injuries...).

But how many times can Del Toro and Van Aert in harmony say, Wout had to ride the Toro tow truck because if he pulled through, he would be putting more time into his own teammate, Simon Yates who finished with an excellent 5th place today. Why would Wout do something to help multiple UAE GC contenders against his own team? Doesn't make racing sense. You don't drag Del Toro faster, you don't increase possible deficit between Ayuso and other Yates, just because. That would be really, really stupid, f-c%ing racing!! Just not done by pros especially, guys with 50 pro wins!! If you are doing an office park crit you can drag people around for the fun of it, 3 week race where every second can make a difference, you don't do stupid sh&t

 

[OWIOWI]

If you blame WVA for wheelsucking in this scenario, you simply do not understand cycling. And I know you do. Its laughable to critisize Wout for that. Was a great win, especially after the injury and other setbacks and all his 2nds this year.

Van Aert apologised for not working with Del Toro throughout the final kilometres.

"I have to say [Del Toro] did such an amazing ride. I felt a bit *** to not pull too much with him, because obviously he's also a competitor for my teammate, Simon Yates, and had to leave the work to him.

"Hij heeft geweldig gereden", steekt onze landgenoot de loftrompet voor de renner van UAE. "Ik moest tegen mijn natuur in koersen vandaag. Ik wil echt proficiat zeggen tegen Isaac. Hij rijdt een prachtige koers en wordt beloond met de roze trui."

1. Van Aert himself did not feel all too good with his way of riding the last 15 k's. "I had to ride against my nature" (tranlation of the quote in Flemish), that says all.

2. This is exactly, what I meant with my post. This was no longer the Van Aert of old times. And if you like that, it is perfectly your right to do so. I do not.

3. His statement tells us, that he was not cooked but riding in favour of Simon Yates. I simply do not buy this. He was just sitting on Del Toros wheel with the intention to save his own race, not the one of Yates. This is his right to do so, but it is not a nice way to win. At least in my opinion. And it is unlogic too. Because he must have known, that Del Toro is not UAE's man for the overall victory. Above all, as Ayuso was sitting in the next group.

 

[Red Rick]

Watching Vacek on the first 9 stages, makes me wonder why you would think the was "super low %" to take the stage.

He's a top quality rider, almost as strong as Pedersen but a better climber.

- And Lidl's DS seems to agree with me

Because you burn all your matches closing a gap like that solo, and because the finish always favors a lighter rider.

DS's #1 job is to be a former rider who is confidently wrong every day.

 

[Netserk]

He literally said he wasn't proud to do it but he had no choice.

And whether or not he should be proud was not what was being discussed.

I think it's a big shame that he wasn't proud of that. It's much more honourable to ride strategically sound with the aim for the victory than to mindlessly trade pulls.

Time to be more like Rui Costa, Wout.

 

[Red Rick]

I think it's a big shame that he wasn't proud of that. It's much more honourable to ride strategically sound with the aim for the victory than to mindlessly trade pulls.

Time to be more like Rui Costa, Wout.

Current crop of riders making me worship Rui Costa what is this timeline

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

1. Van Aert himself did not feel all too good with his way of riding the last 15 k's. "I had to ride against my nature" (tranlation of the quote in Flemish), that says all.

2. This is exactly, what I meant with my post. This was no longer the Van Aert of old times. And if you like that, it is perfectly your right to do so. I do not.

3. His statement tells us, that he was not cooked but riding in favour of Simon Yates. I simply do not buy this. He was just sitting on Del Toros wheel with the intention to save his own race, not the one of Yates. This is his right to do so, but it is not a nice way to win. At least in my opinion. And it is unlogic too. Because he must have known, that Del Toro is not UAE's man for the overall victory. Above all, as Ayuso was sitting in the next group.

This I agree with, as Wout carries his condition on his face, and he was hurting, and Del Toro clearly felt great.

But to suggest that he should have ridden in a way that would have made his win less likely, is strange. He rode how he had to, to win. He said so himself...and last time any of us checked, winning was the purpose of riding, for team and rider.

As a fan, it was nice to see him win. I don't really care if he had to bite his stem, and stay 2mm's away from Del Toro's wheel to do so.

 

[Blanco]

3. His statement tells us, that he was not cooked but riding in favour of Simon Yates. I simply do not buy this. He was just sitting on Del Toros wheel with the intention to save his own race, not the one of Yates. This is his right to do so, but it is not a nice way to win. At least in my opinion. And it is unlogic too. Because he must have known, that Del Toro is not UAE's man for the overall victory. Above all, as Ayuso was sitting in the next group.

Exactly.