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Giro Stage 9: Milano

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Mellow Velo said:
Must be my imagination, all those parked cars in Flanders, Gent-Wevelgem, Amstel.......
....I look forward to seeing most of next year's classics getting neutralised.

You are not really comparing cars on an open classic course to what we saw today? - Come on Mellow you seem to know something about bike racing that's not the same thing at all ;)
 
The Piazza Cavour that they cross right to left:

piazzacavour.jpg
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Why didn't they neutralize the results? All finishing first? Lame that they complain of the dangers yet actually race it after all? I don't get it, the fact that they raced it anyway says to me they lost (the riders).
 
May 17, 2009
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Eddy Mercxx described the descent of the Kemmelburg in Gent Wevelgem as the most dangerous place in cycling.......I doubt that he would replace that with any road junctions in Milan! Today I watched RAI3 for 1 1/2 hours of the clubrun wondering what was going on ! When Eurosport finally stopped showing touring cars crashing we gathered what had happened.......I was not impressed. On this basis City Centre Criteriums are history.....!
 
I read somewhere that one of the complaints was that there was actual traffic moving on the opposite side of the street moving in the opposite direction on some sections.

Also that it was a segment of the peloton's intention that since the stage had been neutralized that they were going to allow the Rabobank team to cross the line first in unison to show support for Horillo but some of the sprinter's teams began to ramp up the pace near the end in anticipation of the sprint thus making all that transpired earlier in the stage and the intentions thereof, meaningless and defeating the purpose.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Angliru said:
I read somewhere that one of the complaints was that there was actual traffic moving on the opposite side of the street moving in the opposite direction on some sections.

Also that it was a segment of the peloton's intention that since the stage had been neutralized that they were going to allow the Rabobank team to cross the line first in unison to show support for Horillo but some of the sprinter's teams began to ramp up the pace near the end in anticipation of the sprint thus making all that transpired earlier in the stage and the intentions thereof, meaningless and defeating the purpose.

Rabobank declined that offer to cross the finish line first. They did not want to become part of a political game played out between certain teams and race organizers, and 'use' Horillo to side with one camp.

Anyway, street crits are boring and unecessary (especially in a GT). They have nothing to do with racing, and are merely a way of bringing riders closer to the general public in a parade or celebratory form. The only reasons for their historical existence are convencience of organizing a local race in a small town or city. Organizers don't have to fence of a long route, hence the pejorative denomination of "Kermiskoers". Secondly, because it's easier to draw a lot of spectators, who will be seeing a lot of riders they admire, multiple times. Contrary to the "swoooosh... gone.. was that di Luca?" exeperience.

I am glad they neutralized it, and next time, no organizer should even contemplate putting it on the calendar as an official race/stage.

Zomegnan agreed with the riders, because he had neutralized the race before it actually started. He only got furious when some riders ecided to make a 'public point' by stopping half way and holding a speech...
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Bala Verde said:
Anyway, street crits are boring and unecessary (especially in a GT). They have nothing to do with racing, and are merely a way of bringing riders closer to the general public in a parade or celebratory form.
Actually they do have to do with racing, and are part of the tradition. Paris for Tour, Milan for the Giro. As this year they completely changed the Giro route, they felt they had to "reward" Milan with a Sunday circuit.

About safety, a circuit provides the riders with the possibility of previewing the route to the finish line, learning the turns and tricky parts in the first laps.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Leopejo said:
Actually they do have to do with racing, and are part of the tradition. Paris for Tour, Milan for the Giro. As this year they completely changed the Giro route, they felt they had to "reward" Milan with a Sunday circuit.

About safety, a circuit provides the riders with the possibility of previewing the route to the finish line, learning the turns and tricky parts in the first laps.

Yes, they are part of the cycling tradition, but that does not mean they have anything to with racing (as in competition). As I said before, organizers used them to show off riders, and gather a lot of people together, without having to go through the trouble of fencing off long stretches of roads.

That's the cycling tradition the organizers are refering to and that's why they held it in Milan, where normally the Giro would end, in a celebratory fashion. Their intention of yesterday's stage was to honour that tradition, and by doing so reinforcing the conceptual foundations of a crit, namely to draw an even bigger crowd and showing off riders on a circular track. The historicality of the kermiskoers was thus used for even bigger exposure, and hence very true to the basics of a crit.
 
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Bala Verde said:
Yes, they are part of the cycling tradition, but that does not mean they have anything to with racing (as in competition).
I fail to see how they would be less racing than a point-to-point sprinters' race.
 
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Leopejo said:
I fail to see how they would be less racing than a point-to-point sprinters' race.

1) Crit = Kermiskoers: (Transl) 'race held secondary to a fair'
2) When pros show up at crits or kermiskoersen, the winner is often determined beforehand, for the entertainment and spectacle of the public. Pros show up for fat 'premies' or fees, commonly after good results in GTs, to cash in on their fame.
3) Since it's difficult to get a permission to organize a 'normal' race from a A-B (fencing off/infrastructure/regulations) as compared to a crit, a crit is commonly used as an event for junior riders or amateurs.

On top of that, when the organizers seem to be more interested in promoting the historical city of Milan (and for its inclusion in the centenary Giro as a starting/finishing place, the city of Milan pays a hefty fee) while it apparently supercedes their concern for the rider's safety, I think it has no place in a GT.

Hence, as is the essence of a crit/kermiskoers, spectacle takes priority over racing.

But that's my opinion ;)
 
May 13, 2009
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Bala Verde said:
2) When pros show up at crits or kermiskoersen, the winner is often determined beforehand, for the entertainment and spectacle of the public. Pros show up for fat 'premies' or fees, commonly after good results in GTs, to cash in on their fame.
The shoe fits. So, why does Armstrong complain?
 
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Bala Verde said:
1) Crit = Kermiskoers: (Transl) 'race held secondary to a fair'
2) When pros show up at crits or kermiskoersen, the winner is often determined beforehand, for the entertainment and spectacle of the public. Pros show up for fat 'premies' or fees, commonly after good results in GTs, to cash in on their fame.
3) Since it's difficult to get a permission to organize a 'normal' race from a A-B (fencing off/infrastructure/regulations) as compared to a crit, a crit is commonly used as an event for junior riders or amateurs.
A kermesse as they are known here (there will be plenty of them after the Giro, but they are still becoming fewer and fewer) is quite different from a Giro circuit...

On top of that, when the organizers seem to be more interested in promoting the historical city of Milan (and for its inclusion in the centenary Giro as a starting/finishing place, the city of Milan pays a hefty fee) while it apparently supercedes their concern for the rider's safety, I think it has no place in a GT.
This is debatable. Whether you want it or not, every GT stage promotes the start and finish places. They pay a lot of money to get into these GTs. Still the distinction between "spectacular", "technical" and "dangerous" is difficult to make. Many riders in the peloton would have raced. And the sprinters' teams *did* actually race with an average near 50 km/h in the last laps. If there hadn't been those wet dangerous descents on stages 6 and 7, and if Horrillo didn't crash in stage 8, I am not sure they'd have protested.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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Regardless off all this the riders are unprofessional and soft.
So much for the CSC boot camp, never I have been so embarrassed to be a cyclist.
The sponsors, fans and race organisers never mind the City of Milan have been let down by a load of lambs led by a few old bits of mutton who act like Prima Donna's.
You watch the Moto Gp at LeMans in the rain and the Northwest 200 road motorcycle race live all day on the BBC internet then that load of crap at Milan. What a farce.
I suppose it is the riders choice but I hope they enjoy my comments and slagging!
 
Mar 10, 2009
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I wonder if Rotterdam prologue will feature some tram tracks when they organise the start of the TdF. :D

It's already difficult for old pieces of junk city bikes to deal with these guys at 20k/h and fat wheels, even knowing the area (anyone ever jumped tram tracks in Amsterdam;). I can only hypothesise how difficult it is when you are doing 30-50k/h on tubes, not knowing the track as second nature.

From the fact that they went 50k/h at the end of the stage you can't logically conlcude that it wasn't dangerous. In the end you are in the Giro and if you drop out/refuse to ride, you lose (time) regardless. The caravane never stops, not even when someone dies.

On top of that, happy debating with Zomegnan and (many) of the riders, because apparently they did find it too dangerous. Zomegnan neutralized the stage, after lap 1 or 2, or even before the race, because he agreed. The only issue he had, was that riders stopped midway in protest, as he thought he had succesfully dealt with their grievances.

Good to see that forum posters have a better understanding of the racing conditions then those who race daily...:rolleyes:
 
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Bala Verde said:
On top of that, happy debating with Zomegnan and (many) of the riders, because apparently they did find it too dangerous. Zomegnan neutralized the stage, after lap 1 or 2, or even before the race, because he agreed. The only issue he had, was that riders stopped midway in protest, as he thought he had succesfully dealt with their grievances.
It wasn't Zomegnan but the one who drives before the race on a red car. He explicitly stated that it depended on the previous stages.
 
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Leopejo said:
It wasn't Zomegnan but the one who drives before the race on a red car. He explicitly stated that it depended on the previous stages.

Good point! That statement made the 'ode to the Kermesse' really a lot less dangerous...
 
A

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Quicksilver said:
Regardless off all this the riders are unprofessional and soft.
So much for the CSC boot camp, never I have been so embarrassed to be a cyclist.

what makes you such a stud to make a comment like that? just who are you to make a judgement like that on some of the toughest atheletes in the world?
my guess is that you'd have wet yourself on that stage 7 decent and gone home.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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Okay Jackass sorry I mean hammer for expressing an opinion please accept my sincere and humble apologies for any offence to all those of you offended, concerned, annoyed and upset and H&S obsessive. I promise never to do it again

I hardly think your childish abuse is nessecary though you must have one serious chip. Raced Motorcycles and bikes at a high level so your nappy/ incontinence talk is pointless I presume it is your weakness.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Mellow Velo said:
Basso has now apologised for the farce

HA, Basso, what a courage! Wasn't he also the first cyclist who cracked instantly, squealed like piglet, and admitted guilt when it became clear he had something to do with OP and was faced with public humiliation, condemnation and disgust ... :D

he is such an opportunist haha :D
 
May 18, 2009
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go slow in milano

Good on ya-- Basso -- glad somebody realises the joke on the sport-- all this is banter is more fun than the racing thank god for a bit of wit and **** taking-

I wasted money on the train travelling to the race never mind walking a half a lap-- the circut was a bit mad but dangerous no-- glad the cafes were good --the crowd was really ****ed off -- we all tried to get a mexican wave going -- the cameras missed the streaker --

-great slagging by the race bossman --the shorter the legs the bigger the mouth -- da lucy no doubt -- the giro i luv it-- crazy latins --more fun than the swiss i work with --
steady dennis m to win --lancalot to finish and da lucy to throw his rattle out
 

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