Gran Fondo Hincapie (Feat. Lance)

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sorry DW, but I really think it's been clear over the past decade that Frankie's done the time for his 'crime' - far more than his fair share compared to the likes of those participating in Senor Lapdog's charity ride.
If he gets some media gigs after all this time to help pay the bills then good for him. I'm sure some of the reason for that is being a former pro rider rather than as a notorious doper from LA's previous team.
And it's not like he's being showered with endorsements. Not that I've seen him swanning about in GH sportswear on any billboards lately...
 
thehog said:
"We will preserve and protect lifelong dopers who stopped doping in 2006".

It's hardly worth worrying about it. But USADA needs to send a message.
It's not usada's job. The nado acts at the direction of the sports federation. Who just so happen to embrace doping at all costs.

If usada does nothing, it's because the federation didn't direct them. Which, is not wada compliant. That's all.
 
Dear Wiggo said:
No, I didn't read some random book by some random author.
Well, Phil Gaimon is a working WT pro... Until jv fired him. Very, very likely clean.

Frankie and Betsy are still on the wrong end of doing the right thing. This is the cost of doing the right thing.

Thom and Lance still likely punishing them.:mad:
 
Jun 30, 2012
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Granville57 said:
Ya' can't make this sport up. :D
No you cannot make this stuff up. The willingness of current riders to associate with the cheats just goes to show that a high level of intelligence or a strongly developed set of morals aren't pre-requisite for a careers in pro-cycling. C'mon guys. Show some balls. Tell them what you think of their lying, their cheating, their stealing and their fraud. Be prepared to say "if they show up, I'm going home".
 
Nov 2, 2013
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Granville57 said:
Forget about all the old, retired dopers for a moment.

Could USADA warn off the likes of Tejay and some of the other young, "new generation" brainiacs from showing up?
January 20/14 11:32 am - Sebastian Salas Suspended for 2 Years

Posted by Editor on 01/20/14

The Canadian Centre for Ethics in Sport (CCES) announced today that Sebastian Salas, a cycling athlete, has received a two-year sanction for an anti-doping rule violation. The violation, Tampering with Doping Control, occurred during in-competition testing on July 10, 2013. [Note: This was the day of the Gastown GP]
In response to the CCES’ notification of the violation, Mr. Salas fully explored his rights under the Canadian Anti-Doping Program (CADP) and eventually chose to admit the doping control violation, waive his right to a hearing, and accept a two-year sanction ending August 1, 2015. The athlete, who resides in Vancouver, British Columbia, is ineligible to participate in any capacity with any sport signatory to the CADP, including training with teammates.
http://http://www.canadiancyclist.com/dailynews.php?id=27031

This was a fairly recent communication from an ADA, so as I interpret this communication and relate it to the TGV situation, Lance should not be training with USAC athletes like TJV, and the opposite, TVG should be avoiding working with a banned athlete as a coach or training partner. I just read an article from another sport case and coaches cant be banned for taking a PED, but if they have in posession, distribute, traffick PED's they can be banned. So with the USADA RD http://http://www.usada.org/lance-armstrong-receives-lifetime-ban-and-disqualification-of-competitive-results-for-doping-violations-stemming-from-his-involvement-in-the-united-states-postal-service-pro-cycling-team-doping-conspi/there appears no room for an athlete under WADA jurisdiction to be working/training with Lance under any circumstance.

USADA:''Mr. Armstrong has received a lifetime period of ineligibility for his numerous anti-doping rule violations, including his involvement in trafficking and administering doping products to others. A lifetime period of ineligibility as described in the Code prevents Mr. Armstrong from participating in any activity (eg training/coaching?) or competition organized by any signatory to the Code or any member of any signatory (TJV).''

I'd guess TJV absolutely should be given a public warning/one strike by USADA.
 
winkybiker said:
No you cannot make this stuff up. The willingness of current riders to associate with the cheats just goes to show that a high level of intelligence or a strongly developed set of morals aren't pre-requisite for a careers in pro-cycling. C'mon guys. Show some balls. Tell them what you think of their lying, their cheating, their stealing and their fraud. Be prepared to say "if they show up, I'm going home".
Wow I would love to see this happen.
Sadly it never will.
 
Sep 29, 2012
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Archibald said:
sorry DW, but I really think it's been clear over the past decade that Frankie's done the time for his 'crime' - far more than his fair share compared to the likes of those participating in Senor Lapdog's charity ride.
If he gets some media gigs after all this time to help pay the bills then good for him. I'm sure some of the reason for that is being a former pro rider rather than as a notorious doper from LA's previous team.
And it's not like he's being showered with endorsements. Not that I've seen him swanning about in GH sportswear on any billboards lately...
Another one completely misreading or misrepresenting my post.

If you can't see "I don't care if he gets something from it" in my post perhaps some lessons in reading are in order?

Does he get something yes or no?

There's no judging here (that's the bit where I say, "without prejudice").

Another white knight defending something that is not an attack.

Sorry you read it that way.
I'll copy and paste this for all the other white knighters.

ETA: at a guess - if he was getting nothing, it'd be really easy to say that, right? You're at least entertaining the thought that he may be deriving some value. So you and Eliza are both in your defensiveness answering the question but I would prefer a straight answer all the same.
 
winkybiker said:
No you cannot make this stuff up. The willingness of current riders to associate with the cheats just goes to show that a high level of intelligence or a strongly developed set of morals aren't pre-requisite for a careers in pro-cycling. C'mon guys. Show some balls. Tell them what you think of their lying, their cheating, their stealing and their fraud. Be prepared to say "if they show up, I'm going home".
Indeed. You have to wonder what CVV is doing at this event.

How did this guy stay at Garmin?

I asked Vande Velde how much credence anyone could give to Landis' allegations and confession to having been a big-time doper, given that he had spent hundreds of thousands of dollars in denying he had used performance-enhancing drugs after the positive test at the 2006 Tour.

``You're not going to believe too much of it, that's for sure,'' Vande Velde said. ``It has been a long stream of lies. I'd like to say I was surprised, but nothing about Floyd surprises me any more.''
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Dear Wiggo said:
Another one completely misreading or misrepresenting my post.

If you can't see "I don't care if he gets something from it" in my post perhaps some lessons in reading are in order?

Does he get something yes or no?

There's no judging here (that's the bit where I say, "without prejudice").

Another white knight defending something that is not an attack.

Sorry you read it that way.
I'll copy and paste this for all the other white knighters.

ETA: at a guess - if he was getting nothing, it'd be really easy to say that, right? You're at least entertaining the thought that he may be deriving some value. So you and Eliza are both in your defensiveness answering the question but I would prefer a straight answer all the same.
Ahh, of course. Anyone who thinks your absurd questions are absurd gets labeled a "White Night". :rolleyes:

The reality is you made two silly claims in your question. Frankie is not in the "cycling media a lot". Ask a cycling journalist, Frankie's primary response to an interview request is "No".

Frankie's "Business Interests"? Every team he has run has told him to be quite, and that is what he does. A couple quotes, an article or two. Not much else. Betsy however is rolling in money. She has likely has made enough to buy a bigger stick to beat Frankie with.

Yeah, spinning it like Frankie is making $$$ of this is funny but most here can see it is nonsense.
 
zigmeister said:
USAC isn't the sanctioning/controlling organization of any Fun rides. They provide insurance. No licensing by cyclist are required.

Hence, there is no competition as far as they are concerned.

USAC just wants to get their piece of the money collected, provide the insurance and move on.

Not that I'm going to any Fondo anytime soon...kind of a meaningless event.

We got a local training crit every week during the summer...besides the newly inflated price to cover the insurance via USAC, I don't see anybody scanning the list of riders before the whistle blows to see who is actually a licensed USAC cyclist. Oh, but you can use the crits as points towards upgrades as and education/training seminar or what that nonsense is they offer in the system.

Really need to put these things in writing and specify clearly what is what when it comes to events, types etc..
USAC isn't the organising body for the vast majority of races in the US, that's a red herring.

It is organised by a USAC affiliated (and hence UCI) club - the Greenville Spinners, and all USAC affiliated clubs are bound by the WADA code. It's a condition of their membership and affiliation.

Hincape's fondo also has a permit from USAC (Permit Number: 2014-2821) and they advertise one day licences for it (entries now closed).
http://www.usacycling.org/events/?state=SC
 
Dear Wiggo said:
Another one completely misreading or misrepresenting my post.

If you can't see "I don't care if he gets something from it" in my post perhaps some lessons in reading are in order?

Does he get something yes or no?

There's no judging here (that's the bit where I say, "without prejudice").

Another white knight defending something that is not an attack.

Sorry you read it that way.
I'll copy and paste this for all the other white knighters.

ETA: at a guess - if he was getting nothing, it'd be really easy to say that, right? You're at least entertaining the thought that he may be deriving some value. So you and Eliza are both in your defensiveness answering the question but I would prefer a straight answer all the same.
seriously??
you don't care, but ask anyway...
does he get anything? that's pretty obvious already, so why even ask? It's not like it's not well known already...

you're just baiting now, which is pretty much what I reckon you were doing in the first place...
name calling too? Hi-ho Silver!!
 
Alex Simmons/RST said:
USAC isn't the organising body for the vast majority of races in the US, that's a red herring.

It is organised by a USAC affiliated (and hence UCI) club - the Greenville Spinners, and all USAC affiliated clubs are bound by the WADA code. It's a condition of their membership and affiliation.

Hincape's fondo also has a permit from USAC (Permit Number: 2014-2821) and they advertise one day licences for it (entries now closed).
http://www.usacycling.org/events/?state=SC
Thanks. Good information.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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We need to start a poll. Will lance ride?

I am saying no.......but will blame it on too much fun the night before. The dude is a rolling party
 
MarkvW said:
Is a gran fondo a competition?
Mass participation. Some have prize money and there is a "race pen" up the front.

Here I don't think that's the case. Can you stop a rider, riding on public roads? I guess you can attempt to sanction the event? But you can't stop a group of people with local permission, riding on a road.

Tough call to make.
 
Aug 10, 2010
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thehog said:
Mass participation. Some have prize money and there is a "race pen" up the front.

Here I don't think that's the case. Can you stop a rider, riding on public roads? I guess you can attempt to sanction the event? But you can't stop a group of people with local permission, riding on a road.

Tough call to make.
As I read it, Lance is barred from "competing" in UCI events.
 
MarkvW said:
As I read it, Lance is barred from "competing" in UCI events.
True. Here the UCI is not interested. It appears USADA is on a crusade to stop him "riding" (as from racing). But USAC will have to make the call. USADA in this situation appears not to have jurisdiction to withdrawal a rider.

Then what to do with the non-sanctioned riders if Armstrong rides. Can they be withdrawn or sanctioned?
 
Sep 29, 2012
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Archibald said:
seriously??
you don't care, but ask anyway...
does he get anything? that's pretty obvious already, so why even ask? It's not like it's not well known already...

you're just baiting now, which is pretty much what I reckon you were doing in the first place...
name calling too? Hi-ho Silver!!
dafuq? I do not even know what Frankie does for a job. I could go google it but as his partner is RIGHT HERE I thought I'd ask her.

Baiting? Bvll****.

I don't care IF HE GAINS ADVANTAGE FROM IT. Not, "I don't care about the answer". If I didn't care about the answer I wouldn't ask the friggin' question now, would I? DUH.

No wait. If he makes something from it then GOOD. I am GLAD. About time someone who did the right thing got something out of the mess that is cycling.

White knighting is when someone rides on on their white horse to defend the honour of the (typically female) poster against some perceived threat.

The fact you can't even read and comprehend my very simple post is unfortunate, but to escalate it from there to claim I am baiting is stupid, plain and simple.

You guys are so up in arms over this, like anyone who doesn't lick the toes of your heroes is anti or against them. Well tough. I don't know what Frankie does, so sue me. I watch the Tour for the scenery and castles too - does that mean I cannot participate here? I don't care who won the Tour but I would still want to know. Is that baiting too? Fwit.

Holy crap.

It's like JV, RR and a select minority are un-fricken-touchable. Don't you dare ask a direct question or all the keyboard warriors will play the "baiting / trolling / hating" cards in an attempt to shut you down.

I don't care if Frankie generates value from his position as an ex-doper - I don't think it's good or bad. I just want to know: does he?
 
thehog said:
True. Here the UCI is not interested. It appears USADA is on a crusade to stop him "riding" (as from racing). But USAC will have to make the call. USADA in this situation appears not to have jurisdiction to withdrawal a rider.

Then what to do with the non-sanctioned riders if Armstrong rides. Can they be withdrawn or sanctioned?
What crusade? Wada rules apply to the event. I posted the link to the release. And yes, riders get a one-day USAC license as a condition of doing the ride.

If you check the organizer's rule, you will see that they suggest sorting riders by racer category, then the one-day licenses go last.

It is much more structured than the UK. There are still plenty of organized rides outside usac that call themselves a gran fondo. Doper gran fondo is not one of them.
 
Sep 29, 2012
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I PM'd you coz it's annoying the snot out of me to be misunderstood.

Archibald said:
does he get anything?
That's my question.

Archibald said:
that's pretty obvious already,
No, it's not. Unless you follow the adventures of Frankie really, really closely. SO sue me for having a life outside that activity.

Archibald said:
so why even ask?
See above - life basically.

Archibald said:
It's not like it's not well known already...
Unless, you know, I don't know everything.

Archibald said:
you're just baiting now, which is pretty much what I reckon you were doing in the first place...
name calling too? Hi-ho Silver!!
Has anyone else ever asked this question?
If so, what was the answer and I'll go read that.
If not, it's a new question, right? Seeking to understand a situation I am not appraised of.

If you find asking questions "baiting" then there's a bunch of regimes you must support with much interest yeah?

Let's shut down people asking questions to get information instead of making it up or assuming stuff. Good oh!!

Here, have some hay.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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MarkvW said:
As I read it, Lance is barred from "competing" in UCI events.
Well, to be fair, the competition for peanut butter and jelly sandwiches at the first aid station can be pretty intense
 
Aug 13, 2009
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DirtyWorks said:
What crusade? Wada rules apply to the event. I posted the link to the release. And yes, riders get a one-day USAC license as a condition of doing the ride.

If you check the organizer's rule, you will see that they suggest sorting riders by racer category, then the one-day licenses go last.

It is much more structured than the UK. There are still plenty of organized rides outside usac that call themselves a gran .
"Crusade" is just a talking point. When Lance does not ride it will be because he is the "Victim" of a "witch hunt"
 
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