gooner said:
A Dutch report while back had it something like 80%-90% of riders during that era. What if you were a rider with Rabobank?
Van Hooydonck was racing for Rabobank when he decided to retire in April 1996. I'm sure that that is because he had the intuition that Raas was finally willing to jump on the bandwagon, which did happen the month after.
gooner said:
I don't see him as a loser as a cyclist. The whole theme of him exposing that culture was to show how enticing it was around him. I don't believe for a second that guys like Kimmage, Kelly and Roche when they became pro and raced in mainland Europe, that they went with the intention of doping to the gills from the outset. The system got to them, like it did with many.
I don't see that as people being weak when it was widespread and endemic.
Was it that widespread in the eighties or before? I think that are examples of riders in those era who built up a solid palmares probably without doping or who at least won major races, racing clean, though using dope on other occasions...
I still see Kelly as a champion though, for what he did in the eighties, at least.
gooner said:
The Scott Mercier's of this world were a big minority.
Van Hooydonck, Maassen, Delion, Peter De Clercq. These guys have all retired at a relatively young age (around 30) in cycling's worst era because they refused to dope.
They might still be a minority but if heroes exist, they are, not the dopers of that era.
IzzyStradlin said:
Personally, I don't really care if Grand Tour level guys doped.
Should that imply that you care if classics' level guys doped?
Well that would be too good to be true. It's just CN after all. Don't dream, Echoes...
Berzin said:
The OP could have titles the thread "favorite rider who was a doper".
Then maybe we could have a different conversation, because there is a distinction that can be made between the two, hero vs. doper.
Not with me. I would have said exactly the same as I did. I have no favourite (EPO, blood transfusion, testosterone, HGH) doper. I put them all in the same bag and then I close the bag. No mercy for them.