I'm done with the tour

[Barrus]

"I'm done with the tour" that is the sentiment of Nikki Terpstra. After several long escapes he has come to the conclusion that there is no way a rider who is not a sprinter or a climber can realistically win a stage. In flat stages there is no way an escape can hold on to the finish. Because of this reason Terpstra will probably not even attempt to make a tour team next year.

I can myself understand the sentiment and it certainly is true for most stages that they are made for either sprinters or climbers. But is there really anything that can be done against it? There are stages which are not tailor made for sprints, for example, but the strength of teams like HTC still make these stages end in a sprint. The only manner in which the escapees could probably make more of a chance is when the teams become smaller and thus are not able to control the stages to this degree. What is your opinion and is there even a solution for this problem?

 

[swuzzlebubble]

He needs to sit down with Jens for a chat

 

[khardung la]

I think it is a right decision. He still have the classics, week-long races, Vuelta and Giro...There is plenty out there out of the TdF. I think Freire was smart this year in that regard, although we need to wait for his Vuelta and Worlds.

 

[Jeanne]

After having lost so close to the finish yesterday, no wonder he's upset and frustrated. Wouldn't overrate this.

 

[mickkk]

Sorry old ****, its not a game for Domestiques. If you cant sprint or climb, youd be better off in another sport.

Nikki who?

 

[The Sheep]

Maybe teammates of breaks should start derange the HTC train when they're as close as they were yesterday, it could have been the few seconds Terpstra needed to stay away.

 

[spalco]

Well, I would say: duh. Of course being able to sprint and/or climb well is advantageous to one's chances of winning a stage. I understand his frustration and I've often though "why do they even bother?" on stages like yesterday, but then, many riders just aren't strong enough to ever win a TdF stage. It is a big trophy because it's so difficult.

 

[Dalakhani]

I know that Thor is "sprinter", but he hardly won a sprint stage the other day.

Would you call Luis Leon Sanchez a "climber"? He can climb, but he's hardly a specialist.

Super flat stages are unlikely to be won by a break, so you need to be able to get over the bumps if you're likely to win in a break in the TdF.

If it's just the wrong race for him. Fair enough. Better to focus on other races.

Steve

 

[ingsve]

The big difference now compared to 10 years ago is the greed of teams like HTC. In the past most teams with sprinters had either already won a stage or two in teh beginning of the race or for some teams their sprinter had abandoned in the first set of mountain stages. When this had happened those teams were more than happy to send their riders in long 15 man breaks that got to stay away with 15 minutes since they weren't a threat. This doesn't happen anymore, especially not on flattish stages.

Now a team like HTC isn't satisfied with a win or two anymore. They want 5 or 6 or 7 wins. It also doesn't help that Cavendish is so good in the sprints aren't shared among various teams in the same extent as they were before. I think the racing will be much more interesting again when Cavendish loses his speed or at the very least when he finally retires.

 

[Kvinto]

Maybe he chose the wrong stage to go into the break? There are the "breakaway's stages" in every GT. Didn't he realize that his chances at yesterday's stage were very low due to the profile of the terrain?

 

[spalco]

Now a team like HTC isn't satisfied with a win or two anymore. They want 5 or 6 or 7 wins. It also doesn't help that Cavendish is so good in the sprints aren't shared among various teams in the same extent as they were before. I think the racing will be much more interesting again when Cavendish loses his speed or at the very least when he finally retires.

I think Cavendish being so good is the reason HTC can afford being so greedy. They are putting all their eggs in one basket and Cav is so fast and reliable that that tactic succeeds. If for example Garmin did the same thing with Farrar, they would risk losing miserably and looking like complete fools. HTC has won 4 stages now which makes them look like geniuses.

 

[kjetilraknerud]

Niki Terpstra, with his excellent palmarès - Sparkassen Giro, Dutch championship, the prologue of Sterk Elektrotoer and one stage of the Dauphine Liberè, is disappointed that there are no stages for him to win in the tour?

I'm sure some stage winners from the last few editions agree with him, Chavanel, Fedrigo, Cancellara, Nicki Sørensen, Arvesen and Burghardt for example. All well known sprinters/climbers.

And Hushovds last two wins for that sake.

 

[andy1234]

"I'm done with the tour" that is the sentiment of Nikki Terpstra. After several long escapes he has come to the conclusion that there is no way a rider who is not a sprinter or a climber can realistically win a stage. In flat stages there is no way an escape can hold on to the finish. Because of this reason Terpstra will probably not even attempt to make a tour team next year.

I can myself understand the sentiment and it certainly is true for most stages that they are made for either sprinters or climbers. But is there really anything that can be done against it? There are stages which are not tailor made for sprints, for example, but the strength of teams like HTC still make these stages end in a sprint. The only manner in which the escapees could probably make more of a chance is when the teams become smaller and thus are not able to control the stages to this degree. What is your opinion and is there even a solution for this problem?

In this tour, of all tours, this is B0ll0cks.
Gilbert doesn't seem to be complaining much....

 

[Archibald]

Maybe teammates of breaks should start derange the HTC train when they're as close as they were yesterday, it could have been the few seconds Terpstra needed to stay away.

that

5678910

 

[bicing]

The problem is that to win a TDF stage against the sprinters in a flat stage, the Ardennes specialists in a rolling stage, or the GC favourites in a mountain stage, is that you have to be really good. The TDF has no room for people like Oscar Gatto, Paolo Tiralongo, Imanol Erviti, Matthew Lloyd, Evgeni Petrov or Damien Monier. Terpstra is in that category!

Looking at the stage winners of the TDF and the only riders of that category I see are Christophe Riblon from 2010, Brice Feillu from 2009, Marcus Burghardt and Gert Steegmans from 2008.

 

[Pharazon]

i think the way to do this is to have more medium mountain stages...

cut down on the flat stages, but also cut down on the high mountain stages as BOTH can be incredibly boring...

have say 2 days in the high pyrenees, 2 in the high alps, summit finishes all the time, and have more stages like the super besse one.. that way there are real chances for breakaways / classics specalists to do their stuff, but then again Terpstra is never going to do anything in those stages either..

oh, and 2 ITT's

 

[L'arriviste]

The big difference now compared to 10 years ago is the greed of teams like HTC. In the past most teams with sprinters had either already won a stage or two in teh beginning of the race or for some teams their sprinter had abandoned in the first set of mountain stages. When this had happened those teams were more than happy to send their riders in long 15 man breaks that got to stay away with 15 minutes since they weren't a threat. This doesn't happen anymore, especially not on flattish stages.

Now a team like HTC isn't satisfied with a win or two anymore. They want 5 or 6 or 7 wins. It also doesn't help that Cavendish is so good in the sprints aren't shared among various teams in the same extent as they were before. I think the racing will be much more interesting again when Cavendish loses his speed or at the very least when he finally retires.

Surely 'greed' is the word to use when a situation is unfair. But everyone wants to win on the TdF and HTC is going about that in a conspicuous and highly systematic way. Boring it certainly is and Cavendish isn't the most eloquent of spokespeople but I'm not sure we can call that unfair. Indeed, when Cavendish loses his speed or retires there will be another to take his place.

It's got to be the parcours and the razmatazz of vested interests in the race. In the early 90s, there were a lot of days when the bunch didn't ride and a breakaway of Terpstra-type rouleurs lasted all day. But they weren't particularly interesting days either, even if somebody different won on each of them.

 

[ingsve]

Indeed, when Cavendish loses his speed or retires there will be another to take his place.

It's very rare that you have one sprinter that is so much better than everyone else. Not even Cipollini was that much better than his opponents and he is still the closest example for as long as I have followed cycling (since 1997 with a working knowledge of a couple years before that as well).

 

[Sophistic]

Why should you win a stage if you have no skills?This isnt the Tour de Marx...
And HTC can be beaten on a flat stage, by the right riders with the right timing.
For example, Gilbert should have stayed in the peloton a bit longer yesterday, let the HTC guys kill themselfs a bit more and then jump with bout 800m to go, may be behind a teammate for 2-300m, kind of like Haussler almost upset everybody at MSR 09.

 

[Dermie]

It's very rare that you have one sprinter that is so much better than everyone else. Not even Cipollini was that much better than his opponents and he is still the closest example for as long as I have followed cycling (since 1997 with a working knowledge of a couple years before that as well).

Its not that rare!! Cav's sprint coach is none other than the great sprinter himself Erik Zabel. Who kept our Robbie out of the green jersey many times!!
Did Erik win it 5 times????

 

[Kender]

Now a team like HTC isn't satisfied with a win or two anymore. They want 5 or 6 or 7 wins. It also doesn't help that Cavendish is so good in the sprints aren't shared among various teams in the same extent as they were before. I think the racing will be much more interesting again when Cavendish loses his speed or at the very least when he finally retires.

do you say the same thing about contador?

until this tour he's been unbeatable. this years giro was the most boring in living memory.

it's hardly cav's fault not one of the other teams has thus far tried to set up a train to beat him. they are all groveling for the scraps he and HTC leaves them.
I thought his comment after the last win was quite amusing.. something along the lines of if the other sprinters dont believe they can win what's the point in paying the sprinters

 

[Mambo95]

Its not that rare!! Cav's sprint coach is none other than the great sprinter himself Erik Zabel. Who kept our Robbie out of the green jersey many times!!
Did Erik win it 5 times????

While Zabel may have dominated the Green Jersey, largely down to his climbing ability, but he didn't dominate the sprints themselves. He had 12 stages wins his whole career (no more than three in any one year).

A few sprinters have won four stages, (but never five or six) in a single Tour (Cipo, Petacchi, Steels), but no-one has done it twice. Cavendish's dominance is unprecedented.

 

[Benotti69]

Why should you win a stage if you have no skills?This isnt the Tour de Marx...
And HTC can be beaten on a flat stage, by the right riders with the right timing.
For example, Gilbert should have stayed in the peloton a bit longer yesterday, let the HTC guys kill themselfs a bit more and then jump with bout 800m to go, may be behind a teammate for 2-300m, kind of like Haussler almost upset everybody at MSR 09.

riding a bike in the peloton and not crashing is not a bad skill as skills go in pro racing. he's doing better than Wiggins, Brakovic, Horner, Boonen to name a few.

Again posters reading more into a misquote or when a rider gives an honest opinion it is considered whining or moaning and therefore the rider is less of a pro.

for sure in aint the Tour de Marx, but the tour has always respected all comers and not just the climber, sprinters and TT specialists.

Tepestra is unhappy and why not. A bad tour can break a team or make a team. BBox without last years excellent Tour would probably not have made a pro team this year, by attracting a major sponsor.

 

[spalco]

I thought his comment after the last win was quite amusing.. something along the lines of if the other sprinters dont believe they can win what's the point in paying the sprinters

Yeah, I enjoyed that too. Surprised it didn't create more outrage here about what an arrogant ******bag Cav is.

 

[search]

he was in the break when Luis Leon Sanchez won and Voeckler took yellow but couldn't even follow them for half of the stage and finished 11 minutes down...

people like Fedrigo, Flecha or (the pre 2011) Thomas Voeckler have won a couple of stages at the tour over the years and they are neither sprinters nor mountain goats