Indurain Compared to Contador

[hrotha]

Don't know where this idea comes from. Contador has been winning ITTs since his first year as a pro. It's a myth that he only developed the skill as a precursor to entering the TdF.

I'd say he's talking about his build. He has the body shape of a climber, but he can TT (he always could).

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Interesting thread, as they are apples and oranges in so many ways. But comparing what you can, I think what Indurain accomplished, and was as an overall cyclist, is more admirable. His two Giro-Tour doubles still remains very impressive. The only Tour he was pushed at all was 1993 by Rominger, but he still won with aplomb. Mig is also one of the most modest, gracious champions I can recall. Never boasting about any of his wins, he let his riding do his talking, smiled for cameras and signed autographs for fans. When he came to Atlanta for the Olympics, even though his English was poor he greeted as many fans he could.

On the negative side for Mig, the Tours during his years had triple the TT distances that the GTs do today. Not his fault though, but it did work to his advantage. He was also bland to watch. He'd crush everyone in the TT's, and then follow the right breaks in the mountains and rarely attacked with them. Though if you watch a few stages, such as with Rominger in '93, and the amazing ride up the Hautecam with LeBlanc in '94, he could climb at a very high level if he needed to, and probably could have won just about any race he wanted if he set his mind on it. I also recall Mig having the gods smile upon him, as he rarely if ever crashed his entire career, and if he did they were minor spills. Probably Karma for being such a classy champion.

Berti is more of a pure climber who can explode in the mountains like no other and control the race with his will and talent. He is the most feared rider today. He may indeed top either Armstrong or Mig's GT wins, and he really showed the heart of a champion in this year's Tour. He still has probably 5 more years left of racing at the highest level I think, and that will probably be a better time to compare him to greats of the past.

As an aside - This thread is about these two riders, not about doping or Armstrong, so let's keep the discussion on track, please.

 

[SiAp1984]

As an aside - This thread is about these two riders, not ... Armstrong, so let's keep the discussion on track, please.

Sorry. That was just a thought crossing my mind when I followed the thread.

 

[El Pistolero]

I'd say he's talking about his build. He has the body shape of a climber, but he can TT (he always could).

In 2006/2007 he neglected his time trial skills a bit though, so I wouldn't call him a TT specialist back then. although in prologues he was usually pretty good because of his explosiveness.

 

[No_Balls]

On the negative side for Mig, the Tours during his years had triple the TT distances that the GTs do today. Not his fault though, but it did work to his advantage. He was also bland to watch. He'd crush everyone in the TT's, and then follow the right breaks in the mountains and rarely attacked with them. Though if you watch a few stages, such as with Rominger in '93, and the amazing ride up the Hautecam with LeBlanc in '94, he could climb at a very high level if he needed to, and probably could have won just about any race he wanted if he set his mind on it. I also recall Mig having the gods smile upon him, as he rarely if ever crashed his entire career, and if he did they were minor spills. Probably Karma for being such a classy champion.

And here you have that ride.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SESSSpBUz1o

Karma is also when they have a little trashtalk about Indurain being boring (surprised to hear so much **** coming from Roche - he was bitter of course) minutes before he is about to destroy Rominger and the entire field minus Leblanc at the early slopes of Hautacam.

 

[Indurain]

Tour de France 1994 Stage 11 Cahors--Lourdes--Hautacam was one amazing ride by Indurain. Would love to know his wattage for that last climb. Indurain rarely showed how good he really was, this was one of the few exceptions.
But most of the time he use to wisely conserve just in case he needed it later in the tour. He knew he didn't have a bottomless pit of energy, so wisely stayed with his team til he could no longer.

Other teams use to take advantage of this and attack early. I guess they knew it was their only chance. Indurain was always chasing down one attack or another. In 1995 he was really worried about the Festina team though and attacked them, riding the whole pack off his wheel except for the hog himself. I personally found Indurain chasing down the attacks quite entertaining. I think more attacking riders won a stage during his tours than any other.

During the Armstrong era, his team was so dominate that none of the favourites could really stay away with significant energy left to make it worth breaking away.

 

[cromagnon]

And here you have that ride.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SESSSpBUz1o

Karma is also when they have a little trashtalk about Indurain being boring (surprised to hear so much **** coming from Roche - he was bitter of course) minutes before he is about to destroy Rominger and the entire field minus Leblanc at the early slopes of Hautacam.

That was brutal, the way he closed Le Blanc's counterattack down after towing him along

 

[No_Balls]

In1995 he was really worried about the Festina team though and attacked them, riding the whole pack off his wheel except for the hog himself. I personally found Indurain chasing down the attacks quite entertaining. I think more attacking riders won a stage during his tours than any other.

Really? I always thought that attack was due to his position in the overall and that he launched it because of the TT the next stage. If i remember correct he was after, among them Berzin, in the overall. In retrospect i also wonder if his TT-form was that good in -95 since he only won that one with a mere 12 seconds margin.

Any way, here is that stage. Charleroi-Liége (yes, i suffer from Post-Tour-depression):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pD1e605x80

That was brutal, the way he closed Le Blanc's counterattack down after towing him along

Yes, but it was personal, or at least developed as that. Indurain was upset (in his own way) at Leblanc due to his attack when they catched Pantani, Sammy Sanchez at Le Alpe d´Huez springs to mind, when he "betrayed" Alberto.

Indurain never liked the Festinas. At Hautacam his ambition was to set a fast rhytm so that he and Leblanc could gain a comfortable advantage over the rest but Leblanc tried to spoil that. Banesto afterwards would always talk about the Festinas as just going for stage victories.

 

[Angliru]

- Just as Contador, Lance Armstrong occasionally made gifts to his contenders (Pantani 2000, Basso and Valverde 2004). Only in 2005 he didn't win a stage in the mountains (AC 2010, no stage win at all).

You must be kidding??? I'm assuming you mean Courcheval in 2005, where Armstrong, Valverde, Mancebo and Rassmussen were vying for the stage win, Armstrong launched his attack surprising Rassmussen by going by him on the inside by the barriers. Valverde responded and, from my recollection, this was no gift. Valverde won the stage by the force of his sprint not by Armstrong's charity.

 

[Indurain]

Really? I always thought that attack was due to his position in the overall and that he launched it because of the TT the next stage. If i remember correct he was after, among them Berzin, in the overall. In retrospect i also wonder if his TT-form was that good in -95 since he only won that one with a mere 12 seconds margin.

Yes, but it was personal, or at least developed as that. Indurain was upset (in his own way) at Leblanc due to his attack when they catched Pantani,

Indurain never liked the Festinas. At Hautacam his ambition was to set a fast rhytm so that he and Leblanc could gain a comfortable advantage over the rest but Leblanc tried to spoil that. Banesto afterwards would always talk about the Festinas as just going for stage victories.

Indurain took advantage of a situation on a stage that mirrored L-B-L to some degree. He was very nervous that year about the strength of the Festina team and their continuous attacking, and rightly so. But he never underestimated any of his GC competitors and that year they seem to all gang up on him a little.

Perhaps he didn't have as much confidence in his timetrial, but I think saying he only won by 12secs paints an incorrect picture. 2nd place was Mr.60% man himself (Riis), with Rominger a good 1min back. After that the rest were like 2mins+ behind. So it was still a very dominant performance against riders much more highly doped than he ever was.

I agree he really didn't like Festina though, I always remember him putting Virenque in his place though, when he purposely out sprinted him for the points up the top of a mountain purely for the hell of it. Virenque just looked at him and just about curled up in the fetal position he was so put in his place.

 

[hrotha]

So it was still a very dominant performance against riders much more highly doped than he ever was.

What's the basis for that statement?

It's a complicated issue. On the one hand, Indurain was incredibly dominant in the ITTs in 1992-1994. Others caught up later, but then 1994-1995 were the best climbing years of Indurain.

 

[cromagnon]

Yes that's right, get this moved to the clinic. What matters is proving your point at any cost. Directed at the pair of you.