Joe Papp interview

[Barrus]

Some psycho sent me anonymously a link to a news article about prison rape and made disturbing comments about what he hoped would transpire b/w Lance and myself and a selection of the country's most hardened criminals.

Damn, you got some crazy fanfiction about you

If anything you guys would probably be put in a minimal security prison, if at that. But prison time is not a good thing for any person, in any situation, which is why it is a punishment.

 

[flicker]

Joe that is wrong. Just wrong. I do not understand the hate in some people.

 

[joe_papp]

Damn, you got some crazy fanfiction about you

If anything you guys would probably be put in a minimal security prison, if at that. But prison time is not a good thing for any person, in any situation, which is why it is a punishment.

There was/is a guy in Pennsylvania who I don't know but who knows me. He is a Realtor and by all appearances a "normal" under-40 professional who likes bike racing and competes himself as an amateur. For whatever reason, he really doesn't like me, and he also seems to have extreme (but repressed) homoerotic impulses that manifested themselves in the form of weeks of nasty emails and blog posts encouraging - in very graphic terms - my being violated in foul and unnatural ways. It took my threatening to denounce him publicly and document his attacks and associate them with his profession, thereby causing an economic harm, to get him to stop and leave me alone.

By the way, for anyone who wants to read it, here is the link to the article: http://www.salon.com/news/feature/1999/08/23/prisons

 

[Barrus]

T he also seems to have extreme (but repressed) homoerotic impulses that manifested themselves in the form of weeks of nasty emails and blog posts encouraging - in very graphic terms - my being violated in foul and unnatural ways.

As I said fan-fiction, the guy probably fantazises that he is one of the other inmates You should take it as a compliment that you are still good looking

(but anyway, I jest, but I can understand how serious it is, and how frustrating it is for you. Luckily you know who it is, and know what you can do to stop it, which is a lot more than many in your situation can say)

 

[Anonymous]

Joe that is wrong. Just wrong. I do not understand the hate in some people.

Well, we now know who sent the tweet...

 

[joe_papp]

As I said fan-fiction, the guy probably fantazises that he is one of the other inmates You should take it as a compliment that you are still good looking

+1 Thanks! I'll paypal you the money I promised in exchange for talking me up.

(but anyway, I jest, but I can understand how serious it is, and how frustrating it is for you. Luckily you know who it is, and know what you can do to stop it, which is a lot more than many in your situation can say)

Yeah it's definitely been a case thus far of the waiting and dreadful anticipation being so bad that I can't imagine - if it's worse - how horrible incarceration must be. I seriously hope that everyone involved in these scandals can move on with their lives at some point...hopefully sooner rather than later. But of course, that's probably going to require their telling the truth and asking for the Court's mercy and the Public's forgiveness.

 

[Benotti69]

+1 Thanks! I'll paypal you the money I promised in exchange for talking me up.



Yeah it's definitely been a case thus far of the waiting and dreadful anticipation being so bad that I can't imagine - if it's worse - how horrible incarceration must be. I seriously hope that everyone involved in these scandals can move on with their lives at some point...hopefully sooner rather than later. But of course, that's probably going to require their telling the truth and asking for the Court's mercy and the Public's forgiveness.

he whole truth and nothing but the truth so help their god(whoever it may be)...

i agree, it really is the only way to positively move forward, clear their conscientious and get on with living honestly and after writing this i know the answer...aint gonna happen

goodluck Joseph and keep posting dude.

 

[Barrus]

+1 Thanks! I'll paypal you the money I promised in exchange for talking me up.

Hey, I know enough women and gay folk who only watch cycling for the skinny men with their nice legs, so if you come down here, there would be enough women hanging around you, especially with your skin tone

Yeah it's definitely been a case thus far of the waiting and dreadful anticipation being so bad that I can't imagine - if it's worse - how horrible incarceration must be. I seriously hope that everyone involved in these scandals can move on with their lives at some point...hopefully sooner rather than later. But of course, that's probably going to require their telling the truth and asking for the Court's mercy and the Public's forgiveness.

If I might ask, and you are at liberty to answer, how likely is it for you to get a prison sentence? As it appears as though you did co-operate with the DA, or am I wrong in thinking that? I sincerely hope for you that this goes over quickly and you'll end up with nothing more than a probation and/or a large fine. But from what I heard the most terrible thing about a prison sentence is the fact that you are confined and do not have the freedom to plan in your own day. But that is mainly here in North-Western Europe, where the prison system is relatively comfortable and well protected against abuse from either guards or inmates, I do not know how this is in the US, although I would presume your state would not be as bad as several other states out there, also minimum security prisons will probably have better circumstances

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I might be able to help answer that a little, but it would be helpful if one of the atorneys on here with experience in the matter could post.

Federal sentencing guidelines are so varied and take so many factors into consideration it's hard to tell. Here's a general chart. And here's a Wiki link.

By most indications Joe would fall into the 0-6 range. But the thought (or goal) is that as he's done pretty much everything he possibly can to cooperate with the court, prosecutors, investigators and USADA over the last three-plus years now, that sending him to prison would be not only excessive and counter intuitive judicially, but also pointless and a waste of taxpayer money.

But who knows what the judge will think?

 

[joe_papp]

I might be able to help answer that a little, but it would be helpful if one of the atorneys on here with experience in the matter could post.

Federal sentencing guidelines are so varied and take so many factors into consideration it's hard to tell. Here's a general chart. And here's a Wiki link.

By most indications Joe would fall into the 0-6 range. But the thought (or goal) is that as he's done pretty much everything he possibly can to cooperate with the court, prosecutors, investigators and USADA over the last three-plus years now, that sending him to prison would be not only excessive and counter intuitive judicially, but also pointless and a waste of taxpayer money.

But who knows what the judge will think?

You guys will excuse me if I beg off participating in a discussion about the potential sentence. Obviously I hope for the most leniency possible, but it's deadly to assume a favorable outcome and so I find survival is facilitated (For now) by just not thinking about it and trying to get on with the business of doing what has to be done.

 

[Anonymous]

Dont worry Joe, if the worst happens, We'll bust ya out.

 

[MarkvW]

"Palmares"

Go to joepapp.com. Look at the "palmares" Mr. Papp touts.
He's telling the world that he is PROUD of those results, else why would
he display them?

He is either proud of those 2001-2006 results because he earned them clean OR he is proud of them even though he stole them while doped OR he's not proud of them, but he represents them as legitimate results and puts them on the front page of his website anyway.

Only the first alternative does Mr. Papp any honor. Is it credible that Mr. Papp rode clean 2001-2006?

Why is Mr. Papp here? Does he want to network with young cyclists who need a coach? Does he want to maintain visibility for an "I was a Snitch for the UCI" book? His motives should always be suspect until he demonstrates otherwise.

Now take a look at his "palmares" . .

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Go to joepapp.com. Look at the "palmares" Mr. Papp touts.
He's telling the world that he is PROUD of those results, else why would
he display them?

He is either proud of those 2001-2006 results because he earned them clean OR he is proud of them even though he stole them while doped OR he's not proud of them, but he represents them as legitimate results and puts them on the front page of his website anyway.

Only the first alternative does Mr. Papp any honor. Is it credible that Mr. Papp rode clean 2001-2006?

Why is Mr. Papp here? Does he want to network with young cyclists who need a coach? Does he want to maintain visibility for an "I was a Snitch for the UCI" book? His motives should always be suspect until he demonstrates otherwise.

Now take a look at his "palmares" . .

I did just what you asked.

I must admit that since it was revealed JP was dealing in PED's I have not checked his website.

When I checked Pappilion.com - which is basically Joes up to date blog, I did not find any reference to his 'palmares'.
So I reread your post and spotted you said 'joepapp.com', sure enough, there is results page - why did you intentionaly leave out the following qualifier that is highlighted on the page?

** - Papp returned a urine sample on May 7, 2006, at the International 42nd Presidential Cycling Tour of Turkey that was reported by the World Anti-Doping Agency ("WADA") accredited Turkish Doping Control Center in Ankara, Turkey as positive for metabolites of testosterone or its precursors (6α-OH-androstenedione 6β-OH-androsterone). He placed 1st in this stage of the Tour of Turkey but the victory has been removed from his palmarès. As a result of the positive control, Papp was declared ineligible to compete in sanctioned cycling events from July 31, 2006 through July 31, 2008. According to the terms of his suspension, Papp was "disqualified from all competitive results obtained on and subsequent to July 1, 2001," despite his testing positive only in 2006, and after having signed an agreement with the United States Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) that negated only those results obtained after May 6, 2006.

 

[joe_papp]

Go to joepapp.com. Look at the "palmares" Mr. Papp touts.

I normally would ask if this is Lance Armstrong, but in this case, it sounds like a guy named Mark Warno from Mt. Lebanon, PA? Way to ignore not just the full content of the page he cited, but also the fact that the site is being redesigned, and readers were advised of that in June!

 

[MarkvW]

Palmares

I did just what you asked.

I must admit that since it was revealed JP was dealing in PED's I have not checked his website.

When I checked Pappilion.com - which is basically Joes up to date blog, I did not find any reference to his 'palmares'.
So I reread your post and spotted you said 'joepapp.com', sure enough, there is results page - why did you intentionaly leave out the following qualifier that is highlighted on the page?

I suppose I should have, but typing on a droid encourages brevity.

Whether he footnotes them or not, he's still calling them "palmares" and they are not palmares. They're tainted. The footnote would, if true, eliminate those 2001-06 results as palmares. Mr. Papp obviously disagrees with the substance of the footnote. He obviously thinks that they are palmares. Some may credit him for "full disclosure." I view his presentation as an attempt to salvage honor from a history that is wholly dishonorable.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I suppose I should have, but typing on a droid encourages brevity.
Whether he footnotes them or not, he's still calling them "palmares" and they are not palmares. They're tainted. The footnote would, if true, eliminate those 2001-06 results as palmares. Mr. Papp obviously disagrees with the substance of the footnote. He obviously thinks that they are palmares. Some may credit him for "full disclosure." I view his presentation as an attempt to salvage honor from a history that is wholly dishonorable.

So brevity trumps accuracy?

You cannot rewrite history - you can only account it and offer the full facts - which in the case of JP's page, has been done.

Was not your earlier post where you failed to acknowledge the footnote "wholly dishonorable"?

 

[MarkvW]

alter ego

So brevity trumps accuracy?

You cannot rewrite history - you can only account it and offer the full facts - which in the case of JP's page, has been done.

Was not your earlier post where you failed to acknowledge the footnote "wholly dishonorable"?

Is Dr. Maserati Mr. Papp's alter ego?
Am I a former pro doping bike racer/drug dealer?

This is hilarious.

 

[Neworld]

..., he's still calling them "palmares" and they are not palmares. They're tainted.

So now we're talking tainted palmares?

What does that make of LA in your ombudsmen-like opinion?

NW

 

[MarkvW]

Kryptonite

Aaaaaaargh Lance, Lance. . .! Must it always be Lance!

Let's rag on Fausto Coppi for awhile!

Anything but Lance!

Dopestrong!

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Is Dr. Maserati Mr. Papp's alter ego?
Am I a former pro doping bike racer/drug dealer?

This is hilarious.

There is nothing funny about this - I called you on being, in your words "wholly dishonorable". I did not realize that is a term for those convicted of PED using or dealing.


No, I am not JPs alter ego - and a quick review of my posts would show that.

To your second question - I would think you were never good enough to be a Pro Racer, even if those around you were on PED's.
This may seem harsh - but I think you can only critise as you do about others when you have little understanding about the 'hows and whys' those that go for the needle do.

Sadly in Professional Cycling you don't choose to dope - you choose not to.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Originally Posted by MarkvW View Post
..., he's still calling them "palmares" and they are not palmares. They're tainted.

I would be curious to know who are the pros who you think can refer to their "palmares" as true palmares, completely untouched by the specter of doping?

 

[flicker]

I might be able to help answer that a little, but it would be helpful if one of the atorneys on here with experience in the matter could post.

Federal sentencing guidelines are so varied and take so many factors into consideration it's hard to tell. Here's a general chart. And here's a Wiki link.

By most indications Joe would fall into the 0-6 range. But the thought (or goal) is that as he's done pretty much everything he possibly can to cooperate with the court, prosecutors, investigators and USADA over the last three-plus years now, that sending him to prison would be not only excessive and counter intuitive judicially, but also pointless and a waste of taxpayer money.

But who knows what the judge will think?

Respectfully in a moment of clarity I wish to point out that in California we have wasted untold amounts of money prosecuting drug crime. In prisoning druggies is not a rational answer to drug crime. We need to re invent the judicial and penal system when it comes to our USA drug problem. There are other answers.

 

[TexPat]

I just looked out the window to see pigs flying.
For once, I agree with Flicker.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I hear you Fred. Same in my state.

I can see fining some of these people, having them pick up garbage on the side of the road, even sending some to rehab. But clogging the prisons with them the way we do is flat out stupid.

 

[MarkvW]

Twisted Upside-Down World

There is nothing funny about this - I called you on being, in your words "wholly dishonorable". I did not realize that is a term for those convicted of PED using or dealing.


No, I am not JPs alter ego - and a quick review of my posts would show that.

To your second question - I would think you were never good enough to be a Pro Racer, even if those around you were on PED's.
This may seem harsh - but I think you can only critise as you do about others when you have little understanding about the 'hows and whys' those that go for the needle do.

Sadly in Professional Cycling you don't choose to dope - you choose not to.

Sorry! I'm not up for duel (neither swords nor pistols). Insult me until it makes you feel better. Nevertheless, Mr. Papp is not on the up and up. His self-promotion is an attempt to profit from dishonorable behavior.

It is EASY to understand the needle. A rider invests his whole body and soul into the sport, only to discover that success demands chemical assistance. The rider then has a choice to make--a choice that will define him for the remainder of his sporting life--Am I a MAN, or am I a WEASEL.

A man without much in his life (Pantani or Vandenbroucke, for example) can be forgiven for staking everything on a corrupt cycling career. Papp, even with a much lamer career, is much harder to forgive because he was a smart boy with potential. He had (and maybe still has) potential for honest accomplishment.

But Papp still projects himself as an accomplished (self-important) cyclist. He should get past that and work toward a future that acknowledges he was a big lying cheat. THEN he can work toward a future that complements his obvious potential.

As for me, Maserati, I'm just a spectator. I wish I could be a fan, but cheaters preclude that.