Leipheimer downplays chances at Kindergarten race, takes lead

[GWAR79]

Holy cow. A silly title generates 8 pages of comments. Did I strike a nerve? Or two?

Not much else to talk about

 

[El Pistolero]

Hmm the best footballers often don't come from Europe yet from southern-america and Africa. And SAmerican competition can be placed almost as high as the Europen football(we call it football even in English ) level.
I'd say a lot of racers from these smaller american teams could compete rather well in Europe in 1. and 2. races. Protour seems too hard though.
That said, a rider like Levi shouldn't blow everyone away in a smaller race. He doesn't give racers a chance to win. A former TdF podium finisher, if he competes in these smaller races, should imo just follow. It's like Frank VDB winning the Belcanto classic.

Take a deep guess were people from South America come from.

They're mostly white or mestizos my good friend. Amerindians are a huge minority group in South America(relatively). That's what happens when 90% of the population dies after the colonisation of America(mostly due to diseases though, Spaniards weren't THAT savage)

 

[theyoungest]

Take a deep guess were people from South America come from.

They're mostly white or mestizos my good friend. Amerindians are a huge minority group in South America(relatively). That's what happens when 90% of the population dies after the colonisation of America(mostly due to diseases though, Spaniards weren't THAT savage)

Riiight. And this is in response to... what?

 

[redtreviso]

I wonder if Lance will make fun of Levi... Tour of Utah..5 days of making laps around Donnie Osmond's house.

 

[flicker]

Take a deep guess were people from South America come from.

They're mostly white or mestizos my good friend. Amerindians are a huge minority group in South America(relatively). That's what happens when 90% of the population dies after the colonisation of America(mostly due to diseases though, Spaniards weren't THAT savage)

You would be surprised how few of us amerindians watch cycling in the US. Colnagos and Pinerellos are rare on the Res. Levi is heepum famous though for his work with ABC.

 

[benpounder]

Actually, yes I did. Indurain was regal and dignified on the bike and to great effect. You really made a mistake with this comparison.

The comparison was not meant to disparage Miguelón, rather to reflect upon riding styles. In his five tour victory's, Miguel won zero non time-trial stages. In the mountain stages, he sucked wheels magnificantly. Without question Indurain is far superior to Leipheimer - 7 GT titles, World and Olympic Champion vs 3 GT podiums and 1 Olympic podium. Yet Indurain was the most "boring" champion I ever paid attention to. Perhaps that is why I like Levi...

 

[mr. tibbs]

Not much else to talk about

I entered this thread to talk about beer.

So:

 

[boardhanger]

Hmm the best footballers often don't come from Europe yet from southern-america and Africa. I said 'play' not come from
I'd say a lot of racers from these smaller american teams could compete rather well in Europe in 1. and 2. races. I agree Protour seems too hard though For most riders from all nations

 

[benpounder]

And re-reading the story I find this:

Once the group of six riders reunited Mancebo was the next to make a move and rode clear of his climbing rivals. Leipheimer jumped across to the Spaniard and the pair set a blazing tempo mid-way up the ascent. Through the tight switchbacks and the tall Aspens, Boswell lingered in the background, a young and quiet competitor fighting to reel back the two veteran Grand Tour contenders.
[...]
Leipheimer made his winning move with five kilometres remaining by letting loose a monster attack, strong enough to drop Mancebo from his wheel. He showed the form he displayed at Leadville by soloing to the finish line with a more than 50-second margin

Damn that Leiphiemer, he never covers, nor counters a move... wheel sucker[/sarcasm]

 

[El Pistolero]

Riiight. And this is in response to... what?

In respsonse to him saying that most good football players don't come from Europe. Just because you're born in a south American country doesn't mean you don't have a white European ancestry(or a mixed one).

Football is a mostly European sport. We discovered it through colonisation(football originates from China IIRC) and we spread it to the world with it. Football is mostly popular in countries with a European ancestry(obviously there are exceptions to this)

--

Got nothing much to say on the topic at hand really. Leipheimer can do nothing good for some people here apparently. He'll be hated for everything he says and does by some here.

It's not his fault that he's not a great climber. If he could attack instead of sucking wheels he would do so. He can't, so he's doing the next best thing to try and win a GT.

 

[flicker]

And re-reading the story I find thisamn that Leiphiemer, he never covers, nor counters a move... wheel sucker[/sarcasm]

Once again Levi sucks an invisable wheel. I have seen him do it many times in the itt...

 

[Ninety5rpm]

Once again Levi sucks an invisable wheel. I have seen him do it many times in the itt...

Wow, he can beat Mancebo.

 

[La Pandera]

And re-reading the story I find thisamn that Leiphiemer, he never covers, nor counters a move... wheel sucker[/sarcasm]

If you can show in any of my posts where I imply or plainly state that Leipheimer "never covers, nor counters a move" then I would love to see it.
Leipheimer admitted that Mancebo did all the work. Mancebo attacked, Leipheimer countered. The article says that "they" set a wicked tempo" but as already mentioned, it was Mancebo setting the tempo and Leipheimer following, feigning fatigue whenever Mancebo looked back at him, probably hoping to get some assistance but getting none from this parasite that had attached itself to his wheel. Yes, Mancebo got played, but would Leipheimer have been in the position to win the stage without the work that Mancebo had done? Would he have initiated his own move in order to reel in the break? We'll never know.

You argue that Indurain never won a mountain stage, only ITT's and I countered that with that knowledge he also never allowed someone else to do all the work and then snatch all the glory at the end of the stage. I never found Indurain boring likely because of his generous nature. I appreciated him for this.

 

[theyoungest]

In respsonse to him saying that most good football players don't come from Europe. Just because you're born in a south American country doesn't mean you don't have a white European ancestry(or a mixed one).

Football is a mostly European sport. We discovered it through colonisation(football originates from China IIRC) and we spread it to the world with it. Football is mostly popular in countries with a European ancestry(obviously there are exceptions to this)

If you narrow it down to countries with a mostly Spanish/Portuguese ancestry, I guess you're right. The English didn't really contribute to the intercontinental football craze, it seems.

 

[roundabout]

If you narrow it down to countries with a mostly Spanish/Portuguese ancestry, I guess you're right. The English didn't really contribute to the intercontinental football craze, it seems.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Watson_Hutton

Ok, he was Scottish, but no point in splitting hairs.

 

[theyoungest]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Watson_Hutton

Ok, he was Scottish, but no point in splitting hairs.

Ah, didn't know that, thanks (although I doubt this accounts for the huge difference in popularity of football between South and North America).

 

[benpounder]

Leipheimer admitted that Mancebo did all the work. Mancebo attacked, Leipheimer countered. The article says that "they" set a wicked tempo" but as already mentioned, it was Mancebo setting the tempo and Leipheimer following, feigning fatigue whenever Mancebo looked back at him, probably hoping to get some assistance but getting none from this parasite that had attached itself to his wheel. Yes, Mancebo got played, but would Leipheimer have been in the position to win the stage without the work that Mancebo had done? Would he have initiated his own move in order to reel in the break? We'll never know.

Other than the valid observation that Levi is participating in a good race with a weak field, the tenor of complaint is that Levi was/is a habitual wheel sucker. Further, the accusations imply that Levi sucked wheel to just before the finish and only then sprinted around Mancebo to "steal" victory. Clearly this narrative is false. Listen, we all impute motives for the riders we like and dislike accordingly. Many here dont like that Levi clings on to the tête de la course (and many times to the chasers). Fine. As I've said before, we all have seemingly irrational reasons for liking and disliking various riders. But when Levi attacked with 5 km left, it is incorrect to argue that he sandbagged to steal a victory.

You argue that Indurain never won a mountain stage, only ITT's and I countered that with that knowledge he also never allowed someone else to do all the work and then snatch all the glory at the end of the stage. I never found Indurain boring likely because of his generous nature. I appreciated him for this.

One of the reasons I have always liked Indurain is his strategery. Individual stages, other than the ITT's, were to be managed, not won. Many of the times you say he was riding magnanimously, he was merely limiting losses. That he worked with the other riders in his group was because there was someone up the road that may have become a threat. When he was in the lead group, he knew that finishing with the same time was more important than the stage victory. He was the consummate Grand Tour racer. But if you don’t understand the brilliance in that subtlety, then he was a boring rider. Levi, with less talent, is also mistaken as a boring rider.

Lastly, I think a majority of riders would love to finish their career with Levi’s palmarès. No they are not Hinualt, or Armstrong, or Coppi or Indurain great, but a helluva lot better than most.

 

[flicker]

I think that it is great Levi is there. He elevates the field, is not Zabrinskie, Mancebo ,Louder there also. American riders need to be challanged. I hope many great American riders ride the smaller races.

 

[boardhanger]

I think that it is great Levi is there. He elevates the field, is not Zabrinskie, Mancebo ,Louder there also. American riders need to be challanged. I hope many great American riders ride the smaller races.

Yup. Levi could as easily sat at home feeding his cats, dogs and horses. Yet he racing strong, and promoting this race. Something not appreciated by many here. Chapeau!

 

[kukiniloa]

the END of the TOU 4EVER

Yup. Levi could as easily sat at home feeding his cats, dogs and horses. Yet he racing strong, and promoting this race. Something not appreciated by many here. Chapeau!

You should know that the rumor is that this is the end of the Tour of Utah. It won't exist next year, supplanted by a race in an adjacent state.

I really can't understand why it is so hard to get corporate money for this sport, and assure live coverage.

The whole burst of visibility that LA's success brought to the sport is being totally lost, the window of opportunity is closing. Cycling is losing out in this country, and the industry doesn't seem to care.

 

[SpeedWay]

You should know that the rumor is that this is the end of the Tour of Utah. It won't exist next year, supplanted by a race in an adjacent state.

I really can't understand why it is so hard to get corporate money for this sport, and assure live coverage.

The whole burst of visibility that LA's success brought to the sport is being totally lost, the window of opportunity is closing. Cycling is losing out in this country, and the industry doesn't seem to care.

Like the rocket scientists have always said around here - burn it down and start over again. (by the way, i think "why it is so hard to get corporate money" is one of the EASIEST things to understand - the crash and burn mentality doesn't figure into any corporate directives). The industry can't do a thing about it, the purists have won. The nose is being removed and the face will be getting even uglier. If you truly care, you got to get the reins out of the purists hands. Support your local "Gran Fondo" style races starting to sprout up in the states. Encourage cyclists to enter these event so they can get a little feel for the beauty that is racing. They definitely won't make any selections but they might be able to suck a few wheels and feel the thrill while at the same time driving the purists crazy. Rip the friggin control of this sport from the choir boy purists with their petty agendas and put it where it belongs. The pro racers in the states are doing their part to further cycling while others are trying to tear it down. Ask yourself, where do you stand?

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

You should know that the rumor is that this is the end of the Tour of Utah. It won't exist next year, supplanted by a race in an adjacent state.

I really can't understand why it is so hard to get corporate money for this sport, and assure live coverage.

The whole burst of visibility that LA's success brought to the sport is being totally lost, the window of opportunity is closing. Cycling is losing out in this country, and the industry doesn't seem to care.

I live in Utah and have not heard this rumor. Where did you hear this?

 

[Benotti69]

You should know that the rumor is that this is the end of the Tour of Utah. It won't exist next year, supplanted by a race in an adjacent state.

I really can't understand why it is so hard to get corporate money for this sport, and assure live coverage.

The whole burst of visibility that LA's success brought to the sport is being totally lost, the window of opportunity is closing. Cycling is losing out in this country, and the industry doesn't seem to care.

what do you expect when the country's most successful athlete has damaged it? Of course people are gonna walk away from it. Blame people who looked no further than their own pockets and did not consider the future of the sport.

Cycling USA would be better off to take advantage of what is happening and introduce the strictest code and rules possible to start anew. It is only a matter of time before other sports get caught and when they do cycling if they follow a clean route will shine.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

You should know that the rumor is that this is the end of the Tour of Utah. It won't exist next year, supplanted by a race in an adjacent state.

I really can't understand why it is so hard to get corporate money for this sport, and assure live coverage.

The whole burst of visibility that LA's success brought to the sport is being totally lost, the window of opportunity is closing. Cycling is losing out in this country, and the industry doesn't seem to care.

I live in Utah and have not heard this rumor. Where did you hear this?

 

[benpounder]

what do you expect when the country's most successful athlete has damaged it?

Only to those who yearn to see him frog-walked off to prision. Granted, there are a good number of folks that harbor your sentiments. But it is also true that there are a good number of folks that would prefer to avoid the likely outcomes of the "burn it all down" attitude.