LeMond I

[Big Doopie]

The problem with Lemond is that his bicycle sales where eclipsed by the the rise of Armstrong...

a rise that was completely and utterly fraudulent.

is there really nothing in this world that deserves justified outrage any more?

lemond reacted exactly the way any truly clean rider should react. with righteous anger at having been ripped off. however, lemond did it with much greater humility, strength of character, greater diplomacy and much greater understanding for the big picture than practically anyone could have. for that he is a true hero.

it is exactly the way any true fan of cycling has been begging riders to react for two decades.

 

[BillytheKid]

a rise that was completely and utterly fraudulent.

is there really nothing in this world that deserves justified outrage any more?

lemond reacted exactly the way any truly clean rider should react. with righteous anger at having been ripped off. however, lemond did it with much greater humility, strength of character, greater diplomacy and much greater understanding for the big picture than practically anyone could have. for that he is a true hero.

it is exactly the way any true fan of cycling has been begging riders to react for two decades.

Yeh, like he reacted to Boyer. Or was the the techno cheat? There's always two sides of the coin. "more medical" Is that "too" medical or some medical was OK?

Greg was a pretty good talent, but he's lost my respect because I don't belive his motive is about clean sport.

 

[Benotti69]

Yeh, like he reacted to Boyer. Or was the the techno cheat? There's always two sides of the coin. "more medical" Is that "too" medical or some medical was OK?

Greg was a pretty good talent, but he's lost my respect because I don't belive his motive is about clean sport.

He lost your respect becuase you favour the donkey to racehorse with EPO type of guy.

 

[callac]

The ADHD/abuse story arrives at the crowning moment of Armstrong's demise. It may be true, but I look at this as more self-serve ice cream. Cashing in and getting some press. Lemond has a history of victimology. Revisit 1985 and Hinault. Cry for the cameras and forget your getting paid to defend the yellow not take it off your teammate's shoulders.

You do realize the abuse story is known for more than 5 years now?

And of course, revealing child abuse is self-serving... God, that shows so little knowledge about the kind of shame CSA victims have to face, and the kind of strength it takes to talk about it.

 

[D-Queued]

...
Armstrong is a fallen hero, but all I am saying is he's no worse than his accusers. Sad, so very sad.

This could serve as an interesting admission about one's ability to separate right from wrong.

Dave.

 

[ToreBear]

Well personally i think the ADHD is secondary to being abused. Not a professional opinion, but I remember reading studies of psychological makeup of people at the top of their field having tremendous motivation to succeed. Many times because of a low sense of self worth at a young age. They strive to prove to themselves and others that they are worthy of love. Then when they are successful they continue on the path because of all the positive reinforcement they receive. At a young age athletic success in sports such as running /cycling, in many cases is the ability to tolerate more suffering. The harder you can push yourself the greater the adaptation and the more fit you become. Eventually, whether you are pushing yourself beyond your limits to punish yourself or receive gratification from others attention the end result is the same. You become more fit but even more important you are psychologically adapted to tolerating suffering. There are studies that prove adaptation of suffering. They say it is less painful for a 4 minute miler to run his best mile , then a 5 minute miler to run his best.

Greg received alot of positive reinforcement as a junior rider competing and beating the best senior riders in the nation.

But the more success he had the more he needed to counter his personal feelings of being worthless. Abusers instill the idea in their victims that the victim is somehow different and that is why they are being abused. That the victim invites the abuse because they are no good.This is what allows the abuser to return over & over without getting caught, the victim believes that they are somehow less than normal and that they brought the abuse upon themselves. They are guilty for being "bad" and that it was so apparent that the abuser was able to recognize it. They live in fear of being found out to be "bad" by others so they strive to overachieve not only for their own self worth but to camoflauge who they might really be.

For Lemond this could be a factor on an individual level. But on a general level I doubt there is a higher level of abuse history compared to the general population.

Reactions to abuse have many variables. Psychological makeup of the victim, relation to the abuser(parent, significant/trusted adult etc), age of first abuse, continuation of abuse etc. All these factor can lead to different reactions. Lethargy, depression, anxiety, agression etc. I frankly don't see that much connection with sport.

 

[thehog]

The problem with Lemond is that his bicycle sales where eclipsed by the the rise of Armstrong. Lemond, I think, felt he had his legacy stolen, and I've often wondered at his "puritan" motives evan if he had his finger on the pulse of the rise of EPO. It is so often in sport that a new icon comes along and the old limelight is gone with its financial windfall.

So it was time to get vocal? I find it hard to believe that Lemond lived in a vacuum and was not aware of the PED use of his generation that Fignon said was wide-spread and Fignon himself admitted to. It just was not the super juice.

Lemond was never vocal about PED use during his career, but only when it affected his endorsement value. Money will talk. Similarly, Fignon went to his grave believing that Lemond's use of tri bars had cheated him out of the 1989 tour in the same light.

I cheered at Lemond's 1989 victory as much as anyone. It got me riding again, but some 22 years later I see it differently, the bars were indeed an unfair. Had their great advantage been known, he would never been allowed their use. Especially when the first ITT was 73 km and saw Lemond take massive time and the yellow.

Perhaps Lemond's true nature shows through in the 1982 Worlds when he clearly chases down his own teammate, Jonathan Boyer, in the final:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZnpXZ9MP4

Even if Boyer was fading, you wait for the catch and the the follow or hope every one starts looking around and Boyer survives. Lemond closes the gap on Boyer and not only destroy's Boyer's chance, but his own, by pulling the chase group up and burning up his own energy for a counter attack.

The ADHD/abuse story arrives at the crowning moment of Armstrong's demise. It may be true, but I look at this as more self-serve ice cream. Cashing in and getting some press. Lemond has a history of victimology. Revisit 1985 and Hinault. Cry for the cameras and forget your getting paid to defend the yellow not take it off your teammate's shoulders.

You forgot "Go Lance!" at the end of your post.

 

[Big Doopie]

And of course, revealing child abuse is self-serving... God, that shows so little knowledge about the kind of shame CSA victims have to face, and the kind of strength it takes to talk about it.

+1.

to belittle victims of child abuse and the struggles of those who have adhd really shows a true understanding of the world reminiscent of ayn rand and the ignorance and stupidity of those who would have the government "take its hands off of my medicare!"

 

[BillytheKid]

You do realize the abuse story is known for more than 5 years now?

And of course, revealing child abuse is self-serving... God, that shows so little knowledge about the kind of shame CSA victims have to face, and the kind of strength it takes to talk about it.

It's hitting the news cycle now. If you think stories like this are happenstance, I feel sorry for you. Lemond sees himself as a victim. Fignon saw himself as a victim of Lemond. Boyer was deffinitely a victim of Lemond at the 82 Worlds.

Don't put words in my mouth and say I am turning a deaf ear to child abuse.
I was verbally abused. Armstrong had an abusive step father. Maybe I should build a whole case for Armstrong's choices and behavior bases on that.

You jumping the rails. Timing is the key here. People grab headlines for a reason. Lemond still has a brand and we all are compelled to make a living.

 

[thirteen]

This could serve as an interesting admission about one's ability to separate right from wrong.

don't even think it goes that deep. it's just a line we're going to be seeing over and over, ad nauseum, by the few fanboys, multiple interns, and troll-bots in the upcoming weeks.

 

[D-Queued]

It's hitting the news cycle now. If you think stories like this are happenstance, I feel sorry for you. Lemond sees himself as a victim. Fignon saw himself as a victim of Lemond. Boyer was deffinitely a victim of Lemond at the 82 Worlds.

Don't put words in my mouth and say I am turning a deaf ear to child abuse.
I was verbally abused. Armstrong had an abusive step father. Maybe I should build a whole case for Armstrong's choices and behavior bases on that.
You jumping the rails. Timing is the key here. People grab headlines for a reason. Lemond still has a brand and we all are compelled to make a living.

Absent father syndrome. Yup.

Also associated with sociopathic tendencies.

You see, there is something that we can agree on.

Dave.

 

[kurtinsc]

Lemond is the rider that got me into cycling. He is and will always be my favorite cyclist. He's also the last TDF winner that I feel was reasonably clean.

That being said... I'd prefer not to see this side of things. I like seing Lemond talk about cycling. I don't like seeing him talk about doping or dopers. I KNOW he feels like his career was shortened when everyone else started doping, but nearly every interview I read comes across as him whining about it. And it gets old. Indurain, who I FIRMLY believe was doped to the gills comes across as a much more positive figure because he doesn't constantly complain.

 

[BillytheKid]

+1.

to belittle victims of child abuse and the struggles of those who have adhd really shows a true understanding of the world reminiscent of ayn rand and the ignorance and stupidity of those who would have the government "take its hands off of my medicare!"

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

 

[thehog]

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

He was talking to Irish radio as he was in Ireland for AHDD week and speaking at a conference on the topic.

You want him to go into hiding?

He already has the crown. 3 of them. He's holds the greatest number of victories for the Tour from any American cyclist.

You should listen to the interview. He barely talks about Armstrong.

 

[D-Queued]

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

The timing of how and when the story of Lemond's childhood abuse came to light is instructive.

The parallel to your posts is illuminating.

Will Geoghan placed a harrassment call to Greg the night before his testimony at the Landis hearing, claiming to be Greg's abusive uncle, in a clear attempt at witness intimidation.

Greg responded by letting the world know about this heinous act.

Are you Will Goeghan? Or, are you just trying to act like him?

Dave.

 

[Jeremiah]

The timing of how and when the story of Lemond's childhood abuse came to light is instructive.

The parallel to your posts is illuminating.

Will Geoghan placed a harrassment call to Greg the night before his testimony at the Landis hearing, claiming to be Greg's abusive uncle, in a clear attempt at witness intimidation.

Greg responded by letting the world know about this heinous act.

Are you Will Goeghan? Or, are you just trying to act like him?

Dave.

Thanks, this nonsense is disgusting. Thanks for calling it out.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

It's hitting the news cycle now. If you think stories like this are happenstance, I feel sorry for you. Lemond sees himself as a victim. Fignon saw himself as a victim of Lemond. Boyer was deffinitely a victim of Lemond at the 82 Worlds.

Don't put words in my mouth and say I am turning a deaf ear to child abuse.
I was verbally abused. Armstrong had an abusive step father. Maybe I should build a whole case for Armstrong's choices and behavior bases on that.

You jumping the rails. Timing is the key here. People grab headlines for a reason. Lemond still has a brand and we all are compelled to make a living.

Hi Billy,
Just to help you, that interview was in 98, pre Festina, so it was before people knew the full extent of what was going on.

As to your (new) opinion, that it's just hitting the news cycle now- he admitted his abuse many years ago, very publicly.
Why his ADD is in the news now, was because he is in Ireland for that very purpose, doing charity rides, public talks and talking to the media.

 

[callac]

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

It's "news" to you because you want it to be to fit your vision of LeMond...

As pointed out by thehog above, he was interviewed about a ADHD charity ride in Ireland he was participating to. LeMond has been announced as the ambassador for this event way before the Armstrong's ban.

As for the abuse, he's not talking about it all over the place, but discreetly being a public figure for it for years.
He was interviewed when the Sandusky scandal broke out:
http://www.twylah.com/CNN/tweets/138472041572597760
and participating in a few rides for 1in6.org over the past few years, including this one:
http://www.prlog.org/11668527-greg-...ondo-to-raise-awareness-for-1in6-charity.html

There's no self-serving timing here... You probably didn't even listen to the radio interview. The topic of CSA isn't even 30 seconds in the full interview.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

Hi Billy,
What's he actually selling? Did he mention any of it in his recent statements.
Hey maybe he is just promoting the fact that he is the only US Tour winner.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

OK? I was talking about the timing of the story in regards to Amrstrong's USDA case going to the UCI and public. If the Lemond story is five-years old, why then is it "news" today? Any chance Lemond playing this it up and for a motive?

He sells stuff and wants his crown back?

...and? He's an actual champion and deserves to have his good name and valuable brand back.

John Swanson

 

[Cloxxki]

Hi Billy,
What's he actually selling? Did he mention any of it in his recent statements.
Hey maybe he is just promoting the fact that he is the only US Tour winner.

If Lance can still claim 7 and drain every cent from of gullable people over it, then Lemond can say he's the only one and use it to get people to listen to his message. Be it ADD treatment or cool bike stuff he sells. It's not like he's lying, that's Lance's thang.

 

[Red Lobster]

Lemond, I think, felt he had his legacy stolen.

Yeah ... uh, FYI he probably felt that way because his legacy was stolen. Not just by Armstrong, but by the entire EPO brigade. What kind of palmares would Lemond have without that pharmaceutical distortion?

 

[GJB123]

Lemond is the rider that got me into cycling. He is and will always be my favorite cyclist. He's also the last TDF winner that I feel was reasonably clean.

That being said... I'd prefer not to see this side of things. I like seing Lemond talk about cycling. I don't like seeing him talk about doping or dopers. I KNOW he feels like his career was shortened when everyone else started doping, but nearly every interview I read comes across as him whining about it. And it gets old. Indurain, who I FIRMLY believe was doped to the gills comes across as a much more positive figure because he doesn't constantly complain.

What should Indurain complain about? That in the end he got beaten by a rider who was willing to take even more risks than had taken him to 5 TdF's?

 

[petethedrummer]

greg was a pretty good talent,

lol!!!!!!!!

 

[samerics]

lol!!!!!!!!

I got that one too. Vo2 max of 92 and a palmares like he had from such a young age, talk about understatement....