I wish it was possible to have a separate thread about it. Not the conflict, but about protests and cycling.
To me the lack of seperation between the two goes hand in hand with turning it into a rather strong in-group vs out-group reasoning where people start labeling you all sorts of things for disagreeing on a certain thing. And once the latter happens, I don't think there's any debate to be had on anything because any trust on which to base a discussion on is gone, after which it simply turns into a mudslinging feset.And some people would argue that the degree to which people can't seem to separate more important from less important ends to be the most toxic part of it all. I don't think that that's the discussion we need to be having.
In retrospect, I regret that I did not repost that as soon as the cancellation was announced, and that I continued trying to catch up from the earliest posted problematic posts rather than jumping to the end of the thread and giving a strong rule reminder. That's my main take-away.MOD hat on:
It seems very possible that there will be disruption today from protests. Observations on the fact are reasonable: some frustration about it is understandable.
But if you want to give any opinion about the rights and wrongs of the protests, this is not the place. Do your venting on Twitter or elsewhere. This is a politics free zone.
But since PM isn't allowed between non-mods, how can we ever discuss this?(remember please, public discussion of individual acts of moderation are not allowed).
If you think I misapplied a rule to your posts you can PM me.But since PM isn't allowed between non-mods, how can we ever discuss this?
You won't be surprised to hear that I do not agree. I believe I acted entirely within the principles laid down by those who provide the forum.Today was ... the worst day in a long time in terms of moderator action.
As I have said so often when the subject comes up.On the one hand, there were a lot of posts being made that were extremely obviously political, many of them not even making an attempt to tie themselves in with cycling. Look, I have some pretty strongly held opinions and sympathies on the matter too, but discussing politics on its own merits is very simply not what a cycling forum should be about,
I don't believe that any of the bans will be for more than 24 hours, although that may not be the case if people have had previous "issues". I shall check, and reduce any that are longer.While I'm not going to argue that none of them are unjustly banned, it pains me to see so many regulars on the ban list.
I think I have learned, as in my post above, to get ahead with strong warnings rather than to chase from behind; otherwise, the matter is in everyone else's hands. There were many people who commented this afternoon without so much as a post being edited. To quote a post in this thread that the poster deleted (so anonymous) that was a direct response to that "Just assume no one wants to hear your opinion about politics on any level whatsoever, at any point. (Not yours in particular, but everyone’s in general.) I think that’s fair and easy to hold that assumption for everyone going forward."So basically what I'm getting at here is: how do we collectively avoid another situation where probably upwards of 50 posts get deleted, about 10 people get banned, and the stage thread of all things has to be locked? Because I think most of us will agree that we don't want things to get that out of hand on here...
I meant in terms of how much moderator action was carried out. And also in terms of how much moderator action had to be carried out, for that matter.You won't be surprised to hear that I do not agree. I believe I acted entirely within the principles laid down by those who provide the forum.
Such a thread would be one I would want to keep an eye on, but a place to vent about frustration of races being disrupted/rerouted, how well organisers deal with it and on less fraught days to comment about negligent dog-owners and cardboard sign wavers is one that you are welcome to open. My first post would be a strong reminder that the discussion is of , as @Red Rick puts it above, the means and not the ends.I wish it was possible to have a separate thread about it. Not the conflict, but about protests and cycling.
It is obviously a very grey area: best I can suggest is to ask yourself a few questionsWhile not discussing the cause for the sanctions, IIRC it was also not permitted to discuss the rights and wrongs of IOC banning Russia and Belarus? Is that right?
If so, is any discussion about other similar and possible actions of the sporting government bodies and what they ought to do also not possible in any shape or form?
I think this is great and makes a ton of sense. Good, helpful guidance.It is obviously a very grey area: best I can suggest is to ask yourself a few questions
- "Is my response essentially related to cycling?"
- "Can someone agree/disagree with my post in a conversation (which is what the forum is, after all) without revealing their political viewpoint?"
This I find concerning. There's no way to predict what might trigger someone else. I'm not responsible for everyone's reaction, I'm responsible for staying within the rules of the forum. Of course any political post is going to trigger someone, but the rules cover that. We can't function as a group worrying about what reaction someone on the internet might have. Plenty of things within the bounds of the rules obviously trigger people. Can't see how this is tenable. People need to be responsible for their actions and reactions.
- "Could someone who fundamentally disagrees with me on this read my comments without being triggered?"
I think this is great and makes a ton of sense. Good, helpful guidance.
This I find concerning. There's no way to predict what might trigger someone else. I'm not responsible for everyone's reaction, I'm responsible for staying within the rules of the forum. Of course any political post is going to trigger someone, but the rules cover that. We can't function as a group worrying about what reaction someone on the internet might have. Plenty of things within the bounds of the rules obviously trigger people. Can't see how this is tenable. People need to be responsible for their actions and reactions.
If so, is any discussion about other similar and possible actions of the sporting government bodies and what they ought to do also not possible in any shape or form?
We all become mods?But since PM isn't allowed between non-mods, how can we ever discuss this?