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thehog
BANNED
- Jul 27, 2009
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kingjr said:
kingjr said:
It actually goes both ways. Dr. Mas did himself no favours in abusing the mods and stringing out threads for pages and pages making the Clinic unreadable.
Then you have an amazing poster like BroDeal chased off the forum because he wanted to get beneath the "Armstrong's a bad guy" circular debate.
Bro like myself spent the best part of 4 years tearing apart Armstrong and the minute we want to go deeper after his downfall we are labelled "trolls". I want to know why Armstrong got the power he did and why it was so easy to pull off. Addtionally why some were so willing to work with him.
But the second you ask those questions it's shut down because it's not a Betsy talking point (and I think she's great but, please, let the debate roll). We all know Armstrong is a bad guy. It's well established. He's not coming back. But we should be able to point out a guy like Bob from SCA was an idoit for investing in Armstrong in the first place without having to be chased all over the forum for 30 pages explaining that effectively he gave Armstrong and interest free loan for 8 years and it's his fault not Armstrong's for doing that. It was obvious. It didn't mean it was supporting Armstrong. Its just there were a lot of idiots in the Armstrong era who took him at face value.
But sometimes it's like all that's allowed to be posted is "Armstrong is evil" and have 10 people agree. The Clinic is better than that. All views should be welcome.
Also and as I've previously mentioned the Sky situation split the forum where before they were united over Armstrong. It happens. It's not trolling because many think they are doping. And it's not trolling that others want to see more evidence or proof.
With all due respect to Race Radio; his original position on Sky was much different than it was now. I don't mind that it's shifted. He is entitled to his opinion. But it got a little crazy. Posting really good information about gear ratios on the Chris Squared thread and your post is being reported?! RR initially thought Sky were clean but were suspicious or just suspicious and not knowing if they were clean. He now appears more in the suspicious camp and something is going on.
Like I said it It got crazy because if someone is debating without you why would they report the post at the same time? If report a post I never reply and say that in my report. This is not a dig at RR as you can see he's is widely respected on the forum but at times people will want to dig under the covers even if they agree with the other person opinion. Allow them the room to do so. Expressing one opinion and saying "this is it" just shuts down debate. Some people require time to discuss and develop their own thoughts and position.
Look at the JTL thread. It's a great example. I post links information on JTL working with Sky, Kerrison etc. and you get stuck on one point in one post. You ignore that, report it and the same person just keeps posting it. You try to open up more about JTL but you end up trying to defend everything you write because is become personal.
I bet is no one knew JTL signed a letter of intent with Sky in April until I posted it. Not even Vaughters. But you end up not even discussing it and it's a key bit information. That's not trolling. That's doing research, forming an argument and presenting it. So when you think a person is trolling look past that and look at the information being posted and discuss the content not the poster.
Same with Sky. I reported their cortisone use months ago on the TUE thread. Many knew about it. I was chastised for it and months later RR backed it up when his position changed.
RR and I are not that far apart in out opinions. We just have a different presentation style. He knows it, I know it.
My motto has always been never to call anyone a troll. I stand by that. All views welcome. And respect the mods.
And some of us need to regain our sense of humor. We're all so serious!
If RR pulls me up on JTL being leader, I'll make fun of him about Moncoutie and RR saying he doped, when it's clear it's just made up or a bad rumour. That's not spiteful. That's fun and defusing a situation. Let it roll.The forum is big enough for all of us. Let's all play fair and drop the personal attacks.
I'm sure David Walsh will being some humor back to the proceedings!
Peace.
Save your breath hog, this
among other posts tells me all I need to know about you.
thehog said:True champion attacking on a neutralized decent as well
All class.
among other posts tells me all I need to know about you.
thehog said:
There are enough people on this forum to speak up if that should happen. You are not needed, and the forum would be better off without you.
That is just my opinion, as a reader who is pretty much without bias when it comes to the athletes and teams in question. I have no agenda here.
- Aug 9, 2010
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Speaking of: have the mods been given a heads up on The Clinic / general forum direction now that CN has been sold to another company?
- Aug 13, 2009
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ha ha!
ha ha! I applaud mods who through banning certain members makes those members realise that their insulting /trolling stance is not acceptable
thousands of posts/being worthy in the past does not make a member above forum rules...good riddance to them
no wonder mods have such a hard time with the duplicitous nature of certain posters saying one thing and doing another......honesrty is not their strong point
let ones posts stand there is no need to claim anything more
Mark L
ha ha! I applaud mods who through banning certain members makes those members realise that their insulting /trolling stance is not acceptable
thousands of posts/being worthy in the past does not make a member above forum rules...good riddance to them
no wonder mods have such a hard time with the duplicitous nature of certain posters saying one thing and doing another......honesrty is not their strong point
let ones posts stand there is no need to claim anything more
Mark L
Susan Westemeyer
Retired Moderator
- Mar 5, 2009
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Susan Westemeyer said:
You may as well decide that a discussion of whether or not God exists to be deemed not appropriate for this forum. Or all other threads with controversy in the Cafe. Decided by whom if I may ask, by the way?
Incredible. And why only now? Those posts have been in there for ages! Was the recent Hitler conversation that made you go through the Forum looking for holocaust and Nazi mentions?
- Jul 10, 2010
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BigMac said:You may as well decide that a discussion of whether or not God exists to be deemed not appropriate for this forum. Or all other threads with controversy in the Cafe. Decided by whom if I may ask, by the way?
Incredible. And why only now? Those posts have been in there for ages! Was the recent Hitler conversation that made you go through the Forum looking for holocaust and Nazi mentions?
A question about the existence of God is not comparable. Refer to
http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/rhetological-fallacies/
As to "why only now?": it likely never go the attention of the mods. There is no time limit on when something gets deleted or removed. It gets found when it gets found. And it was likely pointed out as a validation for someone objecting to the censorship of a "Hitler" conversation. See also: "Godwin's Law".
- Aug 16, 2011
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It was indeed just recently brought to our attention via a PM by another user. The decision to delete was a decision by the higher ups that it was not appropriate for the forum.
Personally I don't think the loss of those posts and such a conversation will hurt anything.
Personally I don't think the loss of those posts and such a conversation will hurt anything.
- May 15, 2011
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