Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

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Re: Re:

PremierAndrew said:
King Boonen said:
PremierAndrew said:
It was utter carnage out there. Sure he shouldn't have done it, but DQing him for that would be ridiculous. If there's footage that shows him taking that tow for a while longer then sure, action needs to be taken. But 5 seconds to clip in is nothing

The same posters who attacking Nairo for this would be very accepting if it was Froome or Contador in this scenario, and also true that there would be a forum meltdown if Froome had been in this situation
Ridiculous generalisation is ridiculous.
Not true for all, but certainly true for some of the posters here
Then say that, some of us can be level-headed!

For what it's worth I'm torn on this. He's clearly holding on to a moving bike when others around him are not. In that respect he should either be DQ'd, fined or given a time penalty.

However, it's a short video and for all we know the bike might have almost forced him off the road and he's just grabbed it to stop himself from crashing. The flip point of that is, however, anyone arguing that the result yesterday should have stood unaltered should also be arguing for Nairo to be DQ'd.
 
Re:

Forever The Best said:
I think Quintana made a big mistake in not attcking Froome on Arcalis.He could have attacked hard on stage 5 as well.
He also should have been more aggressive on Peyresourde stage and he should have taken the initiative on the downhill immediately.
nah he will just happily let himself tow by moto to the podium place :D
zero panache in him.
 
Oliwright said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
If Quintana Wins the tour by 20 seconds won't you feel cheated?
Ehm, no.
lol...good morals!
Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.
Quintana gained the most from yesterday.
Froome, Porte and Mollema would have taken much more time if they hadn't been forced into crash.

He was behind after Yates attacked before the crash.
The crash held yates up and left him catch up.

He then held onto a motor bike, which under normal circumstances is a time penalty or disqualification.

He also lost 7 seconds in the final 1km after the crash. Which was discounted...

So yes I would feel cheated if Quintana won by less than 20 seconds.
The fact that they complained at the decision yesterday was not sporting.

If Quintana and Froome's situations were reversed you wouldn't be on Froomes side.
Where? Give me some evidence that he was behind when Yates attacked. It was Valverde who was behind shortly before the crash. Quintana was always on second position behind Yates or third behind Yates and Aru before the crash.
 
Re:

Forever The Best said:
I think Quintana made a big mistake in not attcking Froome on Arcalis.He could have attacked hard on stage 5 as well.
He also should have been more aggressive on Peyresourde stage and he should have taken the initiative on the downhill immediately.
Surely, if yesterday showed us anything, it's that Quintana was absolutely correct not to attack on previous stages. He tried yesteday and didn't even have the legs to drop Poels, let alone Froome. He just needs to limit his losses these first two weeks and hope that Froome and his train have a drop off in their level later in the race. Wasting energy attacking a rider who is climbing better and is more powerful than you, is a recipe for losing over a minute - as was nearly the case yesterday.
 
Ehm, no.[/quote]

lol...good morals![/quote]

Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.[/quote]

Quintana gained the most from yesterday.
Froome, Porte and Mollema would have taken much more time if they hadn't been forced into crash.

He was behind after Yates attacked before the crash.
The crash held yates up and left him catch up.

He then held onto a motor bike, which under normal circumstances is a time penalty or disqualification.

He also lost 7 seconds in the final 1km after the crash. Which was discounted...

So yes I would feel cheated if Quintana won by less than 20 seconds.
The fact that they complained at the decision yesterday was not sporting.

If Quintana and Froome's situations were reversed you wouldn't be on Froomes side.[/quote]

Where? Give me some evidence that he was behind when Yates attacked. It was Valverde who was behind shortly before the crash. Quintana was always on second position behind Yates or third behind Yates and Aru before the crash.[/quote]


Watch itv's coverage.
Ur making excuses for him cheating.

It's not the 1st time with him either the whole situation in the 2014 Giro was a disgrace.
 
Re: Re:

glassmoon said:
Forever The Best said:
I think Quintana made a big mistake in not attcking Froome on Arcalis.He could have attacked hard on stage 5 as well.
He also should have been more aggressive on Peyresourde stage and he should have taken the initiative on the downhill immediately.
nah he will just happily let himself tow by moto on the podium :D
zero panache in him.
I still have a feeling that he will win,but I don't want him to win.
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
Surely, if yesterday showed us anything, it's that Quintana was absolutely correct not to attack on previous stages. He tried yesteday and didn't even have the legs to drop Poels, let alone Froome. He just needs to limit his losses these first two weeks and hope that Froome and his train have a drop off in their level later in the race. Wasting energy attacking a rider who is climbing better and is more powerful than you, is a recipe for losing over a minute - as was nearly the case yesterday.
Disagree. Froome (and others) climbed better than him on the Ventoux, on a stage that didn't suit Quintana due to the wind and the way it was raced, and several days after the Pyrenees, where the balance of strength may well have been different. It just confirms that Quintana's strategy of gambling on being stronger in a straight fight under perfectly controlled conditions is just not realistic.

If nothing else, proper attacks let you know where exactly you are compared to your rivals, so that you may adjust your strategy accordingly.
 
ITV? I will watch this later, need to download this. On Eurosport it looked different. But tell me now - he was behind Yates only or behind all chasing group? (Aru, etc)
 
Re: Re:

hrotha said:
DFA123 said:
Surely, if yesterday showed us anything, it's that Quintana was absolutely correct not to attack on previous stages. He tried yesteday and didn't even have the legs to drop Poels, let alone Froome. He just needs to limit his losses these first two weeks and hope that Froome and his train have a drop off in their level later in the race. Wasting energy attacking a rider who is climbing better and is more powerful than you, is a recipe for losing over a minute - as was nearly the case yesterday.
Disagree. Froome (and others) climbed better than him on the Ventoux, on a stage that didn't suit Quintana due to the wind and the way it was raced, and several days after the Pyrenees, where the balance of strength may well have been different. It just confirms that Quintana's strategy of gambling on being stronger in a straight fight under perfectly controlled conditions is just not realistic.

If nothing else, proper attacks let you know where exactly you are compared to your rivals, so that you may adjust your strategy accordingly.
If he is working towards a third week peak though, attacks could be counter-productive. If he would have put in a weak attack on Arcalis or the Peyresourde, then Froome would have known there was the possibility of a counter attack - just like he did yesterday. Just sitting on a wheel, with the possibility he might attack, keeps his cards closer to his chest.

Of course, it all depends on his level. If he's at top form already he should have attacked and gone for broke - if not though, he's right to be a bit more cautious. His performance yesterday suggests he's not at peak form at the moment.
 
Oliwright said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
If Quintana Wins the tour by 20 seconds won't you feel cheated?
Ehm, no.
lol...good morals!
Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.
Quintana gained the most from yesterday.
Froome, Porte and Mollema would have taken much more time if they hadn't been forced into crash.

He was behind after Yates attacked before the crash.
The crash held yates up and left him catch up.

He then held onto a motor bike, which under normal circumstances is a time penalty or disqualification.

He also lost 7 seconds in the final 1km after the crash. Which was discounted...

So yes I would feel cheated if Quintana won by less than 20 seconds.
The fact that they complained at the decision yesterday was not sporting.

If Quintana and Froome's situations were reversed you wouldn't be on Froomes side.
He wasn't behind. He was the first to pass in the mayhem....allthough he was holding on a moto, but that was more keep in balance I think.
 
Jul 12, 2013
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Forever The Best said:
I think Quintana made a big mistake in not attcking Froome on Arcalis.He could have attacked hard on stage 5 as well.
He also should have been more aggressive on Peyresourde stage and he should have taken the initiative on the downhill immediately.
It would have been perfect for sport fans who like action in the race.

But he still should be given a penalty for the moto towing.

I don't know the specific rules for such an action but 30 seconds penalty seems fair.
 
Ataraxus said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
If Quintana Wins the tour by 20 seconds won't you feel cheated?
Ehm, no.
lol...good morals!
Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.
Dude riders have been DQed for suchlike actions.
DQ would be too harsh IMO.
But 30 seconds or 1 minute penalty is a must IMO.
That's not an option in the rules. Holding on to a motor vehicle is a 200CHF fine and automatic disqualification. They would have to make up a rule if they wanted to give some arbitary time penalty.
 
Jul 12, 2013
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DFA123 said:
Ataraxus said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
lol...good morals!
Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.
Dude riders have been DQed for suchlike actions.
DQ would be too harsh IMO.
But 30 seconds or 1 minute penalty is a must IMO.
That's not an option in the rules. Holding on to a motor vehicle is a 200CHF fine and automatic disqualification. They would have to make up a rule if they wanted to give some arbitary time penalty.
Then hopefully they don't take any measure at all (for the sake of the spectacle in top dog fight).
 
LOL

Some people here are beyond ridiculous trying to make it seem like Quintana had no choice but grab the motorbike. We see like 5 riders in that clip and not any of the others are drifting the motorbikes. Get real people. And then some try to make it out like people would have accepted it if it was Froome? :lol:

The forum would have crashed again and we would never hear the end of it if it was Froome. The hypocrisy is still live and kicking on CN.

He drafted. Penalty should be incoming or this really is a farce.
 
I imagine they're filing it under "It was a huge mess all around, let's move on" and want to forget about it to avoid further controversies, also because a case can be made (and is being made by many) that Quintana could have benefitted from a different but perfectly fair decision yesterday regarding Froome. But surely they need to at least address the video?
 
Walkman said:
LOL

Some people here are beyond ridiculous trying to make it seem like Quintana had no choice but grab the motorbike. We see like 5 riders in that clip and not any of the others are drifting the motorbikes. Get real people. And then some try to make it out like people would have accepted it if it was Froome? :lol:

The forum would have crashed again and we would never hear the end of it if it was Froome. The hypocrisy is still live and kicking on CN.

He drafted. Penalty should be incoming or this really is a farce.
If he doesn't get a penalty I think it is only because of the crash that happened which created so much chaos.
 
Ataraxus said:
DFA123 said:
Ataraxus said:
Valv.Piti said:
Oliwright said:
lol...good morals!
Dude, look at the video. Its not that bad, at all.
Dude riders have been DQed for suchlike actions.
DQ would be too harsh IMO.
But 30 seconds or 1 minute penalty is a must IMO.
That's not an option in the rules. Holding on to a motor vehicle is a 200CHF fine and automatic disqualification. They would have to make up a rule if they wanted to give some arbitary time penalty.
Then hopefully they don't take any measure at all (for the sake of the spectacle in top dog fight).
Agreed, it would spoil the race. Also, like you said, DQ seems way too harsh given the circumstances - even though it might technically be the appropriate decision.
 
Jul 20, 2015
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hrotha said:
I imagine they're filing it under "It was a huge mess all around, let's move on" and want to forget about it to avoid further controversies, also because a case can be made (and is being made by many) that Quintana could have benefitted from a different but perfectly fair decision yesterday regarding Froome. But surely they need to at least address the video?
Think they will just fine him. Like you said they want to forget about this completely and move on. The chaos gives Quintana an excuse
 
Re:

hrotha said:
I imagine they're filing it under "It was a huge mess all around, let's move on" and want to forget about it to avoid further controversies, also because a case can be made (and is being made by many) that Quintana could have benefitted from a different but perfectly fair decision yesterday regarding Froome. But surely they need to at least address the video?
Not really. If you are going to argue that they were not consistently implementing the rules to give the crashed riders an advantage, then you must also argue that they should apply every other rule consistently, which would mean a DQ for Quintana.
 
Walkman said:
LOL

Some people here are beyond ridiculous trying to make it seem like Quintana had no choice but grab the motorbike. We see like 5 riders in that clip and not any of the others are drifting the motorbikes. Get real people. And then some try to make it out like people would have accepted it if it was Froome? :lol:

The forum would have crashed again and we would never hear the end of it if it was Froome. The hypocrisy is still live and kicking on CN.

He drafted. Penalty should be incoming or this really is a farce.
He didn't draft - he held onto a bike attached to a moto. Drafting is a 50CHF penalty - which ASO/UCI could easily apply and no-one would care. The only option here, according to the rule book, is automatic DQ - which is a bit of a problem. Or, of course, they could just ignore it and put it down to extenuating circumstances.

I don't think many people would really want to see Froome kicked out of the race if he had done that either. A bit of a whinge and moan perhaps - but getting rid of one of the two favourites for that, would just destroy the spectacle for the remaining week or so.
 
DFA123 said:
Walkman said:
LOL

Some people here are beyond ridiculous trying to make it seem like Quintana had no choice but grab the motorbike. We see like 5 riders in that clip and not any of the others are drifting the motorbikes. Get real people. And then some try to make it out like people would have accepted it if it was Froome? :lol:

The forum would have crashed again and we would never hear the end of it if it was Froome. The hypocrisy is still live and kicking on CN.

He drafted. Penalty should be incoming or this really is a farce.
He didn't draft - he held onto a bike attached to a moto. Drafting is a 50CHF penalty - which ASO/UCI could easily apply and no-one would care. The only option here, according to the rule book, is automatic DQ - which is a bit of a problem. Or, of course, they could just ignore it and put it down to extenuating circumstances.

I don't think many people would really want to see Froome kicked out of the race if he had done that either. A bit of a whinge and moan perhaps - but getting rid of one of the two favourites for that, would just destroy the spectacle for the remaining week or so.

Wrong choice of word.

But this must be punished. I hate the "big riders get special treatment". Same thing happens in XC-skiing from time to time. One skier get an multi minute penalty whereas Northug gets a warning for the same offense (probably even worse since it was in the final 200 meters). FIS is a joke. I guess ASO is no better.
 

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