National Football League

[blutto]

Re:

Yep. All good points there blutto. OFC players all live with understanding that the next play could be their last due to injury. But knowing what we know now about head trauma/CTE, as a player I'd rather lose my career due to knee injury (& I did) than concussion. The concussion scenario is a scary one. With a knee you know what it is and can rehab. With head injury, serious acute or chronic, we really don't know what to expect or when exactly to expect it. Can live without knees. Not so well without the head.

....sorry my post was done in haste and left some stuff out.....one of the things being in those days was a dirty hit was understood to be a low hit.....the knee injury was obvious and immediate so it got attention and generally avoided on the field thru fair play.....and subsequently the rules changed to deal with that issue ( covered nicely by mt above ).....the concussion issue was on nobodies radar in those days though the Darryl Stingley incident gave folks pause over head shots but Jack Tatum remained a "hero" and he was a renown "headhunter"....and frankly that is how free and strong safeties were encouraged to play the game because they could bring the biggest MxV ( they generally had the size and the closing speed to make the biggest hits on the field ) and were most likely to make people "pay the price"...

...hopefully things quickly catch up to the new understanding of the place head injuries have in sports....but here is a big problem.....the injury is as much a result of the de-acceleration as the acceleration or the initial hit that seems to get the "headlines"....so its a problem of not only lessening the impact but also the aftermath (its a kind of the fall don't kill you, its the sudden stop thingee....)....and that occurs in any violent hit whether its head specific or not....better equipment can take the edge off the impact but the big energy transfer largely remains in play.....and players are getting bigger and faster so the MxV keeps going up so bigger energy transfers are the future....

Cheers

 

[jmdirt]

Re: Re:

The NFL needs a better ejection policy.


The hit on Adams should be punished by both immediate ejection and a fine and suspension.

That was blatant and unnecessary against a wrapped up completely defenseless player.

The ejection policy leaves too much of the discretion in the hands of the officials on the field. When all of those 4.5 guys are flying around its tough. In a case like last night, the booth should look at it, and then call the ref and inform him of what to do.

My first five thoughts were about Adams, but then I thought it looked like a dirty hit. Honestly Adams is lucky that the hit wasn't a few inches lower. I think that Trev will get fined, but I'm not sure that they will suspend him. I hope that Adams is OK, and can return soon.

Side note: did you see his helmet deform to absorb the impact?

DT got a two game suspension without pay.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

The NFL needs a better ejection policy.


The hit on Adams should be punished by both immediate ejection and a fine and suspension.

That was blatant and unnecessary against a wrapped up completely defenseless player.

The ejection policy leaves too much of the discretion in the hands of the officials on the field. When all of those 4.5 guys are flying around its tough. In a case like last night, the booth should look at it, and then call the ref and inform him of what to do.

My first five thoughts were about Adams, but then I thought it looked like a dirty hit. Honestly Adams is lucky that the hit wasn't a few inches lower. I think that Trev will get fined, but I'm not sure that they will suspend him. I hope that Adams is OK, and can return soon.

Side note: did you see his helmet deform to absorb the impact?

DT got a two game suspension without pay.

For an NFL player a four game suspension with pay would be felt more...............

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Re: Re:

The NFL needs a better ejection policy.


The hit on Adams should be punished by both immediate ejection and a fine and suspension.

That was blatant and unnecessary against a wrapped up completely defenseless player.

The ejection policy leaves too much of the discretion in the hands of the officials on the field. When all of those 4.5 guys are flying around its tough. In a case like last night, the booth should look at it, and then call the ref and inform him of what to do.

My first five thoughts were about Adams, but then I thought it looked like a dirty hit. Honestly Adams is lucky that the hit wasn't a few inches lower. I think that Trev will get fined, but I'm not sure that they will suspend him. I hope that Adams is OK, and can return soon.

Side note: did you see his helmet deform to absorb the impact?

Agree with the Catwhoorg, and that it is a tough decision, but it shouldn't be a difficult decision. Hits to the neck/head area should result in automatic ejection and suspension (at least NCAA does that), regardless of intent. Trevathan may not have intended to hit Adams head, but the technique he used to tackle him precluded it.

So, tackling technique. Teach the correct tackling technique! It is obvious that Trevathan was aiming for the uppper torso area, the OLD school method - aiming for the breastplate, or the numbers. Fact is, tacklers tend to rise up a bit during the tackle, and in this Trevathan case the ball carrier was dropping down. So the end result if Trevathan was aiming for the numbers - as per old school technique - where do you think he is going to make contact? The neck/head area. Latest tackling technique, which is not really all that new, teaches "eyes to the thighs". In other words, tacklers should be taught and drilled on aiming for the thighs. Then when the tendency for rising during the tackle occurs, where will the tackler likely make contact? The mid-section. Trevathan was clearly not aiming for the thighs.

I'll go further. It is incumbent on players to tackle correctly, but it should be incumbent on coaches to teach correctly. Maybe coaches should be fined in addition. Or maybe players must attend a clinic to demonstrate they know the technique the League should be enforcing. An analogy, in NASCAR and thunderboats, the vehicles all have safety criteria that must be met. Why not make players demonstrate they can tackle correctly? Standardize it in other words. As for coaches, TSDOP - Teach it, Show it, Do it, Observe it, Praise it. Probably not enough of that going on.

....yep, looks good on paper....but here is the thing ( and yeah we were taught both techniques ) it depends who you are hitting ( do remember that tackling involves a hitter and a hittee... this is the hitter perspective from the defensive backfield )....so if you are hitting some spindly wide receiver going low is great, but going low also risks blowing out his knees, and besides you would like to hit him high to try to separate him from the ball ....now if you are trying to bring down that fullback load tearing out of the backfield, going low risks getting a knee to your head, which is real ideal to produce one wicked "bellringer".....

....bottom line, no easy solutions....and the situation is so fast and so fluid, all you can hope for is a nice simple stop with some pop....you don't want to get hurt and he may think twice about going in your area again....and if you have your mind on hurting people that is easy to do with either technique ( especially if you have the size and speed to produce some good MxV ...knee or head, it don't matter if you hit it hard enough ...they are gonna get carried off the field...)....

...funny thing my time on the field was cut short by the low type of hit you call New School( it damaged a knee ) ( btw played both ways, free safety on one side of the ball, split end on the other....so had it coming and going...)....

....I think it has more to do with motivation than anything else...like if the other guys don't want to play nice, you make them pay often happens....and it can get real unpretty real fast....its a violent game even at the best of times....bottom line would never play it if I knew then what I knew when I left....

Cheers

I saw your subsequent post about the MxV thing [which impresses the need for what I am going to now post - a link to the tackling technique that I talked about above - putting theory on paper to practice]. I posted this video over a year ago but is worth bringing back to the front. Coaches at all levels and anyone who has family playing the game should know about this technique. Good news is, it is catching on. Not only Seattle, but former DC's under Pete (Gus Bradley, now the Chargers DC; Dan Quinn, now the Falcons HC) are using this instruction. And it has also caught on at the college level beginning sometime prior to 2010.

The whole purpose of the technique is to improve player safety by getting the head/neck OUT of the tackling action as much as possible. A quick summary of the technique straight from the video (21 minutes, full of many live-play examples, and covers more than tackling technique):
- eyes through the thighs (target the thighs with eyes, not the numbers). This greatly reduces helmet to helmet contact as the contact point will be lower).
- wrap and squeeze (with main emphasis on head placement BEHIND the ball carrier, much like a rugby tackle). Again, this gets the head OUT of the play.
- drive for 5 or roll (not really a safety element, but a finishing element). The drive leg is supposed to be the same side as the striking shoulder for leverage/power, and to naturally begin a roll (away from the direction of the runner, not into the direction) to bring the carrier down.
Enjoy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=77&v=tOCtUFwxsFU

Consider this: SEA MLB Bobby Wagner in 5 years since his 2012 rookie season has averaged 142 tackles/season and through 2016 has recorded 710 solo and assist tackles. Ask him and I'll bet he would say he is happy to have been taught at Seattle how to get his head out of the way of the play for as many of those 710 tackles as possible.

 

[jmdirt]

I was thinking "Cutler looks really good", then he threw a bad ball for an interception in the end zone on the next play.

With all of the cameras "around" the field now, they should have a first down cam and a goal line cam so there is always a clear view of those lines.

Who is watching the Houston game. I just saw the highlights, but Watson looks like he's picking up the 'NFL style' pretty well. I was watching the Texas Tech vs. Oklahoma State game last night thinking that those QBs are good and should be able to translate their skill to the NFL style too. That was an entertaining game BTW.

EDIT: I posted the above at half time...holy crap! 57!

EDIT 2: So obviously Houston is my surprise of the week. My two surprises from last week: NYJ, and NYB aren't really surprises anymore, but both won again. I think that the Bills are a solid team. Also not a complete surprise, but the Rams look pretty good (G&G are a good combo!).

The refs need to have some consistency on how they handle "might be a touchdown" calls. IMO, if they aren't sure, call it a TD, and its automatically reviewed, I saw that several times today (some stood, some reversed). But I also saw two that should have been called TDs that weren't, and in SEA case the coach had to challenge to get the correct call. Really at full speed there is no way they can see the ball cross the plane, and see if/when a body part touches the field most of the time.

 

[movingtarget]

Both Palmer and Hoyer were ordinary in the 49ers v Cardinals game. Fitzgerald scoring a late TD to seal it in one of his only plays of the game. Both offenses stalled in a pretty dreary game.

The Giants, Niners, Chargers and Browns are still yet to win. I'm sure the Giants would rather not be grouped with those teams ! Only two results surprised me, the Panthers beating the Pats and the Bills beating the Falcons. Wasn't surprised by the Rams beating the Cowboys. So far the Jets are doing much better than expected.

 

[the delgados]

Who cares?
The Bills are 3-1.
That's pretty much all that matters.

 

[The Hitch]

Hell of a game yesterday.

I like both teams. Even though Washington lost their home opener (*** happens, especially in week 1), and are 2 and 2, they are looking very good to me.

They beat what seems to be a very good Rams team away, then smashed an AFC Favoured Oakland.

Yesterday they took the league number 1 to the dying seconds in the loudest stadium in the league in a game that literally could have gone either way had any bounce gone differently.

Cousins is playing very well. What a good story he is. 4th round pick like Dak. Its not as thrilling as when Dak becomes a star in his first season but though it seems to have taken longer Cousins seems to be reaching the same point.

When he was drafted he was a nobody, who woukd be lucky to even start a game. Then a backup only starting because RG3 was injured, wasn't he even being dropped for their 3rd string quarterback. He had 1 good season mostly due to the receivers, but didnt beat anyone with a winning record, a decent season last year, and now he seems to have improved again. Very unlucky that that pass was dropped yesterday, great throw and all round play from Cousins.

I think Wash could win the East if they continue like this.

But still im glad the Chiefs won this. This feels atm like their year in the same way that Seahawks in 2013 just felt like their year. Even though Chiefs do have a superbowl it was so long ago it feels like they dont. Close games but they are pulling them out. It always sucks for the AFC Best teams when every year 1 of them is great but im rooting for the chiefs to get it this year.

How about Smith. 8 TDs, on pace for over 4000 yards, 0 INT's. Mind you Cousins isn't too far behind with 7 and 1.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

I like everything just posted above by Hitch. Also, I love it when people or players who are doubted succeed, just like Cousins & Smith. Goff too for that matter is starting to have success under new HC McVey (1 year under his belt also helps, but I wonder if any team will ever take a chance on former Rams HC Jeff Fisher after contributing to the mess that Goff was last year - but that's another rabbit trail). Lots to like about KC right now, whether its the coach, QBs, receivers, RBs, or defense. Did not know Travis Kelce can kinda dance: - Watch "TRAVIS KELCE CELEBRATION DANCE AFTER TOUCHDOWN DURING MNF - REDSKINS v CHIEFS" https://youtu.be/Yb0tHAR_QYQ

 

[movingtarget]

I like everything just posted above by Hitch. Also, I love it when people or players who are doubted succeed, just like Cousins & Smith. Goff too for that matter is starting to have success under new HC McVey (1 year under his belt also helps, but I wonder if any team will ever take a chance on former Rams HC Jeff Fisher after contributing to the mess that Goff was last year - but that's another rabbit trail). Lots to like about KC right now, whether its the coach, QBs, receivers, RBs, or defense. Did not know Travis Kelce can kinda dance: - Watch "TRAVIS KELCE CELEBRATION DANCE AFTER TOUCHDOWN DURING MNF - REDSKINS v CHIEFS" https://youtu.be/Yb0tHAR_QYQ

At the rate coaches get canned, Fisher may end up with something. Chip Kelly was just bad timing and the fact that he came out of the 49ers chaos. Chip will probably end up with another college job at least. I knew McVey would be good for Goff and the offense although no one is quite convinced yet that it will continue. Kansas have been consistent over the years, they just have to reproduce it in the playoffs. Seems like the coaches have adjusted to Elliott and Prescott, quite a few people picked the Cowboys to go backwards this year. The changes to their O line didn't help. The Giants are in real trouble.

 

[The Hitch]

I dont get why Chip chose that 49ers job. The team was clearly on its way down. They havent won anything this season either/

Did Tennessee not offer him the job because with Mariota that could have been a good fit and at least a team that looked like it was going up

 

[movingtarget]

I dont get why Chip chose that 49ers job. The team was clearly on its way down. They havent won anything this season either/

Did Tennessee not offer him the job because with Mariota that could have been a good fit and at least a team that looked like it was going up

I think the controversy from the Eagles followed Chip but most people expected him to get more than a year at the 49ers. Ridiculous giving a new coach one year in rebuild mode but I think the owner decided to clear the decks. All of the coaches went plus the GM and now Shanahan and Lynch have been signed to six year contracts. Three of the four games this year have been narrow losses to Seattle, Cardinals, and the Rams who are doing well. So the 49ers are not getting blown out with basically a new team. Only 12 players have survived from last year's squad of 53 and they have the youngest team in the NFL but unbelievably there are fans and critics already calling for the coaches head and Hoyer's ! It's only year one of a rebuild. Chip Kelly is currently commentating on college football. He was in the running for the OC job at the Jags but was turned down for that as well. I think if Chip had got another year at the 49ers Kaepernick wouldn't have opted out of his contract because Kelly had been a vocal supporter of Kaep personally and football wise but once the coaches were sacked, Kaep could see the writing on the wall and he wasn't a good fit for for Shanahan's scheme but like Kelly he probably expected to pick up something instead of what eventuated.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

And as to why Chip Kelly took the 49ers job:
http://m.49ers.com/news/article-2/C...oach-Job/00203c4b-2bfb-413f-bc05-ef09813155f9

 

[Merckx index]

Titans sign Brandon Weeden to replace Mariota. Shame there isn’t a better backup QB available, a QB who, like Mariota, can run, who fits into an offense where the QB extends plays with his feet, a QB who has been a starter more recently than 2013, and who isn’t 34 years old. But Weeden is the best QB available, there just isn’t anyone else out there. Give the Titans credit, they considered Matt Barkley, Matt McGloin and T.J. Yates, I mean, who else is there?

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Re:

Titans sign Brandon Weeden to replace Mariota. Shame there isn’t a better backup QB available, a QB who, like Mariota, can run, who fits into an offense where the QB extends plays with his feet, a QB who has been a starter more recently than 2013, and who isn’t 34 years old. But Weeden is the best QB available, there just isn’t anyone else out there. Give the Titans credit, they considered Matt Barkley, Matt McGloin and T.J. Yates, I mean, who else is there?

LOL. That's sick. Titans don't have any Kap space?

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Titans sign Brandon Weeden to replace Mariota. Shame there isn’t a better backup QB available, a QB who, like Mariota, can run, who fits into an offense where the QB extends plays with his feet, a QB who has been a starter more recently than 2013, and who isn’t 34 years old. But Weeden is the best QB available, there just isn’t anyone else out there. Give the Titans credit, they considered Matt Barkley, Matt McGloin and T.J. Yates, I mean, who else is there?

RGIII ? Kaepernick ? Barkley must be really bad if he couldn't survive the preseason at the 49ers...........

 

[jmdirt]

Cam Newton's comments are getting more response than I expected. He has sponsors dumping him now. I'm not trying to defend him, but he is always an awkward interview. I took his comments (with chuckles) as 'wow this is a nice change that a women would talk about routes.' At the same time, I knew that people would take it as him saying that women don't know football. I don't know what he actually meant though. Honestly, I wish that athletes were expected/required to talk to the media less.

Mike and Mike had a good chat about it on my AM commute.

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Cam Newton's comments are getting more response than I expected. He has sponsors dumping him now. I'm not trying to defend him, but he is always an awkward interview. I took his comments (with chuckles) as 'wow this is a nice change that a women would talk about routes.' At the same time, I knew that people would take it as him saying that women don't know football. I don't know what he actually meant though. Honestly, I wish that athletes were expected/required to talk to the media less.

Mike and Mike had a good chat about it on my AM commute.

In today's news climate re gender politics did he really think he was going to get away with that ? It was dumb but probably not malicious. I have always found him to be an odd personality. I can't think of any other player that would have reacted that way. Most teams have female reporters asking them questions after games so it's nothing new.

 

[movingtarget]

Not good news for the Raiders with QB Derek Carr suffering a transverse back fracture. His previous injury cost them badly in the playoffs.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Re:

Not good news for the Raiders with QB Derek Carr suffering a transverse back fracture. His previous injury cost them badly in the playoffs.

Because of the rotational nature of the throwing motion on the spine, I'm hearing he will be out maybe 8 weeks, and it may even be longer before it does not affect his play.

 

[jmdirt]

Kaep knows the Bay area...just sayin'.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Not good news for the Raiders with QB Derek Carr suffering a transverse back fracture. His previous injury cost them badly in the playoffs.

Because of the rotational nature of the throwing motion on the spine, I'm hearing he will be out maybe 8 weeks, and it may even be longer before it does not affect his play.

Yeah not good at all. Romo with his history of back problems pretty much feared the worst from his commentary. As for Kaep, you get the feeling if it was going to happen it would have happened already but these types of incidents will continue to keep Kaep on the radar you would think unless owners think third string QBs will give them better chances of winning. RGIII the same.

 

[leftover pie]

Re:

Not good news for the Raiders with QB Derek Carr suffering a transverse back fracture. His previous injury cost them badly in the playoffs.

for a team that's had years and years of not being good, a couple of games before the end of last season raiders fans must have been thinking it was finally their time, then the broken leg, now the back fracture.

really hope he isn't going to have one of those "if only (he didn't get injured)" type careers..

 

[movingtarget]

Joe Namath interview :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOUhXScqQto re College payments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_6hDQq8Y54 re concussions and injuries

 

[movingtarget]

Luckily the Bucs kicker isn't playing for the Patriots.............