Nibali's sticky bottle

[Finn84]

Even without that acceleration, IMO it should be allowed to be with the car only when being at the back of the group. Nibali was at the front which made the incident much worse.

About time penalty: if that had been given (10 minutes), Nibali could have easily set his target in winning KOM and get some glory from the race. Therefore, it was correct to put him out of the race.

 

[Jonhard]

Get a grip.

 

[bassano]

A time penalty would not be fair in my opinion. Nibali has broken the rules seriously and deserves a DQ.

For those advocating a time penalty, what happens if Nibali later on wins a stage against a rider that has not cheated? Is it fair that they get their stage win taken away?

It is not same like sprinters holding cars in mountain stages are winning stages againist a rider that has not cheated?
Is it fair that they get their stage win taken away?

btw. I am not saying he should not be DQ, but my opinion is that time limits should be straight for those in grupetto even if that means they will send 50 cyclist home, they would learn lesson from it like Nibali will

 

[hrotha]

Re:

Get a grip.

Said Shefer.

 

[BigMac]

Re: Re:

Get a grip.

Said Shefer.

lol'd.

 

[Jaunty Monty]

Firstly, this kind of "cheating" happens in every grand tour, but it is not captured on cameras.

And that makes it right? Not all cheats are caught - if they were then they wouldn't do it. They do it because they think they can get away with it or because they think the gain will outweigh the penalty.

When they are caught they should be punished to the full letter of the law... not only to penalise them but to deter others from doing the same.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

Hahahahah wasn't it Nibali who made the comment about Froome being thrown out of the Giro, because of the same thing? In a pre vuelta interview.

It was.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/nibali-and-aru-show-united-front-ahead-of-vuelta-a-espaa/

It's an odd quote.
""We haven't seen each other since the Tour. There are lots of incidents in races, and what happens in the race stays in the race," Nibali said, adding: "At the time, I preferred not to mention it, but in 2010 Froome was excluded from the Giro for being towed by a car…"

What does Froome getting DQ'ed in 2010 have to do with the price of tea in China? I don't see why Nibali felt the need to throw that in.

Nibali was comparing the ethical decision of his "supposed" attack of Froome when he was having a mechanical, an action that Froome took strong opposition to, to Froome being towed in the 2010 Giro. A bit of "let he who is without sin, throw the first stone".

 

[yespatterns]

Re:

It is patently absurd that some people should be so offended as to make a moral issue out of it.

Pretty sure being a blatant cheat IS a moral issue.

 

[Hayabusa]

A time penalty would not be fair in my opinion. Nibali has broken the rules seriously and deserves a DQ.

For those advocating a time penalty, what happens if Nibali later on wins a stage against a rider that has not cheated? Is it fair that they get their stage win taken away?

It is not same like sprinters holding cars in mountain stages are winning stages againist a rider that has not cheated?
Is it fair that they get their stage win taken away?

btw. I am not saying he should not be DQ, but my opinion is that time limits should be straight for those in grupetto even if that means they will send 50 cyclist home, they would learn lesson from it like Nibali will

I agree with you. The penalty should be applied consistently so I would also hope any sprinters that cheated in the same way were DQed for the exact same reason.

 

[elfed68]

I've just watched the video on youtube, so funny!!

 

[Son of Amsterhammer]

LOL at the Nibs quote. I wonder if he remembers saying that...painful.

 

[ray j willings]

I did not want to see Nibs out of the race. He's gone and the race will be poorer for his absence. He was still a minute behind, for the sake of the race I would have fined him and let it him race. If that was a sprinter or Ritchie Porte I would have not have even bothered with the fine
Its nothing more than a comical moment. If Nibs was allowed to race and he won say by 30 seconds the forum would have went nuts.
Grrrrrrrreeeeeaaaaaaat

 

[Lance Armstrong]

I agree with you. The penalty should be applied consistently so I would also hope any sprinters that cheated in the same way were DQed for the exact same reason.

Here we go

 

[coachkev]

I agree with you. The penalty should be applied consistently so I would also hope any sprinters that cheated in the same way were DQed for the exact same reason.

Here we go

But he was coming back after a crash

 

[BigMac]

Nowhere near the same thing. This is what everyone acknowledges happens all the time and is normal, not what we witnessed yesterday.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

Nowhere near the same thing. This is what everyone acknowledges happens all the time and is normal, not what we witnessed yesterday.

But all sorts of stuff go's on

Tour de France juries are known to be harsh every now and again, but Bretagne-Séché Environnement rider Eduardo Sepulveda can have few complaints after grabbing a lift for a few hundred metres on stage 14.

The Argentinian was disqualified at the finish of stage for hopping in a team car on the final climb up to Mende – but not his own car, one of rival French team Ag2r-La Mondiale

 

[StannisBaratheon]

Firstly, this kind of "cheating" happens in every grand tour, but it is not captured on cameras.

And that makes it right? Not all cheats are caught - if they were then they wouldn't do it. They do it because they think they can get away with it or because they think the gain will outweigh the penalty.

When they are caught they should be punished to the full letter of the law... not only to penalise them but to deter others from doing the same.

No, this is not exactly what I meant. There are some stages when numerous sprinters are arriving past the time limit, but for the good of the race they are not DQ. Although the rules clearly state that they should be excluded from the competition.
For the same good of the race, Nibali could have been kept in the peloton with a huge time penalty, so his unfair advantage would be neutralized.

 

[joe_papp]

Re:

Nowhere near the same thing. This is what everyone acknowledges happens all the time and is normal, not what we witnessed yesterday.

Exactly.

Plus there is a huge, fundamental difference (though perhaps to the uninitiated it seems less significant?) b/w sticky-bottle (even extended one, which is tolerated to a degree but even when abused probably wouldn't see the rider booted from race) vs. actually hanging onto the actual car...which calls for the death sentence in all cases except...

(off top of my head, two situation in which you can hang onto the car w/o fear of DQ

1) getting medical attention from the doctor, which no one is ever going to make a stink about, b/c if you're at the doctor's car you're already frakked; and 2) getting legitimate mechanical assistance from the car (more likely to be something like having your radio removed from your bibs-pocket and replaced and the wiring loom reattached) that doesn't require the mechanic to do something so crazy that the driver is trying to hold his leg(s) so he doesn't fall out window.

Yes, of course guys in very desperate situations will try to hang onto a car or moto if they can get away with it (usually just trying to survive the race - not a GC contender trying to teleport from head of chase group to lead group on stage 2 while whole world watches!).

But think of touching the car as being like touching an electric fence in most situations where it would be super-useful to do so...the fact that you'd only have to extend your fingertips, more or less, to latch on might make it all the more tempting in the moment, but you know that the instant your hand touches the car and you latch on (as opposed to push off to stay upright in a tight squeeze)...expect to be zapped right out of the race if a commissaire spots you, or the TV records it for posterity.

 

[Escarabajo]

It would have been awkward if Nibali had crashed hard due to the towing!

 

[No_Balls]

Re: Re:

There might be more to what we actually saw as posted in the race thread:

In the Spanish TV, the camera moto commenter has just told what he saw and heard yesterday.

Apparently, the towing of Nibali was far longer of what we saw in the video ("at least more than 1-2 km").

There wasn't an official complaint made by any team, just some angry words in the moment of riders who were in the same group from where Nibali cheated.

The organisation acted by their own means because they thought it was too suspicious.

If this is true there are no questions about the decision. This goes beyond any sticky bottle or whatever ever so small incident who might slip under the radar. Shefer speeded with Nibali on tow to closest Astana-rider and left him there.

 

[jsem94]

If that story about him getting towed that far, then he definitely deserved to get disqualified.

 

[Angliru]

Re:

Nowhere near the same thing. This is what everyone acknowledges happens all the time and is normal, not what we witnessed yesterday.

I really don't see the difference. Bouhani's was shown after he had already begun his tow and Nibali's cut off prior to the end of his. Both violated the rules.

 

[huge]

A 2km tow seems *** to me. It would mean a full 2-3 mins hanging onto the car.

Btw, Bouhanni and his mechanic/DS are total idiots, and lucky ones.
It might be a normal habit, widely tolerated, and clearly very different than Nibali's case, but they've certainly played with fire today. How do you expect to do something like that and not being noticed after yesterday mayhem??

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

A 2km tow seems *** to me. It would mean a full 2-3 mins hanging onto the car.

if he had been towed that far he would have been ahead of the main peloton , plus the minute or so we saw him ride to get back on....that's got to be bullsh%%

What next Nibs, getting a lift in the helicopter.

 

[webvan]

Bad day for Nibs yesterday, crash, cheating by hanging to a car (after reminding the world that Froome did the same at the Giro 2008), wrongly accusing a guy of causing the crash (didn't he do that in the TDF already?), saying he was abandoned by his team. It would be interesting to know what Vino had to say about it...chances are Nibs told him to STFU based on his past cheating! Nibs will be lucky if he can maintain his salary in 2016...