Official lance armstrong thread, part 2 (from september 2012)

[Benotti69]

Paranoia, now thats funny from somebody who sees a doper behind every tree. Tough few days with Dr M dismantling you last week and now being called out on BS.

I love Dr M's prostrate examinations

 

[alberto.legstrong]

I'm not convinced Armstrong has an enormous depth of support. Many of his defenders felt a duty to stick up for him once or twice (since the Landis revelations of 2010), but that will not go on forever. Hamilton's book is selling well, and USADA's reasoned decision is about to hit.

That will leave Lance with his crazed eternal fanboys, but the fanboys only undermine his credibility and make him look like a cult figure.

I am more or less on the same page as you. (Sorry, couldn't resist.) When this next $hit$t0rm hits the fan if it arrives on time at the end of this month or beginning of next we will get an interesting view at the damage to his standing in the public's eye since August.

I tend to view it your way.

Enough people who knew nothing about his cycling exploits other than the very rough outline had been admiring his mythical story for a decade. (The story he peddled. Again, couldn't resist.)

But now that those people who just knew the 'won 7 tours after beating cancer' get to see the soft underbelly of how he did it, they are long gone and all that's left are the cultists, and cultists drive people away en masse all by themselves. EG, I don't know jack diddly about the Jehovah's witnesses or Mormon religion per se (and I don't want this thread to be the place where i learn, so PM if you feel compelled.) but I DO know that when I see them coming through the neighborhood, especially those clean cut guys with the white shirts and suits on bikes when it's 95 and humid, I know this about it: STAY THE EFF AWAY.

that's about how a lot of people are getting to feel about the lance zombies, you have a mountain of evidence that he's guilty and the zombies treat him like he's the only thing that stands between cancer wiping human civilization off the face of the earth so therefore the MOUNTAIN of evidence is a witch hunt? Wait-... what?

Plus he's so last decade. We got the Kardashians and Michael Phelps and Tebow and LeBron and Kobe, so move it along old timer, your 15 minutes are up. You're lookin a little wrinkly.

 

[python]

paranoia can be a tough one. take off the bracelet jr

The sad thing is that he has to resort to cheap tricks despite being exposed multiple times. Yes, such contributions are too transparent as the forum had been exposed to one anti-doper turned rat...

 

[PosterBill]

Armstrong is losing support like a sinking ship...from all my conversations with friends who were once casual fans of armstrong are now calling him a fraud and a cheat. I was actually surprised at how quick the change was for most of the american public

 

[Benotti69]

The sad thing is that he has to resort to cheap tricks despite being exposed multiple times. Yes, such contributions are too transparent as the forum had been exposed to one anti-doper turned rat...

how armstrong like!

 

[thehog]

Armstrong is losing support like a sinking ship...from all my conversations with friends who were once casual fans of armstrong are now calling him a fraud and a cheat. I was actually surprised at how quick the change was for most of the american public

This is why the delay in USADA handing of the reason decision was a master stroke.

Not that it was planned that way.

The minute Armstrong decided not to contest the charges there was too much heat in the issue. No one stood a chance in getting across their points in a reasonable fashion. The comments sections on articles were jammed with bots. But they couldn't keep it up.

Hamilton's book has helped a lot along with his visible empathy for Armstrong's situation. It's in line with his character.

The hardest part for Lance will be telling his Mom. But all moms understand when we've been bad. They always do.

 

[python]

Armstrong is losing support like a sinking ship...from all my conversations with friends who were once casual fans of armstrong are now calling him a fraud and a cheat. I was actually surprised at how quick the change was for most of the american public

that's good to hear, but as some recent posts in the very thread and the convenient critisms of some former dopers show, one still needs to be careful to distinguish true converts from groupies.

 

[JRTinMA]

that's good to hear, but as some recent posts in the very thread and the convenient critisms of some former dopers show, one still needs to be careful to distinguish true converts from groupies.

I'm in your dome big time.

 

[PosterBill]

It has to be hard to disclose something like this. What I'll never understand is indulging in the lie. If I was doping I would give the standard denial and not drift from the script...but many of these guys put it on so thick that it's now impossible for them to go back. They should of all done like Hincapie and stayed as quiet as possible instead of going on tv shows and making insane statements like "why would I have doped larry? I just survived cancer and now i'd come back and put those type of things in my body?, noway"

 

[VeloCity]

Paranoia, now thats funny from somebody who sees a doper behind every tree.

Which one wasn't a doper? I think those who have being seeing a doper behind every tree are being proven to be far more right than they were wrong, wouldn't you say?

 

[Bosco10]

Well, I would like to believe that he had a massive loss of support, but I keep hearing "witch hunt" "500 clean tests" "flying colors" "it was too long ago" "Lance is still a hero" "Lance will always be an inspiration" ... ad nauseam.

 

[python]

I'm ...

A pretender claiming to be on the fence about armstrong, yet cowardly using every opportunity to attack true armstrong antifans like Betsy, mike Anderson, 'the French's etc.

Your posts are still there for everyone to confirm this.

That I and others see through the uncomplicated ruse is no reason to get all personal.

 

[JRTinMA]

A pretender claiming to be on the fence about armstrong, yet cowardly using every opportunity to attack true armstrong antifans like Betsy, mike Anderson, 'the French's etc.

Your posts are still there for everyone to confirm this.

That I and others see through the uncomplicated ruse is no reason to get all personal.

Do you think about m 24/7? If I was still trolling I would be elated how I have got in your dome, but now its just creepy how you stalk me.

Out of context fence comment was about moderation, wrong again.

 

[python]

I already told you several times, I think about frauds and pretenders who fail a smell test when their posting history does not agree with their claims. Cowardly attacks on Betsy, frankie, the French etc is what stands out about your posting.

 

[86TDFWinner]

I wonder who made the death threat to Tygart. For some reason, I wouldn't be surprised if it's related to Wonder Boy somehow.

Probably some clueless fanboy who just can't/won't see his man crush go down.

 

[86TDFWinner]

I can't wait for the evidence to be officially made public. I'm anxious to see Armstrong the Lowlife Bully squirm under the mountain of evidence and more of his former teammates come clean.

Come on George, I'm counting on you!

You know he won't admit anything....deny, deny, deny. and then "witch hunt, witch hunt, witch hunt" That's all he knows. Hell, he's probably plotting an alien abduction of the evidence, or some sort of payoff to ninja's to scale the building and steal the evidence, so it's never made public ever, and his dirty little secret isn't exposed. Wonderboy's definitely a POS.

I myself am going to laugh out loud when all of his sponsors drop him once the evidence gets released. Then again, they'll probably ruin my celebration and continue supporting him.

 

[Deagol]

Armstrong is losing support like a sinking ship...from all my conversations with friends who were once casual fans of armstrong are now calling him a fraud and a cheat. I was actually surprised at how quick the change was for most of the american public

Now this is the kind of news that we need to hear. I have had a few limited successes with people like this on a personal level, but remain disappointed with articles I read where certain authors still keep defending him (that idiot writing for Newsweek comes to mind), and to say nothing of the comments posted afterwards. Realizing some of these comments may be planted, but still ....

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

I myself am going to laugh out loud when all of his sponsors drop him once the evidence gets released. Then again, they'll probably ruin my celebration and continue supporting this a$$hole.

The sponsor drop will be slow and steady. As others have pointed out, a sponsor has nothing to gain by going public. Rather, contracts will expire in the months/years ahead and will not be renewed.

 

[Fatclimber]

With what I am seeing, I am very disappointed in the American Public (of which I am also a member). There is way to much "head-in-the-sand" thing going on with Lance fans. "Free Lance" seems to be the latest redneck battle-cry. I also can't believe how stupid the commentors are on the Fox News website.

At this point, too many people seem to be so latched onto Lance that it doesn't matter what comes out, they will fight for him "to the death".
I hope I am wrong, but not encouraged by what I see. It's always: attack the messenger, attack the messenger, attack the messenger.

I definitely see where you're coming from, but I've got to defend "The American Public" (of which I am also a part of) a little bit. I'll try to keep this as short and simple as possible because I'm sure many are tired of rehashing it. Ignorance is bliss.

-In the U.S., cycling's popularity is on par with bowling. It is much more complicated then bowling, therefore the understanding of it is very limited.
-The only cycling information the general public gets is from the likes of Sherwin, Liggett, and Roll (how unbiased can that information be?)
-Being a Cancer survivor, he appealed to peoples' underdog sympathies
-Generally, Americans prefer total domination (Magic/Larry/Jordan Dream-Team style) to a good competition, this is what Lance did.
-He played the martyr being picked on by the French. Historically, how hard is it to rally American's against "The French"?

You've got to give people some time to at least get the facts. Most of the general public hasn't even been exposed to them yet. Then they need time to digest it. Amazingly enough, sports create an emotional, polarized attachment for people much like religion and politics (just ask Florecita*). If you put people on the defensive, having them change their mind becomes even less likely.

I've got friends and family that I have discussed this with whom I consider intelligent and value their opinions. I was astounded at their defense of LA. BUT, after about a week or so a follow-up conversation with one of them revealed that he was just majorly disappointed. Accepting the truth is a step by step process that people need to go through. I really don't think you'll find Americans' support of their heroes any different than the Spanish/Contador,Valverde; Italian/Basso; French/Virenque; Khazakh/Vino outlooks. Sports evoke irrational emotions from people and you can't argue with emotions. People I know were initially supporting Tyler and Floyd and accusatory of "Those Evil French!" but they eventually did the opposite.

Lance committed the perfect crime. Perfect place, perfect situation, perfect circumstances, perfect portrayal, perfect PR, perfect everything. That's why it's been so difficult to change peoples' minds. Luckily, his egomania is leading to the eventual exposure of the truth. Let's just wait and see what happens.


*I'm not trying to pick a fight with LF, just using her as an example of an outspoken, emotional, fully-supportive fan

 

[the big ring]

cult? for sure, but i would have used a similar 4 letter workd containing 3 of the same letters but not L

curt?

 

[thirteen]

cult? for sure, but i would have used a similar 4 letter workd containing 3 of the same letters but not L

curt?

oh lord, thank you, Benotti! i so needed a giggle before bed... bonne nuit!

 

[JRTinMA]

cool

From twitter,

David Walsh ‏@DavidWalshST

Travelling through midwest, thinking. No country except this one would have brought down its 7-time Tour winner. I tip my hat to the USA.

That is kinda cool and pretty accurate too.

 

[JRTinMA]

I already told you several times, I think about frauds and pretenders who fail a smell test when their posting history does not agree with their claims. Cowardly attacks on Betsy, frankie, the French etc is what stands out about your posting.

Cowardly is hanging in the crowd and following group think like you. The truth may not make me popular but IDFC. So you love dopers like Frankie who cheated an honest rider out of a place in the game, cool.

 

[python]

Cowardly is hanging in the crowd and following group think like you.

as expected you are confused and disoriented because your pretending was exposed...

cowardly and creepy was is and still remains to allude to mike andersn being armstrong's drug mule. you made the remark and disappeared. never attempted to apologize or even pretend that there was misunderstanding.

do you dispute that you did not make the cowardly and ugly allegation ?
the post is still there.

cowardly and creepy was to suddenly appear from nowhere and call betsy that she is married to a doper when the thread title was very different - it was about appreciating betsy.

do you dispute this ? the post is still there.

such posting is cowardly and creepy. and as long as i see the pattern, i will expose it. it is your problem that you happened to be the one.

 

[JRTinMA]

as expected you are confused and disoriented because your pretending was exposed...

cowardly and creepy was is and still remains to allude to mike andersn being armstrong's drug mule. you made the remark and disappeared. never attempted to apologize or even pretend that there was misunderstanding.

do you dispute that you did not make the cowardly and ugly allegation ?
the post is still there.

cowardly and creepy was to suddenly appear from nowhere and call betsy that she is married to a doper when the thread title was very different - it was about appreciating betsy.

do you dispute this ? the post is still there.

such posting is cowardly and creepy.

You are ignorant to the Mike A thing completely, Mike and I exchanged messages and its done. Again showing you're limited. Betsy labeled Frankie mostly clean and I explained to her he was a doper and a cheat. He even said he no problem with it in texts to JV. Proving my point nobody cared about cleaning up the sport just bringing LA down. Again I have put you in your place, now move along troll. I'm done with you.