Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[hrotha]

I don't think anything has changed. Only thing that has changed is the doping they take.

Which is a HUGE factor, at least when comparing Armstrong's times to LeMond's.

 

[webbie146]

Which is a HUGE factor, at least when comparing Armstrong's times to LeMond's.

Oh I thought we where talking about the current era, I understand you now.

 

[spalco]

Which is a HUGE factor, at least when comparing Armstrong's times to LeMond's.

Well, just to play devil's advocate: direct comparisons to Lemond aren't that relevant to Armstrong's argument here (even if he's going that way himself). The question is: "Did Armstrong dope more/better than his contemporary rivals?" And if the answer is not "yes" (which it is!), then his "victories" would retain a certain amount of legitimacy.

 

[Miburo]

So Armstrongs says that you can't win the tour without doping even in this time?

I'm sure someone else already made this reasoning but just in case.

Armstrong wanted to win the tour of 2009 but according to him it's impossible to do without doping. Yet armstrong denies to have used doping in 2009 and 2010?

 

[JRTinMA]

So Armstrongs says that you can't win the tour without doping even in this time?

I'm sure someone else already made this reasoning but just in case.

Armstrong wanted to win the tour of 2009 but according to him it's impossible to do without doping. Yet armstrong denies to have used doping in 2009 and 2010?

The reporter released a screen shot to show armstrong said "in his time". He failed to include that in the article.

 

[rhubroma]

His victimization act is just pathetic, as he conveniently forgets to mention exactly how ruthless he was in pursuing anyone who threatened his house of cards, some of whom he even destroyed. While his claims that the US Postal team wasn't on a sophisticated doping program is the real bullsh!t. To the victimization performance, how can he forget that numerous of his rivals fell while he kept doping and winning with impunity?

He should also confess to always having been on the latest drug of choice or treatment, before anyone else on the team was and then when they caught up he had already moved on. Hell he had Dr. Ferrari, who was the best in the business. The others were playing catch-up in Spain. Then there's still the fact that he used the cancer community as a shield against his doping and received protection by the UCI. Oh, but wait, none of that is important.

On the other hand his digs at the system are well delivered, ironic though this be.

 

[coinneach]

I wonder what Brian Cookson will feel about Lance endorsing him rather than Pat

 

[melkemugg]

Armstrong pretty harsh against UCI. He even seemed somewhat moderate about his hopes on Brian Cookson and only referred to him as an "refreshing alternative", and was quick to add that it will still not change. More drastic measures are in need for UCI and maybe the Armstrong are one of the best witnesses of just that.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

I love it - it sounds like Lance is ready to fell Pat & Co at the UCI.
About time too.

 

[DirtyWorks]

I love it - it sounds like Lance is ready to fell Pat & Co at the UCI.
About time too.

I'm looking forward to it!

But, let's be clear. The motivation would be to restore Armstrong's own sense of glory. He hasn't changed, so he's still the champion he's always imagined himself being.

According to his world view, it's all us idiots who don't understand how he got railroaded or whatever excuse he's using. That's the disconnect he would try to address. In his world view, it's our fault we're so stupid as to believe the commonly told story.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I found him saying Ferrari was working with ONCE interesting. Hope he can back it up.

And why was that not found out at the Bologna raid at the time?

 

[Pazuzu]

I'm looking forward to it!

But, let's be clear. The motivation would be to restore Armstrong's own sense of glory. He hasn't changed, so he's still the champion he's always imagined himself being.

According to his world view, it's all us idiots who don't understand how he got railroaded or whatever excuse he's using. That's the disconnect he would try to address. In his world view, it's our fault we're so stupid as to believe the commonly told story.

I'm looking forward to it too, regardless of his motivations.

I don't think Armstrong is going to ever win back the general public. 1) the general public don't know much about the UCI leadership and really care one way or the other. Armstrong taking Pat and Hein out won't register with them. 2) Armstrong has done irrevocable damage to his image from the years of angry and adamant denials - the public doesn't like being lied to and played as fools. His credibility is nil. People will now assume the worst as to his motivations concerning all future actions.

Nonetheless, Armstrong could do some good by further exposing the corruption and fraud that's been pervasive in cycling over that past 20+ years.

 

[melkemugg]

I'm looking forward to it!

But, let's be clear. The motivation would be to restore Armstrong's own sense of glory. He hasn't changed, so he's still the champion he's always imagined himself being.

According to his world view, it's all us idiots who don't understand how he got railroaded or whatever excuse he's using. That's the disconnect he would try to address. In his world view, it's our fault we're so stupid as to believe the commonly told story.

You can never change a sociopath but hopefully he can restore some kind of balance. I think hes happy to do a lot of right and stir up UCI as long as his worldview about himself as a winner in life or whatever is still intact. He will only care for himself anyways, its just how he choses to do it.

To be honest i was more pessimistic about his intentions around the time he came out on friggin Oprah (!). He at least seem more intent on taking the system down with him now. For me, thats a positive thing.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Nonetheless, Armstrong could do some good by further exposing the corruption and fraud that's been pervasive in cycling over that past 20+ years.

But, the problem is he can't tell the truth. It runs counter to his own sense of personal glory. Best case, you'd get little bits of stories perhaps about his perceived enemies.

The stories would do nothing because the UCI answers to no authority but their own and Wonderboy would be trying to shape himself as a sympathetic character, which everyone BUT him knows he's not.

Look at his quote about doping as a requirement for a grand tour podium. It is an admission his 2009/10/whatever results were as fraudulent as the rest. Any little attempt at truth damages every attempt to restore his glory.

 

[DirtyWorks]

You can never change a sociopath but hopefully he can restore some kind of balance.

You are being too charitable. You can't restore something he's never had. He hasn't changed a bit, and the situation might not get much worse for the guy. So, where's the external motivation for him to change? However, it would be fun watching the guy flail around trying to bring down his enemies.

Sadly, I see ridiculous comments regularly about Lemond "coming from nowhere" and such from very, very likely new/young cycling enthusiasts. My hope is people don't forget and the legend of his fraud spans generations.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Can someone please tell that piece of ****, Lance Armstrong, to just **** off? What a cunt he is.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Can someone please tell that piece of ****, Lance Armstrong, to just **** off? What a cunt he is.

He has a c*nt too??....then he is a snake obviously according to Paulie Walnuts . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMwdXvvo8Rc

 

[melkemugg]

You are being too charitable...

So, where's the external motivation for him to change?

Charitable? At least im not wasting time and energy being bitter and hate on him. Im trying to be pragmatic about the whole thing, i guess.

His motivation? Press releases. Attention. Headlines. He can still be a superstar. Rock'n Roll superstar doper. Im sure hes capable of telling the truth, but i agree, it would be impossible to believe him unless he comes up with hard evidence to back it up.

 

[H2OUUP2]

....it would be impossible to believe him unless he comes up with hard evidence to back it up.

Anyone else see the irony in that?

 

[DirtyWorks]

Charitable? At least im not wasting time and energy being bitter and hate on him. Im trying to be pragmatic about the whole thing, i guess.

Bitterness and hatred? No. If you were being pragmatic, the conclusion any rational person reaches who has been around the sport's periphery for decades is he hasn't changed a bit since his amateur days.

It sounds like you would give him the opportunity to somehow rehabilitate himself, as would I. But, that new testament lesson of forgiveness and "turn the other cheek" would never end well. A character like Armstrong metaphorically beats you senseless while you are busy forgiving him and tending to your metaphorical wounds. It's who he is.

Finally, let's dream the guy spontaneously develops a conscience. There's no scenario where Armstrong imparts some real truths without implicating himself in white collar crimes.

 

[melkemugg]

It sounds like you would give him the opportunity to somehow rehabilitate himself, as would I. But, that new testament lesson of forgiveness and "turn the other cheek" would never end well. A character like Armstrong metaphorically beats you senseless while you are busy forgiving him and tending to your metaphorical wounds. It's who he is.

You dont read what i write, but anyways; i have never talked about forgiving. I have never talked about turning the other cheek. Im talking about making use of him. Not lock him up in a cage and try to pretend it never happened. I dont think we LEARN anything from that.

 

[Zweistein]

I guess he thinks if you say something enough times people will beleive it. Up until recently, it was working perfectly. Now people would beleive the opposite of anything he says.

 

[DirtyWorks]

You dont read what i write, but anyways; i have never talked about forgiving. I have never talked about turning the other cheek. Im talking about making use of him. Not lock him up in a cage and try to pretend it never happened. I dont think we LEARN anything from that.

I misunderstood. I do that more often than I like.

The problem with engaging Armstrong is he is a cunning manipulator. Assistance would be understood by him to be a stage to teach the idiots beneath him that believe forces "railroaded" him. Again, it's who he is. Look at the post above this one. That should be sufficient evidence of his world view.

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

I misunderstood. I do that more often than I like.

The problem with engaging Armstrong is he is a cunning manipulator. Assistance would be understood by him to be a stage to teach the idiots beneath him that believe forces "railroaded" him. Again, it's who he is. Look at the post above this one. That should be sufficient evidence of his world view.

IMHO he has nothing to add, nothing new, maybe a few anecdotes of corruption. Whether or not he talks I really don't give a crap. He is FOS, always was always will be.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Lance Armstrong ‏@lancearmstrong 1h
Appreciated the opp 2 speak 2 @StephaneMandard from @lemondefr however didn't appreciate the twisting of my words. Sorry for the confusion.