Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[frenchfry]

Granted he did. Mind you though he'd seen a Federal investigation get closed down, lawsuits from LA and machinations through political lobbying to get USADA's funding cut. No wonder he had an axe to grind!

Not to mention death threats.

 

[eleven]

Granted he did. Mind you though he'd seen a Federal investigation get closed down, lawsuits from LA and machinations through political lobbying to get USADA's funding cut. No wonder he had an axe to grind!

Indeed. One day Tygart could write a hell of a book about the challenges and threats he faced conducting the investigation.

All things considered, he's been fairly gentle with that grinding ax.

 

[thehog]

Indeed. One day Tygart could write a hell of a book about the challenges and threats he faced conducting the investigation.

All things considered, he's been fairly gentle with that grinding ax.

Yes, he was very gentle with those Garmin riders. Tommy D should be praised for the way he delt with his doping that only started at USPS. Before that he was clean. Clean as they come. He was forced to dope by Armstrong. Tommy D? Yes! Him! How could they

 

[Gavandope]

Indeed. One day Tygart could write a hell of a book about the challenges and threats he faced conducting the investigation.

All things considered, he's been fairly gentle with that grinding ax.

Only thing I disagree with him about is the length of the ban. If he tells all, shops the whole system and tucks the UCI conspirators it should be commuted to 2-4 years. He knew far more about other teams programs than anyone. Can't see him doing it though even though it would be his greatest ever gift to the sport. Narcissists don't tell all sadly - they like to control the message no matter what.

 

[RownhamHill]

When you're right, you're right, and I think you're right. In the context of your quoted material, it does appear it was "that SPORT," and not "THAT sport." I took the quote from a more limited context, which did not provide the context your quoted material provided. My bad for not researching more.

I stand corrected.

Good post Chewie.

 

[sittingbison]

Gentle(wo)men,
Its getting a little tiresome requesting you desist from personal attacks and insults.

Next time it will involve a ban, and anyone responding or joining in or squabbling will get the same sanction.

Shoot the message but not the messenger

Cheers
Bison

 

[MarkvW]

Granted he did. Mind you though he'd seen a Federal investigation get closed down, lawsuits from LA and machinations through political lobbying to get USADA's funding cut. No wonder he had an axe to grind!

No doubt that Tygart slayed a most formidable dragon.

 

[Jack Ruby]

The standard is clear.

If any sentence within the 1000+ page reasoned decision can be interpreted as an exaggeration or having bias, Lance Armstrong should be exonerated.

Armstrong's genius and artistry is not properly understood or appreciated.

Take "never tested positive":
Deceptive phrasing so he can still suggest he did not dope while speaking the truth.

In this case, the half truth is a lie as well.
A lie within a deception. A snake eating its tail.

 

[Scott SoCal]

The standard is clear.

If any sentence within the 1000+ page reasoned decision can be interpreted as an exaggeration or having bias, Lance Armstrong should be exonerated.

Armstrong's genius and artistry is not properly understood or appreciated.

Take "never tested positive":
Deceptive phrasing so he can still suggest he did not dope while speaking the truth.

In this case, the half truth is a lie as well.
A lie within a deception. A snake eating its tail.

Yes, a virtual riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Only thing I disagree with him about is the length of the ban. If he tells all, shops the whole system and tucks the UCI conspirators it should be commuted to 2-4 years. He knew far more about other teams programs than anyone. Can't see him doing it though even though it would be his greatest ever gift to the sport. Narcissists don't tell all sadly - they like to control the message no matter what.

There's no if. He's not telling all. He's not even the most important figure in the fraud. (Thom, Hein, Pat) He's the most visible though.

 

[Gavandope]

There's no if. He's not telling all. He's not even the most important figure in the fraud. (Thom, Hein, Pat) He's the most visible though.

I agree it's a big if and the odds of him doing it are tiny. From all the USADA stuff, Tyler and landis words seem to imply he knew an awful lot about other teams never mind just at the top of USA cycling and the UCI.

Hopefully he's already started with testimony to Cookson's lot but I'm assuming he will drip feed the information he thinks will get his ban shortened and no more. He could really redeem himself in many eyes if he scorched the earth and blew the whole thing apart. Nuke cycling's cancer with his chemo bomb at a stroke and go from zero to this time a legitimate hero. The whistleblower lawsuit will wither away quite quickly and he gets to keep his money. I would even back him having the 7 yellows back too for 'really really coming clean'

If you're reading this lance - ffs "just do it" you won't regret it. The truth always sets you free.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Hopefully he's already started with testimony to Cookson's lot ..

Apparently met with some of Cookson's folks who are sympathetic to Wonderboy's ban being reduced. Maybe I'm not remembering the story correctly.

Any testimony will go something like this, "I'm a cycling champion and USADA unfairly gave me a totally inappropriate sanction... You know I'm a champion. I know I'm a champion. Work that for me, will ya?" Ignoring the fact he was the face of the fraud and relentlessly, almost pathologically pursued his critics. And then there's the problem of Bach stating the lifetime ban is appropriate.

There's no "if." Whatever redeeming event you are looking for won't happen. He's not changed a bit.

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

I agree it's a big if and the odds of him doing it are tiny. From all the USADA stuff, Tyler and landis words seem to imply he knew an awful lot about other teams never mind just at the top of USA cycling and the UCI.

Hopefully he's already started with testimony to Cookson's lot but I'm assuming he will drip feed the information he thinks will get his ban shortened and no more. He could really redeem himself in many eyes if he scorched the earth and blew the whole thing apart. Nuke cycling's cancer with his chemo bomb at a stroke and go from zero to this time a legitimate hero. The whistleblower lawsuit will wither away quite quickly and he gets to keep his money. I would even back him having the 7 yellows back too for 'really really coming clean'

If you're reading this lance - ffs "just do it" you won't regret it. The truth always sets you free.

My take is Lance has little to say that hasn't been already said. He may embellish some things to give the impression there is more but I doubt it. He could have come clean up front and had the same deal as the others but he went to war and now sulks because he gambled it all and lost it all.

The other and maybe more important point is that whenever he opens his mouth, he lies. Under oath, on TV, to the press, to anyone listening. So anything he spills to the UCI crew will never ever be truthful, unless that truth serves him better than a lie. The lies have worked pretty good until recently.

Narcissistic hubris. Deadly.

 

[Gavandope]

Apparently met with some of Cookson's folks who are sympathetic to Wonderboy's ban being reduced. Maybe I'm not remembering the story correctly.

Any testimony will go something like this, "I'm a cycling champion and USADA unfairly gave me a totally inappropriate sanction... You know I'm a champion. I know I'm a champion. Work that for me, will ya?" Ignoring the fact he was the face of the fraud and relentlessly, almost pathologically pursued his critics. And then there's the problem of Bach stating the lifetime ban is appropriate.

There's no "if." Whatever redeeming event you are looking for won't happen. He's not changed a bit.

I can't disagree with any of that - it's a damn shame cos true redemption will not only save him millions but salvage his reputation. A total blind spot for a narcissist is the complete and utter truth I know only too well from experience...

 

[mrhender]

My take is Lance has little to say that hasn't been already said. He may embellish some things to give the impression there is more but I doubt it. He could have come clean up front and had the same deal as the others but he went to war and now sulks because he gambled it all and lost it all.

The other and maybe more important point is that whenever he opens his mouth, he lies. Under oath, on TV, to the press, to anyone listening. So anything he spills to the UCI crew will never ever be truthful, unless that truth serves him better than a lie. The lies have worked pretty good until recently.

Narcissistic hubris. Deadly.

Lance's truth probably is -That he won those Tours fair and square....
Now he's already lost so much that it's too hard to voluntarily let go of more...

I would characterize him as a guy who suffers from pathological gambling.

In his field of course...

Compulsive gamblers keep gambling whether they’re up or down, broke or flush, happy or depressed. Even when they know the odds are against them, even when they can’t afford to lose, people with a gambling addiction can’t “stay off the bet.”

http://psychcentral.com/disorders/pathological-gambling-symptoms/

EDIT: Having pushed the envelope, why not put the rest on zero for one last spin?

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Excellent work all of you! I think we are finally arriving at the definitive conclusion of this essential subject. This will certainly overshadow the discovery of the Higgs boson in importance to mankind.

Don't know if you checked, and maybe it's a reading comprehension thing, but this isn't the "Higgs boson thread," this is the " Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)"...maybe if you want to discuss particles and stuff, go there.

Cheers!

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Good post Chewie.

Thanks Hog!

 

[MonkeyFace]

The standard is clear.

If any sentence within the 1000+ page reasoned decision can be interpreted as an exaggeration or having bias, Lance Armstrong should be exonerated.

Armstrong's genius and artistry is not properly understood or appreciated.

Take "never tested positive":
Deceptive phrasing so he can still suggest he did not dope while speaking the truth.

In this case, the half truth is a lie as well.
A lie within a deception. A snake eating its tail.

What are you talking about? Have you listened to his taped testimony or what he said on CNN? He is flat out guilty of perjury. There is no genius or art.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Zad68VOxr8g#t=21

 

[thehog]

Thanks Hog!

Reduced ban?

7-time Super Frog winner coming right up!

 

[Bosco10]

What are you talking about? Have you listened to his taped testimony or what he said on CNN? He is flat out guilty of perjury. There is no genius or art.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Zad68VOxr8g#t=21

Thanks. I haven't seen that hilarious supercut in awhile. It contains one of Lance's favorite blurbs from the old days, "I beat cancer. Do you think I would then juice-up just to win a bike race? No way!"

Here's another one of his old yakkity-yaks, "Extraordinary accusations require extraordinary proof!"
Say what you will about Tygart & USADA, they gave Lance exactly what he "asked" for.

 

[Granville57]

"Whoa...hey...c'mon little guy, don't tell me you dropped the sponsorship too!"

 

[Archibald]

My take is Lance has little to say that hasn't been already said. He may embellish some things to give the impression there is more but I doubt it. He could have come clean up front and had the same deal as the others but he went to war and now sulks because he gambled it all and lost it all.

The other and maybe more important point is that whenever he opens his mouth, he lies. Under oath, on TV, to the press, to anyone listening. So anything he spills to the UCI crew will never ever be truthful, unless that truth serves him better than a lie. The lies have worked pretty good until recently.

Narcissistic hubris. Deadly.

careful using that word...

 

[Race Radio]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...strong-lie-an-open-letter-to-greg-lemond.html

Mark McKinnon, Livestrong board member and former Armstrong adviser, apologizes to Greg LeMond.

I was complicit in pushing the myth. And all I really knew about you was what I heard through Lance, Inc. I don’t have to tell you it was not flattering.

 

[D-Queued]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...strong-lie-an-open-letter-to-greg-lemond.html

Mark McKinnon, Livestrong board member and former Armstrong adviser, apologizes to Greg LeMond.

That's big, and big of him.

Dave.

 

[thehog]

That's big, and big of him.

Dave.

Sounds like he enjoyed the ride

https://blog.livestrong.org/2013/06...lic-relations-professionals-of-the-year/kmc2/