Official thread - TdF Stage 4: Team Time Trial (Montpellier - Montpellier 38 km)

[dadoorsron]

Paulinho was "the chosen one", not Zubeldia... And I really don't see Klöden being able to keep up when the firework starts (my guess being Frank S, Menchov and Pellizotti to kick it off) friday.

I think Lance will wear yellow after fridays stage, unless Contador gets a green light to go for it.

Whats johans regular tactics in the peleton in the mountians. Ride a high tempo to shed the pretenders off. That's what going to happen Friday. Astana is going to set the pace and bam. there will only be a few left. Now if someone attacks then Contador and Armstrong will have to counter the attack. However, now if contador does go off it will be like An armstrong attack and Ullrich riding back to his wheel. Can't match the acceleration but, set a good tempo and bridge the gap.

Yes you are right about Paulinho. I should of looked at his blog again before a stuck the wrong guy with him.

oh to add Menchov crashed today and is 3:52 seconds down. I don't think he is a threat anymore. Unless, he was saving himself for the mountains.

 

[luckyboy]

The Schleck brothers didn't do anything.

The Schleck brothers are not very good at TTs, that's why

TTs are the worst thing about stage races [not including the D word]

 

[Franklin]

Just tried to point out the obvious fact that a TTT almost always has made big time differences in the beginning of the race. I saw a lot of posts whining about the tour being "over" and simply can't figure out, why people have to be so dark minded this soon in the race - since we haven't even met the first mountain yet...

Well, who is going to put time into Lance and AC? The only two climbers I can remotely think of are Andy Schleck and Carlos Sastre... and quite frankly I don't think they will be up to it. This will mean that the TdF is almost done.. it's AC or Lance, take your pick.

One of the reasons is that the Astana train will kill the competition by doing their good ole TGV action and smothering the legs of the climbers. After that AC will power away or AC will lead out for Lance (I fear for the second).

 

[worthydog]

That Lance Armstrong is quite a rider. I think he has an excellent chance to win this race. Maybe his popularity will bring some new fans to this sport. You have to admire his focus and talent. Sometimes I think he is the only one out there who really wants it.

 

[dadoorsron]

The Schleck brothers are not very good at TTs, that's why

TTs are the worst thing about stage races [not including the D word]

I think the TT's are the most exciting part of the race outside of Mountain top finishes. I know every stage has a purpose and three weeks is a long time but, nothing like a race against the clock. Contenders become pretenders really quick.

Oh about the Schleck brothers. I still think both of those guys are a few years away. It's not a replay of non Armstrong tours. A long brake away will not go and the winner of that stage will win the tour. That's the only way at this moment I think the schleck brothers could pull out a tour win. Tour tactics have been much different since armstrong left. The tactics will return and breakaways will not get 15 minutes out unless its riders with 30 minutes off the podium.

 

[Publicus]

A fractured team I don't really think so. Astana is built from old Discovery, and postal squad. Levi, Popo, Paulinho,ex teammates and Kloden are friends with Armstrong. Haimar Zubeldia is the only loyal teammate Contador has because he was handpicked by Contador,(after reading Horners blog after his snub from the team.) The rest of the guys probably can see who is the leader just by actions from the last two days. Taking the longest pulls in TTT and being tactically smart yesterday. At the end of the TTT today Contador is the only one that avoided Armstrong and all the other riders gave armstrong a hug! Team Unity? I think the Millionaire that is not getting paid to be there is winning over the teammates.

Now the notion Contador will attack would be interesting. I don't think Johan would allow that. Now if Armstrong does get dropped I can see the go ahead and the leadership role would become more contador's then armstrong. Stage 7 will be interesting. I feel Astana will set the pace and all the pretenders will fall off. The select group will ride to the finish. That group will be only 7-10 riders. I'm thinking 3 Astana riders will be there. Armstrong, Kloden, Contador. Levi has been top form for the entire season. I don't know whats in the fuel tank. He has impressed me before so we'll see. The Tour is not won in stage seven but it can become harder to win! Others in the group may be one schleck, sastre, and I don't think evans will be there.

If Contador counter-attacks a Shcleck attack (or Menchov or Evans) you really don't think JB is going to tell him to sit up are you? As I said earlier, Lance took advantage of a race situation yesterday. If similar situation presents itself in the mountains, I expect Contador or Lance or BOTH to try and take advantage of it. But I don't expect Contador will be on a short leash . . . and frankly even if JB WANTED to keep him on one it won't work. The mountains are his advantage, he has to exploit the opportunities as they present themselves.

 

[Azdak6]

From our armchairs maybe! I may have watched a few stages (understatement) on TV, and even waved an inflatable kangaroo from the side of the Champs Elysees last year, but I recall seeing footage of Robbie in green clinking champagne glasses at the end of the tour with some guy wearing yellow a couple of years back...

I don't happen to think he's right, but somehow I can believe there might be things you learn as an insider that gives you more (or at least different) insight than following on the forum or Eurosport. Even if he's not riding this year, do you really believe he doesn't have friends in the race keeping him in the loop about who is going well behind the scenes?

Having said all that, he doesn't come across as the sharpest tool in the shed in terms of mental faculties, so who really knows?

I just thought it was amusing--it just struck me that McEwen would have had little chance of ever seeing real Tour contenders in the heat of battle. No disrespect intended.

Sometimes these random statements are unintentionally funny as hell. Several years ago Stanford played Notre Dame for the NCAA women's bball championship. Stanford has a player whose last name was Seaman. At one point, an ND player missed a shot and the announcer stated that she missed the shot because she had "Seaman in her face".

I was watching the womens pole vault at the Bislett Games Sunday night. As Yelena Isinbayeva was making one of her jumps, the announcer commented that, because of her height, "Yelena can ride a bigger pole than the other girls". You can't make that stuff up.

It helps pass the time while waiting to see which kenyan/ethiopian will jog for 12 min then run a 53 sec last lap to win the 5K.

 

[Baggins27]

Andy Schleck is only 1:41 down to LA and 1:22 to Contador. This isn't over yet. Not by a long shot.

I completely agree. Long long way to go yet and we are yet to see how Lance does when the moutains arrive.

As for it being "dull". It's anything but dull. Even if Astana win it (and I don't agree they have it in the bag after four stages!) there is still interest in exactly WHO wins it. There is still interest who wins the stages and the excitement of each one. There is still interest in who takes the green jersey and who wins the KOM and who wins the white jersey.

Its the Tour. Enjoy it rather than trying to write it off so soon.

 

[luckyboy]

There is still interest in who takes the green jersey

If Cavendish withdraws, maybe

 

[Baggins27]

If Cavendish withdraws, maybe

That made me laugh.

But as you imply, he has to make it to Paris to win it. While I think he can do it, it's not a certainty. His climbing has improved but has it improved enough?

 

[dadoorsron]

If Contador counter-attacks a Shcleck attack (or Menchov or Evans) you really don't think JB is going to tell him to sit up are you?

Counter attacks yes if armstrong can't go I think the two will be attached at the hip. Team tactics will play a role in who goes or pace will say who can go.
The tour will not be like the last 4. No big break aways that allows someone to get a large lead or to be able to crawl back into the race. So a Landis like effort will never happen. Taking back over ten minutes on the leaders. Sastre's run last year more then likely will not happen. Rasmussen solo would never happen in a Lance Armstrong lead Peleton. I know riders have gotten off the front and took over the Yellow but, it wasn't like they ever had a chance to keep it.

I don't think Evans or Menchov are in the running at this moment. Menchov being 3:52 down and evans is at 2:59 Evans never showed well in the mountains stayed with the big boys but when the pace heated up he dropped. If stage one effort reflects Menchov form he is finished.

 

[Azdak6]

The last few years, the Tour was always exciting, after 7 boring Lance years.

Now Lance is back and...immediately the Tour is killed again after 4 stages. Armstrong (and his teams) are always strong, and I respect that, but it kills all excitement. Contador/Armstrong/Leipheimer/Klöden (take your pick) wins the Tour and the rest plays no role.

A. Schleck: at 2:30
Evans: 3 minutes
Sastre: 3.30
Menchov: 4 minutesn

Goodbye Tour de France 2009

Yeah, nothing more exciting than watching a group of top(?) contenders looking at each other with blank faces while a second-tier guy goes up the road one time and wins the whole thing. Or the thrilling exploits of Patron Pereiro in 2006.

Every Tour has it's own character. I wouldn't write this one off just yet.

 

[pmcg76]

Astana are the strongest GC team I have ever seen in a Tour over 25 years of following the race, nobody is going to ride away from them, Sastre done it last year because he had the yellow in his team already so it was totally tactical. Astana are the stongest team period, if the strongest riders are at the top of the GC going into the mountains, things never change much. The only favourite I really remember cracking whilst leading was Ullrich in 98.

Maybe a two horse race after 4 days is interesting for some, not me. If Alberto outclimbs Lance at the weekend, Tour is over. Not a classic Tour. ASO never put another TTT in the Tour.

 

[Anonymous]

LOL, if its that troublesome for you, why dont you shut up and disappear for 3 weeks.

Because see, I am a fan all year long and post about the sport regularly unlike fanboy nation.

 

[Azdak6]

If it had not been for the TTT in 1989... Delgado would've won the tour.

Delgado never showed any championship form in 1989 IMO. He was only allowed to get a way on a couple of occasions because he was so far behind. Once he got close enough to be taken seriously, he never gained another second and Lemond almost caught him in the final TT.

Maybe things would have been different had he not lost the time being late for the prologue, but I don't think so.

 

[Anonymous]

i didnt used to think so, but since the tourists arrived im changing my opinion..

the events of this week are somehow making us all closer.. there is lots of strictly heterosexual man on man love starting..

It is nice to see hatchets buried and to begin to respect each other even if we disagree......I mean, certainly I am still an ***, but at least we can both respect that.....

 

[Azdak6]

You know, everybody has a right to participate here. What are the qualifications that distinguish you from others posting here? If you can't respect others' perspectives and opinions, you shouldn't post.

Some people still can't get over high school.

 

[Publicus]

Counter attacks yes if armstrong can't go I think the two will be attached at the hip. Team tactics will play a role in who goes or pace will say who can go.
The tour will not be like the last 4. No big break aways that allows someone to get a large lead or to be able to crawl back into the race. So a Landis like effort will never happen. Taking back over ten minutes on the leaders. Sastre's run last year more then likely will not happen. Rasmussen solo would never happen in a Lance Armstrong lead Peleton. I know riders have gotten off the front and took over the Yellow but, it wasn't like they ever had a chance to keep it.

I don't think Evans or Menchov are in the running at this moment. Menchov being 3:52 down and evans is at 2:59 Evans never showed well in the mountains stayed with the big boys but when the pace heated up he dropped. If stage one effort reflects Menchov form he is finished.

Maybe I don't understand what you are trying to say. If Contador is stronger he's not sitting back with Lance just because JB says so (which I don't think will happen). And Lance isn't leading the team or the peleton. This isn't Disco or 2005. I think that is going to be the difference. Contador isn't going to bury himself riding tempo for Lance. He has his own ambitions.

 

[Azdak6]

If Contador counter-attacks a Shcleck attack (or Menchov or Evans) you really don't think JB is going to tell him to sit up are you? As I said earlier, Lance took advantage of a race situation yesterday. If similar situation presents itself in the mountains, I expect Contador or Lance or BOTH to try and take advantage of it. But I don't expect Contador will be on a short leash . . . and frankly even if JB WANTED to keep him on one it won't work. The mountains are his advantage, he has to exploit the opportunities as they present themselves.

That's most likely how it will play out. For my own personal amusement, I would like to see everyone else hold back and force AC or LA to make a move at the end of the stage.

Ironic that it will most likely be riders from other teams that force the Astana leadership decision rather than the Astana DS.

 

[onepostfanboy]

Biggest loser

Another 1 post fanboy wonder thinking his opinion counts....how cute....

Because see, I am a fan all year long and post about the sport regularly unlike fanboy nation.

This is such a cop out. You get to hid behind a screen and sling insults at someone that just wants to be more involved with the dialogue and sport. Someone hops on board during the TDF is this makes you superior??

Do you really think your comments are original? Every BB has it's share of losers like you that gain their supposed superiority by picking on those that have less knowledge or experience. Not impressive.

 

[Snake8]

Rasmussen solo would never happen in a Lance Armstrong lead Peleton.

Actually it happened four years ago.

Some of you guys are so down on this race why do you even bother watching? IT IS STAGE 4!!!!!

If you really think the race is over feel free to go talk about the veulta in Alpe's thread...that is if you know what the vuelta is....

 

[Amsterhammer]

It is nice to see hatchets buried and to begin to respect each other even if we disagree......I mean, certainly I am still an ***, but at least we can both respect that.....

Don't sell yourself short, mate! An a s shole with a sense of humor!

Right, who's going to prepare tomorrow's stage?

 

[Parrot23]

I think it is going to be FAR more exciting. We may see some alliances between teams and A LOT of attacking in the mountains. Sitting on wheels won't cut it this year. They are going to have to DROP Astana and pick up minutes NOT seconds. It should be exciting.

I tend to agree.

Dekker_Tifosi, I thought it was all lost, too, but have reconsidered:

- Andy Schleck is at 1:40

- Van Velde at 1:16, with a lot of teammates thereabouts too (Millar and Wiggins are both much lighter, and on individual mountain stages might be able to help to a point)

- Kreuzinger at 1:31, with a strong team (and maybe Pellizotti can come alive).

Finally, we have Armstrong's ego vs. Contador's climbing (and a year of sleights/resentment and rage maybe).

Lots of potential for intrigue and team dissolution in the mountains, giving others opportunities. I just hope so

 

[Snake8]

It is nice to see hatchets buried and to begin to respect each other even if we disagree......I mean, certainly I am still an ***, but at least we can both respect that.....

I think of you more as an asshat, but agree completely...;-)

 

[Parrot23]

At the end of the TTT today Contador is the only one that avoided Armstrong and all the other riders gave armstrong a hug! Team Unity?

That is not correct. It keeps getting repeated (CN is incorrect on this). I saw Contador walk up and give Lance and high five and hug etc.

They are being civil, though we can't see if Lance is hogging the team at dinner time and isolating Contador (given he doesn't speak English).

Good sportmanship so far.